Valar Guild

August 29, 2010 Sunday Meeting

5pm EST (GMT - 5)
AIM: Valar Guild Meetingplace

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Transcript work by Ar-Pharazon and Varda.

 Attending: (7)
    AriehnV, ArPharazonV, Eonwe Valar, fladrifv/alwin0, galdorandwe, Menelvagor Valar, VardaValar1 (presiding)

Before-meeting:
Meeting begins
Membership:
    Arien-(V) is back from her holiday.
    Ecthelion-(V) is moving, so he'll be out of LotRO for a bit.
Web:
    Art: Luthien-(T)
    Games Site Mass Update: Eonwe is about to start emailing.
Gaming:
    SC2
    WoW
    LotRO
Tolkien:
    Arien-(V)'s report: the Festival in the Shire
    Menelvagor-(Valar): LARPing.
    RP: discussion tabled due to some RP'ers not present or just leaving.
    Varda-(Valar)'s topic: JRRT had certain ideals that were naturally a part of his creative work. Topic kept to just LotR for brevity.
After-meeting:
    More concerning the Elessar stone worn by Aragorn in the LotR.
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Before-meeting:
You have just entered room "valarguildmeetingplace."
VardaValar1 has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Aiya, Ar-Pharazon. :-)
ArPharazonV: Aiya!
galdorandwe has entered the room.
galdorandwe: woo hoo...Aiya.
VardaValar1: Aiya Galdor :-)
VardaValar1: I sent out invitations and hope that folks will notice and take them. : )
galdorandwe: I just happened to walk by my computer...not kidding.
VardaValar1: I believe you.
ArPharazonV: Aiya Galdor!
Eonwe Valar has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Door, pardon
VardaValar1: Aiya Eonwe :-)
Eonwe Valar: Heya
AriehnV has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Aiya Eonwe
ArPharazonV: Aiya Arien!
galdorandwe: Aiya Eonwe.
AriehnV: Aiya all :-)
galdorandwe: Aiya Ariehn.
VardaValar1: back
VardaValar1: Aiya Arien : )
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VardaValar1: Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo!
VardaValar1: Membership:
VardaValar1: We five made it to the meeting. Yay us! : )
fladrifv has entered the room.
alwin0 has entered the room.
fladrifv has left the room.
VardaValar1: Do any of you have anything you'd like to mention under Membership?
ArPharazonV: and there's 2 Fladrifs
AriehnV: aiya Flad :-)
alwin0: Aiya
ArPharazonV: and now there's 1?
alwin0: woops closed the wrong one
VardaValar1: My fault I invited both Flad and his alt.
galdorandwe: That's a quote from Frod to Gildor, isn't it? I read it about 4 onths ago, LOL
alwin0 has left the room.
fladrifv has entered the room.
fladrifv: Aiyata
VardaValar1: All set Flad? : )
galdorandwe: Starlight shines on us or something like that...
ArPharazonV: shine upon our meeting?
AriehnV: Gildor Inglorion to Frodo
ArPharazonV: something
VardaValar1: A star shines on the hour of our meeting, and yes. : )
AriehnV: a star shines on the hour of our meeting
galdorandwe: I need to up my geeek juice to keep up with this :-)
VardaValar1: Frodo shows that he knows some of the language and they say not to speak any secrets in front of him.
VardaValar1: Of course Frodo carries the biggest secret of all, adding to the amusement value.
galdorandwe: well put
VardaValar1: It's the sentence we generally use to start the meeting.
VardaValar1: If there is no membership news...?
galdorandwe: Since I typically wait until Tolkein talk to start, I understandably am out of that loop :-)
AriehnV: I am back from holiday (obviously) :-)
VardaValar1: Welcome back, Arien! : )
Eonwe Valar: Echtelion mentioned on the forum that he was moving.
VardaValar1: Thanks, Eonwe!
Eonwe Valar: He may have sporadic contact for a while.
VardaValar1: Checking it out now.
VardaValar1: Indis is traveling and also has some difficulty in contact.
Eonwe Valar: HIs exact message "Well, off to a new place. So my net's not gonna be consistent for awhile. Those who know me know I'm new and play LotrO a decent bit. I'll try and check in when I can, but I can't promise anything until I get settled down again. "
VardaValar1: Ecthelion is showing one of the most important uses of the forum. : )
Eonwe Valar: :}
