January 9, 2022
Sunday Meeting
5:00 P.M. Eastern Standard Time
Discord: Valar
Guild/meeting_place
Back to News
Transcript work by Varda.
[times are Central Time from Varda's Discord. Add one hour for
Eastern.]
Attending (and typed): (6)
Discord: Arien, Ar-Pharazon, Eonwe,
Sandalf13, Shelob, Varda (presiding)
Before-meeting
Meeting begins
Membership news:
Web:
Gaming:
World of Warcraft, Lord
of the Rings Online
Tolkien:
Topic:
Denethor: good guy or
villain or something else?
After-meeting:
Lots of just chat.
(non)Flashgaming
Reviews (plus) by Ar-Pharazon. Includes Blizzard games.
Changed to one (non)flash game instead of three for now.
top
Before-meeting
Varda — Today at 4:00 PM
Aiya!
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:01 PM
Hallo All! I am still breathing and still here! Hope that all of
you are well. Aiya!
Varda — Today at 4:01 PM
@Bounder Aiya! It's time to say hi to old friends, maybe even chat
gaming and Tolkien!
[4:01 PM]
Good to see you, Sandalf : )
[4:01 PM]
top
Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo!
[4:01 PM]
Membership:
[4:01 PM]
At least two of us are breathing. : )
Arien Valar — Today at 4:02 PM
Aiya all
Varda — Today at 4:02 PM
Aiya Arien : )
Arien Valar — Today at 4:03 PM
still breathing i thik
Varda — Today at 4:03 PM
Eonwe is having a lot of work-related stuff going on, may not be
able to talk much if at all during the meeting.
Arien Valar — Today at 4:03 PM
poor guy
[4:03 PM]
Varda — Today at 4:04 PM
We'll have to talk twice as much! : )
[4:05 PM]
top
Web:
[4:05 PM]
Some work has gone up on the community site.
[4:05 PM]
The News page is now just 2022 so it should load faster. 2021 is
archived.
[4:06 PM]
The Membership page has started in on the 2022 update.
[4:06 PM]
But later on, the community site pages will be taken over by
Eonwe's new program.
Eonwë Valar — Today at 4:07 PM
Heya.
Varda — Today at 4:07 PM
Hopefully we'll look more modern. We've been slammed for the
dinosaur appearance (except the Games Site).
[4:07 PM]
Aiya Eonwe!
[4:07 PM]
Not sure all of you know but Eonwe has a degree in computer
programming. What is it called, Eonwe?
[4:08 PM]
I just slammed up the site in emergency mode while trying to
figure out html in dinosaur days. He's much more knowledgeable!
Like a zillion times. : )
Eonwë Valar — Today at 4:09 PM
A Bachelor of Science in Computer Science.
Varda — Today at 4:09 PM
Thank you. : )
[4:09 PM]
So a lot more than what I said. : )
[4:09 PM]
You are all stuck with my stuff until then, for now. : )
[4:10 PM]
Any other comments?
Arien Valar — Today at 4:10 PM
Nothing new here apart from that i got new glasses
Varda — Today at 4:11 PM
Hope they help and are comfortable!
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:11 PM
I am sending you an E-Mail as we speak. Please check your E-Mail
later!
Arien Valar — Today at 4:11 PM
oh yes and yes
Varda — Today at 4:11 PM
Don't see it yet. : )
[4:11 PM]
Will check later.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:12 PM
Whew!!! I just sent you an E-Mail message with SIX (6) attachments
of articles for your reading pleasure. They are works in progress,
but are nearly done. Here is a list of what I have sent you:
[4:12 PM]
Chapter I - Aragorn as Sherlock Holmes: A Case of Identity
[4:12 PM]
Chapter 2: The Last Line in Tolkien
Varda — Today at 4:12 PM
Sandalf, are you using NOSPAMvarda (dot) elentari (AT) gmail.com
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:14 PM
Oy Weh! No...I think I just sent it to Varda@
gmail.com I will resend it NOW (Just like Bilbo
putting on the Ring at his birthday party!)
