Valar Guild

October 22, 2023 Sunday Meeting

5:00 P.M. Eastern Time
Valar Guild/meeting_place

Back to News
Transcript work by Varda.
[times are Central Time from Varda's Discord. Add one hour for Eastern, which is Valar time and LotRO /servertime.]

Attending (and typed): (6)

rien, Ar-Pharazon, Eonwe, Pallando, Sandalf, Varda
Meeting begins
Membership news:

    World of Warcraft, Overwatch 2, Diablo 4, Diablo Immortal, Hearthstone, Lord of the Rings Online
    Topic: Some folks in LotRO say that Gollum's/Smeagol's people were of the early hobbits before they differentiated into the groups. Is this correct according to the books?
    A little more Tolkien chat
    (non) Flashgaming Reviews (plus) by Ar-Pharazon. Includes Blizzard games afterwards.
[Note: No report at this time. Phar was disconnected and did not return to the meeting. We think his connection was probably hit by a power outage from weather around storm Babet.]


Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 4:01 PM

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:03 PM

Varda — Yesterday at 4:04 PM
Aiya : )

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:04 PM

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:04 PM
Hey Eonwe - Heya sounds like something from Lakota Sioux. Is it?

Varda — Yesterday at 4:04 PM
Not on purpose.
[4:05 PM]
Common slang. : )
@Bounder @Guild-friend Aiya! It's time to come say hi, chat Tolkien and gaming, and just have a good time! Valar Guild Meeting Time that is. : )
[4:06 PM]
Be interesting if it turned out that was the originator though.


Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo!
[4:06 PM]


[4:07 PM]
Begging your pardon for being a tad tardy. Grabbed my supper plate and came up here, and the computer wasn't turned on yet. le oops.
Now we have Sandalf check out the Lakota Sioux language dictionaries. : )

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:08 PM
I attended a sweat lodge gathering with some Sioux friends back in 2014. They were trying to teach me some Lakota. A very difficult language. They claimed it was somewhat like German in that it had many cases...but there IS a food truck in Lincoln that sells Lakota food and it labelled "Heya Cooking."

Varda — Yesterday at 4:09 PM

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:09 PM
he he

Varda — Yesterday at 4:10 PM
: )

Pallando-Valar — Yesterday at 4:11 PM

Varda — Yesterday at 4:11 PM
Now we have to ask the food truck guy!
[4:12 PM]
Pallando! Heya : )

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:12 PM
When I get to Lincoln next time, I will try to locate the truck! Aiya Pallando!

Varda — Yesterday at 4:13 PM
Or maybe faster finding it online!
Any other membership news?
[4:15 PM]



, nothing new that's visible. I'm attempting to fix some of the awful symbols of diamonds with question marks in them, and working on making the links work. Some of the symbols that were ok in the old links are not in our new but improved incarnation.
[4:16 PM]
Feel free to bug me with links to things that you especially want that are not up yet! That can prioritize them in the big mess. : )

[4:17 PM]
o wait
[4:17 PM]
I wanted to mention  back under Membership,
[4:17 PM]
thank you all for helping with the Anniversary and with just plain making this a nice place to hang out. : )
[4:17 PM]
On to


[4:17 PM]
Eonwe, would you like to try out this finely crafted gavel?
[4:18 PM]
gavel looks around worriedly and buffs its shiny, bald head.

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 4:19 PM

Varda — Yesterday at 4:19 PM
gavel slides across the slippery table to Eonwe

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 4:19 PM

Varda — Yesterday at 4:20 PM

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:20 PM
That is one heck of a gavel.

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 4:20 PM

World of Warcraft:

Varda — Yesterday at 4:20 PM
(We have the  best gavels!)
[4:21 PM]
(Just ask them.)

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 4:21 PM
This week's bonus event: Mists of Pandaria Timewalking.

The PvP Brawl Southshore vs. Tarren Mill will be available until Tuesday, October 24th.

Hallow's End is going through November 1st. There's new stuff so don't miss your chance to get it. ---
    World of Warcraft
    The Horseman Rides: Hallow’s End is Nigh! - WoW
    Prepare yourselves; the bells have tolled! Shelter your weak, your young, and your old! Hallow’s End is here!