VardaValar1: and we can all well-wish him as Eonwe has done.
VardaValar1: Any other membership news?
VardaValar1: AuStein is back in Boston.
ArPharazonV: "Bend at the knees when lifting, and not through your back", something like that? :-)
VardaValar1: Aye, that's pretty much what Eonwe said. : )
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VardaValar1: Web:
Art:
VardaValar1: Luthien has been busy painting.
VardaValar1: Her cave is now reorganized, as she has quite a few different types of items, and because of her request.
VardaValar1: It now includes some of her new paintings.
VardaValar1: Some of the larger ones will be up later, but thumbnails are visible, and a couple of the larger ones.
VardaValar1: http://valarguild.org/varda/Tolkien/encyc/art/gallery/LuthienTV/caveLuthienTV.htm
VardaValar1: The new items are in the section called Menel Forodhren.
VardaValar1: Eonwe, do you have any more Web news?
Eonwe Valar: Games Site Mass Update is coming this week.
Eonwe Valar: E-mails should be sent out between the first and next Sunday.
VardaValar1: That soon? Tempus fugit.
VardaValar1: Thanks, Eonwe.
Eonwe Valar: I'd like to remind everyone to check for the e-mail between those days (Sept 1st and Next Sunday) and make sure it didn't end up in your junk mail.
VardaValar1: If you don't get the email, just email Eonwe with whatever your current games are. That lets him use the emails to help with the webwork, much better than quickly scribbled notes.
VardaValar1: Any further web news?
AriehnV: i love those paintings , they are great
VardaValar1: Luthien's on, if you'd like to send her an IM. She prefers one to one chat. : )
VardaValar1: luthienathariel
VardaValar1: She says she's right now putting up a new one about Gondolin, so we should be seeing that soon.
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VardaValar1: Gaming:
VardaValar1: Would anyone like to mention if they did any non-WoW, non-LotRO gaming this past week?
VardaValar1: Fladrif?
ArPharazonV: I've done some Starcraft II missions, not many, but some
VardaValar1: Cool. :-) I'll get that game yet! Lady of the Stars has to have it, of course. ;-)
Eonwe Valar: :}
ArPharazonV: Oh, and there's a patch underway for it
VardaValar1: Another one?
ArPharazonV: they've announced some features and bugfixes, looks good so far.. it's the first "major" patch, 1.1 I think
Eonwe Valar: Aye, patch 1.1
ArPharazonV: http://eu.battle.net/sc2/en/blog/554901 is the European version of the announcement, I'm sure there's an American one out there
Eonwe Valar: http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/blog/692221#blog
ArPharazonV: Also, in SCII, I unlocked my first new character portrait today *grin* Kate Lockwell!
ArPharazonV: may she be the first of many
ArPharazonV: 's all the news from me today
VardaValar1: Thanks, Phar. : )
Eonwe Valar: I got my Zeratul portrait for completing all the achievments in the Protoss missions. :}
VardaValar1: Grats : )
ArPharazonV: Grats!
ArPharazonV: None of those are gonna work for me. I'm still playing on Normal. So obviously can't do the hardmode achievements.
Eonwe Valar: You can redo the mission under any difficulty.
VardaValar1: I'm assuming Fladrif might have had time to play Second Life but seems to be afk.
ArPharazonV: But I'll get research and armory portraits next, I guess
ArPharazonV: yeah, I know, but I want to finish it on normal first, and hit all the feats of strength
Eonwe Valar: You don't have to restart the campaign to get credit for the hard difficulty achievements.
ArPharazonV: gonna do a new campaign on hard, since I haven't spent any upgrades or research yet, waiting with that for Char for some of those achievements
ArPharazonV: So if I replayed on hard now, I wouldn't have any upgrades ;-)
Eonwe Valar: From what I've heard there's only 2 feats of strength implemented, though it was on the SC2 fora, so we'll see if that holds true.
ArPharazonV: There's 5. Though one's not implemented yet it seems, coming with tournaments in bnet
Eonwe Valar: From what I can tell your new upgrades won't affect you replaying the mission anyway, Phar :}
ArPharazonV: and one's for the CE