Varda — Today at 4:14 PM
ahh, there it is, coming through
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:15 PM
Chapter 3: The Geology of Middle-Earth
Varda — Today at 4:15 PM
That isn't me at that email.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:15 PM
Chapter 4: The History and Geopolitics of the Third Age of
Middle-earth
Chapter 5: (my favorite) Denethor as Macbeth: The Tragedy of the
Last Ruling Steward of Gondor
Chapter 6: Communications Between Elves and Men in the Third Age
[4:16 PM]
Others will be enroute. The Geology of Middle Earth has just been
started, but I wanted you to have what is there so far. Much to be
done!
Varda — Today at 4:16 PM
Thank you.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:16 PM
I resent it to: NOSPAMvarda (dot) elentari (AT) gmail (dot) com
Varda — Today at 4:18 PM
ok, got something now.
I am a bit worried that you said I'd been helping you with it,
when none had arrived in my inbox.
[4:19 PM]
Things will work out.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:20 PM
My Chapter 5 (Denethor) needs updating in one section. I am going
to include a few paragraphs about the asymmetry of any comparison
between Denethor and Aragorn. Aragorn (according to Northrup Frye)
is of a higher-level archetype than Denethor...Denethor is above
us (modern people) but not as high as Aragorn. I think that the
tragedy of Denethor's life was that he was, in his mind, in
competition with Aragorn for his father's love, and the love of
his people. He could never win such a competition, and was doomed
to failure. Faramir, on the other hand, was willing to accept his
position vis-a-vis Aragorn Elessar.
[4:21 PM]
So: YOu have NOT received my attachments? What do you recommend?
Varda — Today at 4:21 PM
I just received them while we were talking.
[4:22 PM]
Just now.
1, 2, and 3
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:22 PM
Aiya Arien and Eonwe! IF you would like copies, please send me an
E-MAil that I can send them to....maybe? I do not know why Varda
is not receiving them.
Eonwë Valar — Today at 4:22 PM
The concern, Sandalf, comes from when you said you sent them at
first to "varda@gmail.com". That is not our esteemed Varda.
Hopefully that "Varda" is at least as respectable though.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:22 PM
There should be 4-5-and 6 (Communications).
Varda — Today at 4:22 PM
I just received those three, Sandalf.
[4:23 PM]
ahh, now I see more.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:23 PM
They are BIG Documents!
Varda — Today at 4:23 PM
A full 6.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:23 PM
Please be gentle with me.
Varda — Today at 4:23 PM
heh : )
[4:24 PM]
As you said, they are roughs.
So that will be taken into consideration.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:24 PM
BTW, I had a lovely conversation with Ar-Pharazon during the
off-meeting time last week. He is an extremely interesting person!
Varda — Today at 4:24 PM
All you want right now is a sort of "fact check"?
Agreed, Phar is interesting. : )
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:25 PM
Yes...sort of your impressions. Am I crazy, or going off the deep
end? As I said, I am just a dumb geologist. Writing a paper about
Cenozoic Paleogeography is nothing compared to writing about
Denethor...a whole different world, no pun intended.
Shelob — Today at 4:26 PM
Oh hi! waves 3 legs in greeting
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:27 PM
I have another friend, David Seward, who lilves in Carnegie, PA. I
introduced him to a love of Tolkien back in the mid-70s, and I
sent him copies as well. His PhD is in Greeek Literature (tragedy,
to be specific) and he is a professor at Pitt, Carnegie Mellon,
and a college advisor at a private high school in Pittsburgh.
Varda — Today at 4:27 PM
Are you wanting a straight Lord of the Rings, Hobbit check? Or the
addition of Silmarillion and the Histories of Middle-earth to help
with the check? Lot of versions, but we take LotR as "canon" here.
[4:27 PM]
Aiya Shelob : )
Shelob — Today at 4:27 PM
uses the other legs to mosey off into a dark corner for bedtime
Bye!
[4:28 PM]
Just wanted to pop in. Have fun.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:28 PM
I based all of my writings on, primarily, the "first source", that
is, the LoTR. I expanded that to include everything in the
Legendarium, such as the Silmarillio, Unfinished Tales, Letters,
usw.
Varda — Today at 4:28 PM
Thanks for dropping by, Shelob! Sleep well. : )
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:28 PM
The copies I sent you are for you when you have time...I do not
expect a quick response.