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:22 PM
uhu i got a nice broom from him ^^

Varda — Yesterday at 4:22 PM
: )

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 4:23 PM
Still no luck with the new pet or the velocidrake look for me.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:23 PM

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 4:23 PM
I did get the scarlet key so I can go into old Scarlet Monastary now.
[4:24 PM]
From what it seems, you can get one from the pumpkin loot and then you can go into the library and get another from a chest at the end with Doan.
[4:25 PM]
Since the unlock is account-bound, however, that means you get one for yourself and one to give a friend.
Or sell on the AH.
OR bury in your stash and forget about, heh.
[4:26 PM]
New blogs for the next content update:
Take Flight in the Emerald Dream with Dragonriding Updates ---
    World of Warcraft
    Take Flight in the Emerald Dream with Dragonriding Updates - WoW
    Dash, dive, and dart through the skies, and look great doing it from the saddle of your favorite dragon.

[4:26 PM]
Guardians of the Dream: Grow Seeds to Saplings in New Public Events ---
    World of Warcraft
    Guardians of the Dream: Grow Seeds to Saplings in New Public Events...
    The Guardians of the Dream update ushers in a new cycle of Public Events that feed into each other and challenge brave defenders to exercise their green thumbs.

[4:26 PM]
Amirdrassil, the Dream’s Hope Raid Overview and Schedule ---
    World of Warcraft
    Amirdrassil, the Dream’s Hope Raid Overview and Schedule - WoW
    Gather your allies and join the Dream Wardens as they stand against the machinations of Fyrakk and his allies, the Druids of the Flame—for fame, for glory, for the World Tree—and for the rewards.

[4:27 PM]
Check out This Week in WoW. ---
    World of Warcraft
    This Week in WoW: October 16, 2023 - WoW
    Each week we’ll look ahead to what’s in store for World of Warcraft, share the latest news, and keep you in the know byte by byte.
    The Dream Wardens are calling champions forth to protect the Emerald Dream and the new World Tree, Amirdrassil, and you can take your first steps beginning the week of November 7.

[4:27 PM]
Check out Blues News. ---
    World of Warcraft
    Blues News: October 20, 2023 - WoW
    Stay up to date with World of Warcraft when you join us each week as we round up some of the latest top blue posts and discussions.

[4:27 PM]
Check out this week's hotfixes. ---
    World of Warcraft
    Hotfixes: October 20, 2023 - WoW
    Here you will find a list of hotfixes that address various issues related to World of Warcraft: Dragonflight, Wrath of the Lich King Classic, Burning Crusade Classic, and WoW Classic.

[4:28 PM]

Overwatch 2:
New Director's Take is up: Looking Ahead Into Season 7 and Blizzcon. ---
    Director’s Take – Looking ahead into Season 7 and BlizzCon
    Game Director Aaron Keller gives his latest to the current season 7 balance and looks ahead to Season 7 and beyond.

Diablo 4:
A couple of patches came out this week. ---
    Diablo IV Patch Notes
    We will continually update this article with all patches the development team implements for Diablo IV.

[4:29 PM]

Diablo Immortal:
Check out the latest bug fixes. ---
    Diablo Immortal Bug Fixes and Patch Notes for All Platforms
    We will continually update this blog with all bug fixes and patches the team implements for Diablo Immortal on all platforms.

[4:29 PM]
Patch 27.6 is out. ---
    27.6 Patch Notes
    Prepare for Hearthstone’s next expansion: Showdown in the Badlands!

[4:29 PM]
The next expansion, Showdown in the Badlands, has been announced to relase on November 14th. ---
    Announcing Showdown in the Badlands, Hearthstone’s Next Expansion!
    Saddle up for Hearthstone’s next wild west expansion!

[4:29 PM]
That's it for gaming news from me.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:30 PM
Thank you.

Lord of the Rings Online:
[4:30 PM]
Harvestmath Festival is still going. I've been having fun with it. ; )
[4:31 PM]
Some friends and I hit the Haunted Burrow, made it fast!
Lord of the Rings Online gamers in kin this past week:
Landroval branch:

Crickhollow branch:

Treebeard branch:
[4:32 PM]
Any other gaming, membership, or requests or comments? : )

watches the gavel sliding around on the table as if it were an ice rink
[4:33 PM]
[4:33 PM]
Ok then!
On to



[4:33 PM]
If anyone has a topic or question or something, go ahead and mention.
Meanwhile, while you're considering, here's a bit of something.
[4:34 PM]
It's about hobbits!
I've heard folks say that Gollum's/Smeagol's people were of the early hobbits before they differentiated into the groups.
The question came up because of the game Lord of the Rings Online introducing "river hobbits".
Arien, go ahead. I see you typing.
[4:35 PM]
Arien? : )
taps keyboard Is this thing on?