VardaValar1: Moving on to WoW. Eonwe, do you have anything to tell us?
ArPharazonV: the other 3 however, are already doable
Eonwe Valar: Other than that I've been on a bit tihs week, seen others on, and have been trying to send Eowyn titanium ore to help her jewelcrafting, nothing much to tell.
Eonwe Valar: From my end.
VardaValar1: The Laytonrim do their runs, mostly heroics, some crafting. Fangorn is away for the next two weeks working so he won't be on much. Elwing has been on the Horde characters in Uldaman a good bit.
VardaValar1: Phar and Arien, you're still busy on WoW?
VardaValar1: I should have only called one of you, pardon.
ArPharazonV: yep, saw Arien again online this week
ArPharazonV: we talked a bit
VardaValar1: Nice : )
AriehnV: :-) yeah business as usual alting about and gearing up
ArPharazonV: personally, I'm not spending too much time in WoW at the moment besides a few daily quests and the evening raids, which is, I guess, still alot of time ;-)
ArPharazonV: getting closer to getting Lich King down on 25-man
VardaValar1: Classes are starting back up too. Cutting into time for some, giving time for others.
VardaValar1: Galdor will have less time, for instance.

VardaValar1: LotRO:
VardaValar1: We did our Monday and Wednesday instances. Monday was Forges, Wednesday was Fil Gashan.
VardaValar1: It's good to see that we are managing to keep those going regularly.
VardaValar1: Some have mentioned doing them more often, which we can without making it an officially scheduled event.
VardaValar1: If you're there, Galdor, will the time be better for you after school starts?
VardaValar1: 8pm EDT
VardaValar1: For unofficial runs, we can go anytime enough of us are on and just want to run. : )
VardaValar1: Any other gaming news?
AriehnV: Finarfin helped me finishing of the Barrow Hills quests on thursday i think it was
VardaValar1: Very good!
AriehnV: the elite trees
VardaValar1: (Don't listen, Fladrif!)
AriehnV: but need some barrow runs lol
AriehnV: GB i mean
VardaValar1: Arien, are you mostly on at about these meeting times or earlier?
AriehnV: i am usually on either on one of the weekday mornings , mostly wednesday or evenings after wow
AriehnV: i am on late shifts at the moment which is bad for scheduled runs
AriehnV: i work from 12 pm till 21 pm my time which really drains me
AriehnV: so not much good after that apart from with friends
VardaValar1: Great Barrows wouldn't be a scheduled run most likely, but some of us can get together and get you through it.
AriehnV: best befoe a day off i think :-)
VardaValar1: Scheduled runs are currently intended for high level runs since we have the most trouble getting together for those.
VardaValar1: I'd like to do a night for book runs and/or lowbie runs, but it's already tough to get people together for what we have.
VardaValar1: We can try to find a day or two more that people can come together.
AriehnV: alternate maybe? and if no lowbies are on u still can do your high run :-)
VardaValar1: Schedules will be changing for a lot of us.
VardaValar1: Alts are taking over a lot of the runs, aye. : )
VardaValar1: We already have too few times for high runs, but maybe we could do something "earlier" in the day.
AriehnV: Wednesday night would be a good chance or tomorrow night before your run
AriehnV: err thursday night sorry
VardaValar1: It helps to have one character that each of us tries to work up to cap, then alts for other fun.
AriehnV: i ll pop in after work and see who s on and maybe we can set something up
VardaValar1: Okie dokie.
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VardaValar1: On to Tolkien!
VardaValar1: JRRT showed a lot of high ideals in his work, one of the things that makes it stand out and a reason his fans seem to be some of the better people to have join our games.
VardaValar1: Ok, I apologize for getting excited about this topic and jumping in. Arien has something important to share with us first.
VardaValar1: Arien, please go ahead!
AriehnV: yes well sorry for butting in this way Varda, didnt want to stem your flow
VardaValar1: Quite alright, my error. Should've asked first. : )
AriehnV: all right :-)