Varda — Today at 4:29 PM
You'll give me a whole five minutes? ; )
[4:29 PM]
Ok, looking forward to reading them.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:29 PM
The copies are yours to do with as you will. Thanks!
Varda — Today at 4:30 PM
The copies are under your copyright, and will be treated as such.
Eonwë Valar — Today at 4:30 PM
Varda-(Valar) can't vouch for copies sent to any other Varda,
though, heh.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:30 PM
I expect no less from you, esteemed Author and Moderator of the
Valar Guild!
[4:31 PM]
Now I am worried. Is there another Varda at gmail.com?
Varda — Today at 4:31 PM
I have never had the email of Varda@gmail.com
[4:31 PM]
There are many people who like to use that name and versions of
it.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:32 PM
Well....at least YOU have my copies. You can vouch that they are
mine, and not Varda's....whoever she may be.
Varda — Today at 4:33 PM
We shall muddle through. Might let the other one know it was an
accident sending the texts to that address. Help cover you.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:34 PM
My oldest daughter actually has the name of Luthien III on the
LoTR movie website and in Barliman's.
I shall do so RIGHT NOW!
Varda — Today at 4:35 PM
Okie dokie
Be nice, not their fault. : )
[4:36 PM]
Onwards
They just had good taste in names. ; )
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:36 PM
I was nice, of course, and am happy to report that my message to
"Varda@gmail.com" was UNDELIVERABLE because no such E-Mail exists.
So I think everything is OK.
Varda — Today at 4:36 PM
Huzzah! All is well!
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:36 PM
Except for your heavily weighted in basket.
Varda — Today at 4:37 PM
I tried to get that email once upon a time, actually. : )
hehe
adds braces to the in-basket
On to
[4:37 PM]
Gaming!
overhand throw of singing gavel to Fionwe
Eonwë Valar — Today at 4:38 PM
Catches gavel
Points gavel at Gaming News and lightning shoots out.
Hmm, not the response I was looking for.
[4:39 PM]
World of Warcraft:
Varda — Today at 4:39 PM
(Our gavels multi-task.)
Eonwë Valar — Today at 4:39 PM
This week's Bonus Events: Battlegrounds.
The PvP Brawl: Deep Six runs through Tuesday, January 11th.
Check out the latest hotfixes. --- https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/news/23739169/hotfixes-january-5-2022
World of Warcraft
Hotfixes: January 5, 2022 - WoW
Here you will find a list of hotfixes that
address various issues related to World of Warcraft: Shadowlands,
Burning Crusade Classic, WoW Classic Era, and Season of Mastery.
[4:40 PM]
Lord of the Rings
Online:
The Legendary Servers Shadowfax and Treebeard have been moved
forward. Shadowfax is now up to Rise of Isengard and has a level
cap of 75. Treebeard has reached the Mines of Moria and has a
level cap of 60.
[4:41 PM]
That's it from me. Throws hammer at Thanos.
Varda — Today at 4:41 PM
aim for the head!!
oh well
[4:42 PM]
LotRO kin mates showing up this past week by server:
Landroval server:
Celebrian
Eonwe
Falco
Fangorn
Ioreth
Lenwe
Nar
Varda
Anor server:
Eonwe
Fangorn
Varda
Shadowfax server:
Varda
Treebeard server:
Varda
[4:43 PM]
And kudos to Falco for his level 140 brawler on Landroval, hitting
top level this week on the newest class.
He has a knack for taking characters to top level but this was
special. : )
Eonwë Valar — Today at 4:43 PM
Congrats to Falco :}
Arien Valar — Today at 4:44 PM
grats indeed
Varda — Today at 4:44 PM
And no, not pushing Eonwe for programming when he has 200 other
irons in the fire, hehe.
[4:44 PM]
on to
[4:44 PM]
top
Tolkien!
[4:45 PM]
Denethor: good guy or villain or something
else?
(or other topics if anyone has one to toss in the pot)
Arien Valar — Today at 4:48 PM
I think he degraded from good gujy to something else and then
villain ~
Eonwë Valar — Today at 4:48 PM
I wouldn't go as far as to say "villain". He hadn't the
opportunity to "fall" per se, and probably would've only done so
with the Ring. He was on the right side, though he was certainly
cynical and bitter.