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:36 PM
oh i ve got actually something new from my musical friends Clamavis de Profundis 

Varda — Yesterday at 4:36 PM
Ah neat. : )

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:36 PM
    Clamavi De Profundis
    The Barrow-wight's Chant - Clamavi De Profundis

Varda — Yesterday at 4:36 PM
ohh, great for Halloween!

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:37 PM
go on it was I that interrjupted you Varda
didnt want to distract

Varda — Yesterday at 4:37 PM
[4:38 PM]
That's got serious atmosphere. : )  Using JRRT's own words.
Ok, well, about those hobbits. get out of that barrow, hobbits!

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 4:39 PM
As I recall, Gandalf said something about Gollum having Stoorish roots.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:39 PM
Seems like.

Even in the game, however, it mentions that the character has some Fallohide ancestry giving greater height and likelihood of leaving home.
I checked to see if the groups had already differentiated by Gollum's time.
Be great to hear y'all's comments on it, like Eonwe's above.
[4:40 PM]
When did Gollum appear as Smeagol?
Periannath seems to be a way to refer to hobbits in general.

The timeline in RotK shows:
  [Note: referring here to the timeline for the Third Age, T.A.]

2463 The White Council is formed. About this time Deagol finds the One Ring and is murdered by Smeagol.
[4:41 PM]
2470 About this time Smeagol-Gollum hides in the Misty Mountains
[4:41 PM]
Earlier in the timeline:
1050 (RotK App A timeline)
The Periannath are first mentioned in records, with the coming of the Harfoots to Eriador.
So the Harfoots are definitely differentiated there.

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:41 PM
first they were mentioned at the time of Isildur 's death so at the end of the Second age but likely they had been around before that since his grand mother had a great store of tales and jewellry such as they had

 [Note: Isildur's death in the RotK timeline was T.A. 2, very close indeed to the end of the Second Age. Hobbits not mentioned in the timeline here, so need to find the reference in the text. Likely where the hobbit archers are mentioned as having been at the battle but not credited in the histories.]

Varda — Yesterday at 4:42 PM
c. T.A. 1150 The Fallohides enter Eriador. The Stoors come over the Redhorn Pass and move to the Angle, or to Dunland.
 [Note: c. is short for Latin circa meaning around. It means the date is not exact.]

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:42 PM
Smeagol i mean

Varda — Yesterday at 4:42 PM
So the Fallohides were also differentiated.
[4:43 PM]
And Stoors, in 1150, way before the One Ring grabbed Smeagol.
c. 1300 The Periannath migrate westward; many settle at Bree.
(Periannath, hobbits in general.)
1356 About this time the Stoors leave the Angle, and some return to Wilderland. (see also App Aiii which is not quite the same.)
[4:44 PM]
But it's still the same idea on the time. Gollum's people must be Stoors.

RotK App Aiii The North-kingdom and the Dunedain
(This is really general):
[4:45 PM]
1409 (great host came out of Angmar, Arveleg slain) or after, but it was around the time Elrond came with help from Rivendell:
Stoors had dwelt in the Angle but fled west and south because of the wars, the dread of Angmar, land and clime of Eriador especially in the east became unfriendly.
Some returned to Wilderland and dwelt beside the Gladden, becoming a riverside people of fishers. (Year not given.)

Back to the RotK timeline:
1601 Many Periannath migrate from Bree, and are granted land beyond Baranduin by Argeleb II.
[4:46 PM]
c. 1630 They are joined by Stoors coming up from Dunland.
(skipping a bunch of stuff)
2463 The White Council is formed. About this time Deagol finds the One Ring and is murdered by Smeagol.
2470 About this time Smeagol-Gollum hides in the Misty Mountains.
[4:47 PM]
Soooo, to me it looks as if Gollum is a Stoor from Stoors.
Love to see where the quotes y'all mentioned are. I remember them too, but not exactly where. /smackhead
[4:48 PM]
Anyway, to me the question seems pretty settled. It will not settle it in World chat in LotRO of course, but heh.
I'm done, pretty much, unless someone finds their quotes or new ones or has other comments?