Festival in the Shire:
AriehnV: if you maybe remember many moons ago somebody gave a link to the Festival in the Shire in Wales , so i decided to attend . this Festival was two weeks ago now and it happened :-)
AriehnV: It was set in a small village on the grounds adjoining a school and the village hall so we had a sports field , which they named the Fields of Pelennor.
AriehnV: That was the base of the LARP group . and a medival woodcrafter was close there as well
AriehnV: he made broooms, had a weaving loom and goblets and the like
AriehnV: then there was the Conference as the Council of Elrond
AriehnV: The location of the general fan event and the exposition was Halls of Meduseld
AriehnV: car park was Emyn Muil and the exit to village was The Grey Havens .. I really loved the naming
ArPharazonV: Hah. the car park... where everybody gets lost...
VardaValar1: lol
AriehnV: I myself attended the Exposition of Art works with original paintings from Alan Lee and the other Tolkien Illustrationists
VardaValar1: o wow
AriehnV: some personal memorabilia out of Tolkien's personal life, mainly medals from war, old book editions , fan articles following the film and a letter about the dispute after his Death
AriehnV: The Exposition talks got transmitted into the Exposition itself which i found great
AriehnV: so you could listen inside there while browsing the artworks
VardaValar1: JRRT's medals were there?
AriehnV: aye
AriehnV: I didnt spend too much time inside , since i was busy learning to fence and connecting with the larpers, the organisers and the press
VardaValar1: Which dispute after his death? Rights or storyline?
AriehnV: Rights
VardaValar1: So much to do, hehe.
VardaValar1: Thanks
AriehnV: But i did listen to the Grumpy old Lady
AriehnV: who quotedc almost word by word the Tale of Luthien and Beren
AriehnV: I was so impressed
AriehnV: by heart
VardaValar1: That's like the storytellers of ancient times. Fantastic.
AriehnV: She mixed up some names and drew some lines together , and introduced the characters
AriehnV: but she did it with great humour
AriehnV: YOu would have loved her :-)_
VardaValar1: For sure. : )
AriehnV: I also listened to a bit of music
AriehnV: Mario di Marcio , some Tolkien inspired piano pieces
AriehnV: and a lady singer who had a great voice but i forgot her name
VardaValar1: Might say on their website.
AriehnV: In the afternoon i particapated at a Quiz where i teamed up with a very knowledgeable girl called cat
AriehnV: Cat
AriehnV: we got 26/27 right :-)
ArPharazonV: so what was the 27th? ;-)
VardaValar1: Impressive.
AriehnV: Meh we got one wrong , lets see if u know :-) Who was the goblin warchief in the Battle of Fife Armies>?
ArPharazonV: hmm, was that Azog?
ArPharazonV: either him, or his son....
AriehnV: *giggles*
AriehnV: we fell in that trap
AriehnV: it was his son Bolg
ArPharazonV: Ahh yes, Azog was the dad.
ArPharazonV: should just remember A = father, B = son
VardaValar1: I knew it was the son, but the name was beyond me.
AriehnV: wow
AriehnV: i am impressed
VardaValar1: I'd have missed it too.
AriehnV: You dont know something :-D
ArPharazonV: I knew it was the son, yes, but I didn't remember if Azog was the father or the son.
VardaValar1: Nice mnemonic device, Phar!
AriehnV: indeed
AriehnV: Else my main activity was bashing about with my knife against long sword and quarter staff (in costume with a borrowed coat) and hiding latex knives at the traders
AriehnV: So the "militia" could buy them and the "villains " mug them
VardaValar1: Sounds uneven but fun!
AriehnV: Later in the afternoon we had the inevitable skirmish where the "miltia" won of course
AriehnV: but was a lot of fun
AriehnV: You bond after a bit of fighting together
AriehnV: and the adrenaln kicks in
VardaValar1: So true about the bonding. : )
Menelvagor Valar has entered the room.
Menelvagor Valar: Aiya!
AriehnV: Unfortunately i could only stay one day , on the first day but i hope i can attend more next year
ArPharazonV: Aiya Menel
AriehnV: Aiya Menel :-)
VardaValar1: Aiya Menelvagor. : )
AriehnV: You just missed my report from the Festival in the Shire , friend :-)
Menelvagor Valar: undoubtedly you had a really good time ^^
VardaValar1: But Arien will, of course, type up a report with pictures to be seen from the News page. ;-)
Menelvagor Valar: and I'll be sure to grab the transcript this week to read it :-)
AriehnV: but maybe you ' ll have a chance to get next year's .. i should like to see the diffrence to this year
AriehnV: since it was the first time there were a few hickups
VardaValar1: And a chance to see the parts you had to miss this year.
Menelvagor Valar: and a chance to miss other hickups you managed to miss ^^
AriehnV: Hehe
AriehnV: Not so many hickups for me i had the best time
Menelvagor Valar: I hear you :-)
AriehnV: I would have wished for a bit more Tolkien orientated LARP and bit more activity that direction
AriehnV: but the Larpers got stuck with the village and visitor boys
VardaValar1: That's a suggestion you could make for their next event.
AriehnV: I did
VardaValar1: Yay : )
AriehnV: I also suggested a seperate children ;s programme
VardaValar1: Lots of kids there I hope?
AriehnV: Aye fifteen at least from six to 14
VardaValar1: Good enough for a nice LARP of their own, aye.
AriehnV: that was friday , and saturday likely a lot more
AriehnV: But it was a great experience and a lot of fun
AriehnV: That's it from me :-)