Arien Valar — Today at 4:49 PM
And he was kind of .. posessive .. so to say .. he favored Boromir
so much more over Faramir#
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:49 PM
I am a lot more charitable towards him. No family in the LOTR is
as carefully dissected, character-by-character, as that of
Denethor. Yet by giving us glimpses of Denethor as a husband, a
father, and a leader of the beleagured West, Tolkien is
emphasizing Denethor’s humanity. We can relate to Denethor as a
man, and understand him.
Arien Valar — Today at 4:49 PM
And not very polite to Gandalf or Aragorn either]
Varda — Today at 4:50 PM
He had a secret source of information that he trusted, that
poisoned his mind with selective choices of what was seen. Garbage
in, garbage out.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:50 PM
Both Denethor and Macbeth share the tragedy of overstepping their
fate, and trying to control their destiny, whether from pride, or
fear, or some other combination of their human needs and desires.
Their lives may give us pause to consider our own life-purposes,
and our impact on others. The Teshoo Lama in Rudyard Kipling’s Kim
tells Kim that “Thou hast loosed an Act upon the world, and as a
stone thrown into a pool so spread the consequences thou canst not
tell how far.” Like Denethor, our acts “loosed…upon the world”
will have consequences greater than those we imagine.
Varda — Today at 4:50 PM
Aye, Denethor was shown as a human.
[4:51 PM]
And the ripple effect was all over Tolkien's books. The smallest
people had the greatest effect when tossed in like a pebble.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:51 PM
I close my essay on Denethor with the Following: One wonders
which way Denethor was facing in those final moments, as he bowed
before he leaped upon his pyre. Was he looking to the East, the
home of Sauron’s evil, or was he bowing to the West, to the
undying lands and virtue of the Valar? Tolkien leaves the choice
to us.
Eonwë Valar — Today at 4:51 PM
With what he lost and what he saw as his by right, he certainly
had reasons to be cynical and bitter.
Varda — Today at 4:52 PM
Denethor did not love Sauron at all. Sauron was wrecking what
Denethor was trying to build.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:52 PM
I agree.
Varda — Today at 4:53 PM
That Thorongil guy seemed to displace the father's admiration from
Denethor to this visiting stranger that would not even remain in
the kingdom.
Eonwë Valar — Today at 4:53 PM
Considering he embraced the rite of "the heathen kings of old" he
may have cared for neither East nor West at that moment, feeling
abandoned by the latter for the loss of his kingdom and his two
sons.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:53 PM
Yup.
[4:54 PM]
But my sympathy for Denethor dwells in the fact that we too would
probably feel the same way as he did.
Varda — Today at 4:54 PM
Gandalf of the Valar was bringing in someone to "displace"
Denethor's line from the throne. Denethor was forgetting that he
was a Steward, feeling he had moved more into the place of the
King himself from sheer time.
Arien Valar — Today at 4:54 PM
Denethor was also loyal to the king in his early years .. Remember
that he said to Boromir that he d remain on the stewarts chair
until the return of the king? It is just that he doubted
whether Aragorn was that king indeed . He was not at the council
to see the broken blade.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:55 PM
Good point!
Varda — Today at 4:55 PM
Later, however, Denethor comments that the line of kings have not
been kings in a long time, ragged lot of nothingburgers.
Arien Valar — Today at 4:55 PM
Aye Varda
Varda — Today at 4:55 PM
He does not have the respect for the line of kings that Faramir
does.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:56 PM
He was human, just like us!
Varda — Today at 4:56 PM
Faramir, the "wizard's pupil".
[4:56 PM]
Right, quite human. : )
[4:56 PM]
Sauron used the little chinks in Denethor's armor to good effect,
not turning him but making him hopeless.
[4:57 PM]
The concept of Hope is central to the books, and Denethor's was
being eroded over a long time.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:57 PM
YES! He removed Denethor's "estel"...the hope based on faith,
rather than fact.
Varda — Today at 4:57 PM
Boromir's death, his intended heir, really injured him, adding to
the depression for Sauron to work on.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:57 PM
That is the subject of my chapter on "Communications" that I just
sent to Varda.