[4:49 PM]
Hope Ar-Pharazon makes it back. He seems to have disconnected.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:49 PM
We are coming up on the hour.

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:50 PM
i hope he is all right . Part of mainland europe and scotland are battered by Babette and ensuing floods
[4:51 PM]
there might be a powercrash in his area

Varda — Yesterday at 4:51 PM
Sounds probable.

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:51 PM
or outage as you would say

Varda — Yesterday at 4:51 PM
Six of one, half a dozen of the other.
[4:52 PM]
Same thing. : )

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 4:53 PM

Varda — Yesterday at 4:53 PM
Thanks for digging, Eonwe!

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 4:54 PM
The Fellowship of the Ring, Chapter 2: The Shadow of the Past :
[4:56 PM]
"Long After, but still very long ago, there lived by the banks of the Great River on the edge of Wilderland a clever-handed and quiet-footed little people. I guess they were of hobbit-kind; akin to the fathers of the fathers of the Stoors, for they loved the River, and often swam in it, or made little boats of reeds."
Varda — Yesterday at 4:57 PM
(akin to the fathers of the fathers of the Stoors. That's where the confusion comes in.)
[4:57 PM]
("I guess they were of hobbit-kind...")

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 4:58 PM
I would take Gandalf's "guesses" like some other people's "certainties", heh.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:58 PM
It's that cool historical slipperiness.
heh, like Spock's guesses? ; )

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 4:59 PM
Lol, I was just about to link this for you:
    Star Trek 4: The Voyage Home (10/10) Movie CLIP - Not In His Nature...

Varda — Yesterday at 4:59 PM
Great minds : )
[5:00 PM]
Thank you. : )
[5:01 PM]
the gavel fetches up in its slide to fall on the hammerpad
the hammerpad has padding, no worries
[5:01 PM]



Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 5:02 PM
It does speak to the idea of divisions like with the Elves. The Noldor were but half of the group known first as Tatyar.
[5:03 PM]
The Hobbits of the Shire seemed pretty content to forget about alot of their history before Shire Reckoning began.

Varda — Yesterday at 5:04 PM
They tended to live in the present.
Maybe they realized they were losing history? Be a good reason to set up their own calendar, with no one else around to handle it.

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 5:07 PM
right then Namarie to you all  .. well as Runrig say
As you walk along these shores you are the history within nod

Varda — Yesterday at 5:08 PM
We are the history. : )  Not wrong!
[5:09 PM]
Not all history has to be major events.

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 5:10 PM
6th Age October 22nd, 2023 : Varda combs her hair. -- hehe. I don't expect that particular entry to find itself in the Annals :}

Varda — Yesterday at 5:15 PM
Hair sparkles from the last celebration fell into the sky. Minor constellations date from this point.

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 5:15 PM
Here we go. Every now and then this one line pops into my head and I've been trying to remember where it's from. Well here's the scene that includes it (start at 0:54 if it doesn't):
    Munchkin Welcome   The Wizard Of Oz

Varda — Yesterday at 5:16 PM
: )
[5:16 PM]
Eonwe's trumpet let out a sour note. Trees wilted on this date.

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 5:17 PM
Hehe, sounds about right :}

Varda — Yesterday at 5:18 PM
Here's hoping the storms in Phar's area are of very minor historical note and he returns soon.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 5:24 PM
Ooops...I have got to go. The Munchking video brought back some happy memories. Be back later for Ar
Ar's report.
[5:25 PM]
Namarie for now.

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 5:31 PM
Take care.
[5:33 PM]
Having trouble sleeping? Kirby recommends these comfy spots to help get you much needed rest (Warning 1 :Spoilers for Kirby and the Forgotten Land) (Warning 2: Don't try some of these unless, like Kirby, you're invulnerable while sleeping.):
    Kirby and the Forgotten Land - 150 Comfy Sleeping Spots

Varda — Yesterday at 5:39 PM
Later, Sandalf : )
[5:40 PM]
Valarites, so we all are indeed invulnerable while sleeping. ; )

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 5:52 PM

Varda — Yesterday at 7:14 PM
Need to restart the computer.

Eonwë Valar — Yesterday at 7:24 PM
No worries.

Varda — Yesterday at 9:07 PM
Namarie for now : )

 [Note: most recent Storm Babet news Varda found for Scandinavia where Phar lives, and Scotland where Arien lives:  (Oct 20)  (Oct 22)