Menel's LARPing:
VardaValar1 has left the room.
VardaValar1 has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: ....let's have a quick backup save, then
VardaValar1: Aiya, pardon.
Menelvagor Valar: it happens ^^
VardaValar1: I crashed when switching to see Menel's IM. He has a few words to say after Arien is done.
AriehnV: Menel your floor if u like :-)
Menelvagor Valar: Thanks ^^
Menelvagor Valar: well, basically I just popped in to say hi, as I am rather tired from a long weekend (since thursday until this afternoon) of LARP ^^
AriehnV: a fellow Larrper :-D ??
Menelvagor Valar: most assuredly.
VardaValar1: That's long!
Menelvagor Valar: Aye.
VardaValar1: LARP is fun. : )
VardaValar1: Sauron is also quite good at it. Beware. : )
VardaValar1: What kind of LARP, Menel?
Menelvagor Valar: regular :-)
Menelvagor Valar: so their own ruleset and all.
Menelvagor Valar: My character is a Priest of the Goddess of Nature, so Yavanna so to speak ^^
Menelvagor Valar: I haven't gotten it completely under control yet, most of the weekend I spent trying to switch from text-based / tabletop RPG to LARP.
Menelvagor Valar: which is annoyingly hard.
Menelvagor Valar: but I had loads of fun, and everyone there looked out for me and tried to help where they could, so it was really fun, entertaining and... uhm... word lost in translation :-P
ArPharazonV: share it, maybe we'll come up with something in English
Menelvagor Valar: Still have a lot to learn... such as increasing my stamina.... daarn :-)
Menelvagor Valar: and weapon skills :-)
VardaValar1: Try the SCA for training in weapon skills if you like. : )
Menelvagor Valar: I wasn't too shabby with my quarterstaff, but compared to some of the people there, my skill was quite... unimpressive :-P
Menelvagor Valar: SCA?
VardaValar1: Society for Creative Anachronisms
AriehnV: bah i had a bash with a knife against one of those
AriehnV: but i am a blooming noob Larp and weapon skills included
AriehnV: but was fun for sure
VardaValar1: http://www.sca.org/
ArPharazonV: that looks... quite interesting, I've always wanted to pick up one of those weaponskills as well
Menelvagor Valar: checking :-)
VardaValar1: They are about a lot more than weapons. Very old group. I've been a part of it.
VardaValar1: World-wide.
Menelvagor Valar: well, my character, as stubborn as I am, has got it into his head he wants to be a master of all weapons :-)
VardaValar1: Know something about all, but pick a main, I recommend.
Menelvagor Valar: which means... a lot of LARPing to gather the points to acquire those skills in character, and a lot of training to acquire those skills for real :-P
Menelvagor Valar: oh, my mains will be archery and quarterstaff.
VardaValar1: Quarterstaff, expect bruising. : ) But it's amazing.
VardaValar1: and be careful of the other folk.
Menelvagor Valar: using latex weapons of course :-)
VardaValar1: Do we want to end here or go into the original topic now? We can do that another day if you folks need to go to bed.
Menelvagor Valar: and thrusting and overhead attacks are not allowed to avoid accidents.
AriehnV: Still got a bit time
AriehnV: not too long tho#
Menelvagor Valar: I'll call it a day :-)
VardaValar1: Good night, Menel. : )
Menelvagor Valar: What was the original topic? ^^
AriehnV: Sleep Well , Menel :-)