Varda — Today at 4:58 PM
(Figured you'd have a great time with this topic. hehe)
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:58 PM
Don't forget that his beloved wife died shortly after Faramir's
birth. Now THAT is a tragedy I can relate to.
Varda — Today at 4:59 PM
Absolutely. That did a huge number on his spirit, nothing small
about it. And it colored his feelings towards Faramir, as well.
Sandalf13 — Today at 4:59 PM
I think that Denethor may have shifted some of the blame for his
wife's death onto Faramir...ridiculous, of course, but something
very human that we all may do from time to time.
[5:00 PM]
I am not sure of the psychological term...displaced his grief?
Varda — Today at 5:00 PM
Agreed. Might not have been conscious or intended blame, just an
association.
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:03 PM
Here is a mouthful from "whatsyourgrief.com"
Varda — Today at 5:03 PM
A displacement reaction, is what you're thinking of? Close to
that.
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:04 PM
Displacement is what Sigmund Freud (yeah, we’re travellin’ back a
ways) described as a ‘defense mechanism‘. Defense mechanisms are
behaviors that people use to protect themselves from unpleasant
internal conflicts, thoughts, and emotions.
Defense mechanisms are tricky because they happen on an
unconscious level, so people usually don’t know they’re using
them. By doing so, they protect themselves from having to
acknowledge, experience, admit, or cope with the emotion that is
causing them unconscious anxiety. Displacement is just one of many
defense mechanisms. Other defense mechanisms like denial,
repression, and projection can impact grief, but today we want to
focus specifically on displacement.
Varda — Today at 5:05 PM
https://whatsyourgrief.com/
Whats your Grief
Whats your Grief - A Grief Website for the Rest of Us
What's Your Grief is a grief website and online community for
grieving people and grief support professionals. We honor all
types of loss and grief.
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:06 PM
Perhaps Aragorn was also a target of Denethor's displaced grief.
Eonwë Valar — Today at 5:06 PM
Interesting we don't get too many stories where the mother dies in
labor and that child becomes the father's favorite, sort of a
"last gift" mentality. Then again, that doesn't tend to make for
good drama, so...
Varda — Today at 5:06 PM
Realizing the feeling is not based on fact, the person may come up
with what are actually excuses trying to justify and understand
the feeling. This causes further problems.
[5:06 PM]
I like the "last gift" idea. : )
Eonwë Valar — Today at 5:07 PM
I think Aragorn was a legitimate target of any of Denethor's ire,
as much as one could be. Aragorn was coming in to take his place
as ruler of the Numenorean people.
Varda — Today at 5:07 PM
Aragorn was a threat to Denethor's continued work or even keeping
his own line in the rulership.
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:08 PM
My bottom take on Denethor is that he was, when he died, facing
the West. He tried to do his best to fight Sauron and reject the
evil around him, but fell to his human emotions. I believe that
Denethor felt at his passing that he tried to honor his heritage
and his Kantian devotion to duty.
Varda — Today at 5:08 PM
Faramir's willingness to call Aragorn the rightful ruler was a
disaster for Denethor.
[5:08 PM]
Denethor may have had trouble figuring direction while burning and
trying to hold onto the palantir. : )
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:09 PM
But did Faramir ever express that to is father? I do not think so.
I do not think that Faramir really knew who Aragorn was until the
latter healed Faramie in the Houses of Healing...after Denethor's
death.
[5:09 PM]
In other words, I do not think that Denethor ever knew that his
son, Faramir, acknowledged Aragorn as the King Returned.
Varda — Today at 5:09 PM
Faramir had met Frodo and figured out a lot!
[5:10 PM]
That Boromir acknowledged Aragorn.
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:10 PM
I think he knew that there was a personage of great nobility in
the Fellowship, but who exactly that person was, was still
unknown.
[5:11 PM]
I think that Frodo tried to divert Faramir from thinking about who
this other person was. After all Frodo never knew about Boromir's
last words to Aragorn as he lay dying.
Eonwë Valar — Today at 5:11 PM
Faramir knew that Frodo had travelled with Aragorn, knew who
Aragorn claimed to be, and knew what Boromir likely would've done
once the war was over. I think Faramir and Denethor understood one
another well, because they were alike in many ways. They're both
described as "shrewd" if I recall the wording correctly, but while
Faramir's knowledge of his men moved him to compassion, Denethor's
moved him to scorn.
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:12 PM
Yes. Denethor may have disliked Faramir because he saw himself in
his second son.
Varda — Today at 5:13 PM
Both Faramir and Denethor could see into the hearts of other, and
what Eonwe said. : )
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:13 PM
Always second, or second best.
Varda — Today at 5:13 PM
ouch
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:13 PM
Yeah ouch
Varda — Today at 5:14 PM
Aye, Denethor saw his own failing of being second-best in his
son's being second, although second to the Stewardship.
[5:14 PM]
That's a good insight.
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:15 PM
I think that at the very end, Denethor felt that Gandalf had even
stolen the loyalty of his own men...did Denethor not wonder out
loud if any of his men were still loyal to him?
[5:16 PM]
Like all the Dundedain of high lineage, Denethor and Faramir had
foresight, though Boromir, I think, did not.
[5:16 PM]
Foresight given to the Elves and to Men was a Gift of Iluvatar.
Varda — Today at 5:16 PM
Boromir was more of a warrior type. Faramir was closer to the
wizard scholar.
[5:16 PM]
"Loyalty halved"
[5:17 PM]
They were following the "grey fool".
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:17 PM
But put yourselves in Denethor's shoes! He was #2! His own sons
were dead or dying! He was grieving, and lashed out...
[5:19 PM]
I feel pity for Denethor, not anger or disillusionment.
Eonwë Valar — Today at 5:19 PM
Boromir was a man of his time. As Faramir described it: "more
concerned with glory, and the pursuit of it" or roundabouts. The
"Numenorean" in Faramir vs that in Aragorn perhaps could be
likened to the "Elvish" of Rivendell vs Lothlorien.
Varda — Today at 5:19 PM
By the end, Denethor was broken. He tried to regain his dignity
and his command in the manner of his death. Taking Faramir with
him.
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:20 PM
The Noldor loved the humans of the house of Beor, because they
were moved sooner to pity than to laughter.
[5:21 PM]
Thus Turgon heeded the foresight of Huor, and loved Tuor as a
son...enough that he allowed Idril to marry Tuor without any
rancor or heartache.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 5:21 PM
Aiya,. catching up
Varda — Today at 5:21 PM
Aiya Phar : )
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:22 PM
Aiya, Ar!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 5:25 PM
Ah, thanks for calling me interesting
Varda — Today at 5:25 PM
Hey, you are. : )
[5:26 PM]
Denethor: human between a rock and a hard place, perhaps not
making the best choice of possible choices, but neither was an
easy choice.
[5:26 PM]
A relatable human.
[5:27 PM]
He may not have been the very best out there, but that's why we
had Aragorn coming in. : )
Eonwë Valar — Today at 5:27 PM
My time has come. I must be off for a while to take care of things
that won't get taken care of otherwise. I will be back later for
those who are stilll here at the time. May you all have a good
week.
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:28 PM
"The Men of that house were dark or brown of hair, with grey eyes;
and of all Men they were most like to the Noldor and most loved by
them; for they were eager of mind, cunning-handed, . long in
memory, and they were moved sooner to pity than to laughter." And
the line of Elros (aragorn) descended from all three of the early
houses of men, and Aragorn physically looked just like his adopted
father Elrond and his "brothers" Elladan and Elrohir....
[5:28 PM]
From the Silmarillion...."Of the Coming of Men Into the West."
[5:29 PM]
Thank you Eonwe! Namarie!
Varda — Today at 5:29 PM
The hour is past and zipped by half an hour ago!
[5:29 PM]
Namarie!
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:29 PM
Thanks!
Varda — Today at 5:30 PM
Like Valandil come again. : )
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:30 PM
Namarie to all! The sun is almost set, and my warm apartment
awaits...along with a (warm) supper. Sei gesund to all!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 5:31 PM
(nothingburgers sound delicious)
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:31 PM
I was thinking more of herring and salad...
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 5:31 PM
heh bit of a coincidence that I was at that part of the
meeting while you mentioned supper
but enjoy!