RP:
ArPharazonV: did we want to discuss what comes next in the RP, or is there no urgency?
ArPharazonV: well, I guess there's no urgency, what's another week at this scale ;-)
Menelvagor Valar: even if there is urgency, I'd still be going to bed ^^
VardaValar1: Menel's leaving, so that's a problem.
ArPharazonV: true
ArPharazonV: but we wouldn't be complete even if he wasn't
Menelvagor Valar: anyways, it also means I will have to postpone my Valar / Greek Pantheon discussion again ^^
Menelvagor Valar: but I will have done my homework on that and be awake for it next week :-)
AriehnV: we can leave it another week ... but a quick mention, Finarfin might be willing to help out sometmes , but maybe discuss that with him in game , Varda
Menelvagor Valar: and with that, Namarie, sleep well and uhm... generally be well I guess :-)
galdorandwe: Can I introduce a Tolkein topic?
AriehnV: Namarie :-)
Menelvagor Valar has left the room.
VardaValar1: Galdor, are you saying you don't want to do the original topic?
VardaValar1: We had to put it on hold so Arien could do her report.
galdorandwe: I saw Beren and Luthien...is there more?
VardaValar1: That was not the original topic.
VardaValar1: Who is going to remain for a bit?
VardaValar1: I can stay.
ArPharazonV: I'll stay
AriehnV: i can stay for maybe half an hour
VardaValar1: Good enough.
VardaValar1: Eonwe?
galdorandwe: I can stay for a bit....Thanks go out to my right and honorable kinsman from Holland for remaining :-)
Eonwe Valar: Sorry, I got dragged from my computer for a few minutes.
VardaValar1: The original topic, from memory as I crashed out since then, was
ArPharazonV: :-)
Eonwe Valar: RP: I'm working on my response to Phar's post. Can't say much more than that because my research into authenticity may result in an article on Elves.

JRRT's ideals as shown in LotR:
VardaValar1: JRRT had certain ideals that were naturally a part of his creative work.
fladrifv: *moves a branchs and wakens up*
VardaValar1: They show up strongly in the Lord of the Rings.
VardaValar1: For instance, Hope.
VardaValar1: Arwen showed hope by making a standard for Aragorn for unfurling as the High King of Gondor and Arnor. It was also the requirement for her and Aragorn's marriage.
galdorandwe: Like, for instance, his and C.S. Lewis' strong connection to the Christian faith. I wonder how they would have like Phillip Pullman's books.
VardaValar1: Can you think of other examples of Hope?
VardaValar1: Aragorn's name, "Estel", meant Hope.
VardaValar1: He showed hope by distracting Sauron's forces from Frodo, although it might mean his death, in hope that Frodo could destroy the One Ring and save Middle-earth.
VardaValar1: Then there's Faith. Frodo had lost hope (and had lost Aragorn) but pushed on anyway in the faith that he would tqke the Ring as far as he could go, and that something would happen to finish the job.
ArPharazonV: the quest was a fool's hope :-)
VardaValar1: Those were Denethor's words, that Gandalf quoted.
ArPharazonV: *nod* I didn't remember the exact source
galdorandwe: Hope is a big factor in Tolkein's work that I believe syems, at least in part, from his and his brothers shared kidnapping and repeated ransoms with the Zulus. I recall at least 3 times, they were kidnapped...I wonder how much that played into Merry and Pippen's capture by the Uruks.
VardaValar1: Aye, an example. Gandalf was the one Denethor was calling a fool. And it was hope indeed.
VardaValar1: Charity: Sam's absolutely selfless aid to Frodo, without which the Ring would never have reached Mount Doom.
galdorandwe: Devotion comes to mind with respect to Sam's love for Frodoi.
AriehnV: Galadriel's gift to Frodo, the Light of Earendil captured in a chrystal , as a means to be a source of hope for him when all other lights go out
VardaValar1: Aye and aye.
AriehnV: the light as symbol of hope as well as physical and literal source
VardaValar1: Redemption: Boromir's worked out, but Gollum's didn't quite. Yet they had the chance if they could take it.
AriehnV: Tolerance - cooperation of the different races even if they had grudges against each other like Elves and dwarves
VardaValar1: aye : )
galdorandwe: We might be missing something here...
VardaValar1: Gandalf asked that Gimli and Legolas at least work together to help enter Moria, for instance.
VardaValar1: Then now is the time to fill it in.
VardaValar1: Arien-(Valar) earlier mentioned bonding from working together in fighting. The Fellowship certainly had that, and had bonding.
galdorandwe: Do you recall the Elendilmir? Do you also recall what it stood for?
AriehnV: any soldier will confirm that
VardaValar1: http://valarguild.org/varda/Tolkien/encyc/articles/e/Elendilmir.htm
VardaValar1: Go ahead and make your point, Galdor, but try to remember this topic was intended to be within the LotR.
ArPharazonV: I'd say it comes from any kind of lengthy personal cooperation, whether it's battle, or an expedition, or anything...
ArPharazonV: if you spend a lot of time in a group and have to work together, bonding comes naturally
VardaValar1: Aye, from shared experiences and overcoming difficulties together.
AriehnV: *nods*
fladrifv: I wished it worked like that :-)
VardaValar1: It can work like that.
VardaValar1: The Fellowship bonded, but it took some time.
ArPharazonV: *shrug* I bonded quite well with the students (who I'd never seen before) I spent 3 weeks in Spain with for our fieldwork. And you know me, Flad, I don't bond well offline.
fladrifv: true
VardaValar1: In the end, Aragorn had Merry and Pippin buried with him. Bonding shown there.
VardaValar1: Legolas, despite the sea-longing, waited until all had died but Gimli, to leave Middle-earth, and took Gimli to see Galadriel, for whom he had also felt a longing to see again.
ArPharazonV: Legolas taking Gimli along with him on his boat, also a good example.
ArPharazonV: hehe
VardaValar1: Great minds... ;-)
VardaValar1: The four hobbits worked together in the Shire against Saruman and crew, knowing they could count on each other.
VardaValar1: All of these are great ideals, and enrich those of us reading it, and resonate with us.
VardaValar1: We see examples of people reaching for them and falling short as well. But we see that they can be reached, although it may take heroic effort.
galdorandwe: It was rereading about it(the Elendilmir), coincidentally, in Unfinished Tales just yesterday :-). It was, if I am not mistaken, a gem that was originally made by Celebrimbor to remind one of things that live or green things that live, like plants and trees, when Hope might be waning...there are two mentioned...one that was in the 2nd age and one that Isildur "lost" and perhaps Saruman found and hid in Orthanc. It is also said that Aragorn gave Sam a "Star of Elendil" in the 4th age, but it was likely a copy...
VardaValar1: I've tried to stay within the time limit. Does anyone have anything else to add? I keep seeing Galdor typing but don't see the words.
VardaValar1: There's the typing. : )
http://valarguild.org/varda/Tolkien/encyc/articles/e/Elendilmir.htm  [Note: source of quote below]
VardaValar1: In RotK, The Elendilmir, "jewel of Elendil", was a gem called the Star of Elendil. It was a single white gem worn on the brow, held by a silver fillet, used by the Kings of Arnor who wore no crown.
VardaValar1: Are you also thinking of the Elessar stone?
ArPharazonV: the two gems, one made by Celembrimbor.. that reminds me of the Elessar as well
VardaValar1: http://valarguild.org/varda/Tolkien/encyc/articles/e/ElessarStone.htm
VardaValar1: Where is the reference in the UT that you're talking about again? I have the copy of the book here to look at.
VardaValar1: ahh index has a ton of pages on the Elendilmir if that helps.
VardaValar1: Mentions two jewels of that name.
galdorandwe: I stand corrected. You all have my apologies...it was the Ellesar stone I was referring to. I most humbly apologise.
AriehnV: well the Elessar stone has at least a very clear LotR relevance ;-)_
AriehnV: i would have made a very similar mistake and most likely would have messed up the name
galdorandwe has left the room.
AriehnV: and it cerainly is a symbol of hope
VardaValar1: The Elendilmir has a ton of interesting stuff under it and needs a better article.
galdorandwe has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Thanks for bringing it up. There's a lot here on the Elendilmir that is fascinating.
AriehnV: very fascinating indeed

AriehnV: and time for me to go sailing up the stairs
AriehnV: that Silpion threatens to chase me again#
VardaValar1: hehe
ArPharazonV: Namarie Arien :-)
VardaValar1: Don't get lost in the tunnels! : )
VardaValar1: Namarie for now. : )
VardaValar1: Looking forward to your news report and pics!
AriehnV: Namarie for now :-)
AriehnV: will get it typed and sent
VardaValar1: Thank you so much!
AriehnV has left the room.
galdorandwe: OK. I'm out of here tonight. I have 30k to get my very 1st toon to lvl 63 and intend to get there tonight. Thanks everyone for an educational discussion. I hope to quest with you all very soon in-game.
VardaValar1: Go go!
VardaValar1: I want a level on Tinwetari too. ;-)
ArPharazonV: good luck :-)
VardaValar1: See you in a bit!
galdorandwe: Namarie
galdorandwe has left the room.
VardaValar1: We have two articles that might come out of this meeting. One on Elves from Eonwe, and another one on the Elendilmir. : )
VardaValar1: A good night indeed!
VardaValar1: *bangs gavel*

VardaValar1: After-meeting!
fladrifv: hummms
ArPharazonV: hmmm?
VardaValar1: That big tree is humming!
fladrifv: the gavvel was close to me
ArPharazonV: you banged the gavel so hard you woke up the ent!
VardaValar1: It's a good gavel. : )
fladrifv: a truely quality bang
VardaValar1: hehe

VardaValar1: Galdor had a point about the hope shown with the Elessar Stone.
VardaValar1: Galadriel said, "...surely the Valar are now removed and Middle-earth is far from their thought, and all who cling to it are under a shadow."
VardaValar1: "It is not so," said Olorin. "Their eyes are not dimmed nor their hearts hardened. In token of which look upon this!"
VardaValar1: And he held before her the Elessar, and she looked on it and wondered.
VardaValar1: And Olorin said, "This I bring to you from Yavanna. Use it as you may, and for a while you shall make the land of your dwelling the fairest place in Middle-earth.
fladrifv: is light from the silmarils stored in the elessar?
VardaValar1: But it is not for you to possess. You shall hand it on when the time comes.
VardaValar1: For before you grow weary, and at last forsake Middle-earth one shall come who is to receive it, and his name shall be that of the stone; Elessar he shall be called."
VardaValar1: End quote.
fladrifv: ty for the quote :-)
VardaValar1: The light of the Sun, before it was impure.
VardaValar1: It was supposed to be the pure light of the Sun shining through leaves, thus the green color.
VardaValar1: Melkor dimmed the light of the Sun.

VardaValar1: This was fun, but I'm going to find a bite to eat, work on my LotRO minstrel, and do a few chores. : )
VardaValar1: Later!
VardaValar1 has left the room.
fladrifv has left the room.
ArPharazonV: saving and sending transcript
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