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:32 PM
If you would like to take a look at my essays, I would be
overjoyed to send them to you, if you give me an E-Mail.
Varda — Today at 5:32 PM
mmm
[5:32 PM]
I will be looking at them, for sure!
[5:32 PM]
the gavel sings into the sunset
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:32 PM
:)
Varda — Today at 5:32 PM
the hammerpad rolls in front, tripping it
thonk!
[5:33 PM]
the hammerpad then acts as a boat on the slick surface of our
table and carries off a slightly dizzy gavel, towards Arien
[5:33 PM]
top
After-meeting!
Enjoy your herring!
I'll go make fried chicken. : )
[5:34 PM]
Also, Arien had a beautiful set of lyrics from the other side of
the coin, son loses father. Might share that with the group here?
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:34 PM
That sounds even better than herring...but my tiny (and I mean
TINY!) apartment does not lend itself to deep frying,
unfortunately. If I want fried chicken, I have to bring it in.
Varda — Today at 5:35 PM
Not deep fried!
Arien Valar — Today at 5:35 PM
I have a dainty for you guys from the point of view from a
son losing a father , so its the opposite from the discussion but
still sort of fitting if not Tolkien really /t
Varda — Today at 5:35 PM
Just simple butter and olive oil in the bottom of the pan. : )
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:35 PM
Please! Send it!
Arien Valar — Today at 5:35 PM
The song is in German butr i ll give you the translation with it
Varda — Today at 5:35 PM
Viking-esque, so that makes it Tolkienesque.
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:35 PM
You can invite me over for fried chicken anytime.
Varda — Today at 5:36 PM
: )
Arien Valar — Today at 5:36 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wyrI3PVGPYg
YouTube
Gobby Metal
FEUERSCHWANZ • Das Herz eines Drachen • With
Lyrics
Heart of a dragon
My longship lies frozen in the icy
sea of the North.
Father, I follow you until here
where everything ends,
Where every route turns.
Father, I was blind all these years,
so blind.
You’ ve got the heart of a dragon,
glowing like gold.
Fly to battle noble and proud
The heart of a dragon in your chest
fights to the end.
And we will burn out some time.
I will hold you tight because I can
sense it.
Home lies under fog.
I have sailed this far.
Father, in an ocean of stone, silent
as death.
And everything I want, Father, is
see you just once more.
You have the heart of a dragon,
glowing like gold.
Fly to battle noble and proud.
The heart of a dragon in your chest
Fights to the end.
Much too young, so you went to war
And turned there into a man,
Captured but not conquered
In a country far away.
The heart of a dragon turned to
stone
So you returned.
This burden I carry day for day.
It has almost, almost overwhelmed me
You have the heart of a dragon,
glowing like gold.
Fly to battle noble and proud.
The heart of a dragon in your chest
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:36 PM
The Heart of a Dragon! Super duper, Digger!
[5:38 PM]
Die Wörter sind sehr schön!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 5:38 PM
I should probably be careful in commenting on men's bad choices in
Tolkien's works...
Arien Valar — Today at 5:39 PM
The song was inspired by the personal experience of the singer ,
the Hauptmann Feuerschwanz
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:39 PM
Arien: Ich verstehe, dass "Digger" gleicht "Bro" auf Deutsch, aber
Sie sind nicht ein "Bro." Es tut mir leid.
Arien Valar — Today at 5:40 PM
ohn dinnae fash , Sandalf :)]
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 5:40 PM
My German isn't as good as it should be, but did you just say
you're sorry Arien's a female?
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:40 PM
No...I apologized for called her "Digger," or "Bro" in German.
[5:41 PM]
I get carried away sometimes. I am sorry.
Arien Valar — Today at 5:41 PM
no worries Sandalf
[5:41 PM]
thats what *dinna fash " means in Scots :)]
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:42 PM
Ah! Thank you! I have learned something new today to add to my
lexicon! dinna fash!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 5:42 PM
Hakuna matata ♪
Arien Valar — Today at 5:42 PM
:)))
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:42 PM
That too!
Varda — Today at 5:42 PM
Get thee to a herring. : )
[5:42 PM]
Namarie folks!
Arien Valar — Today at 5:42 PM
well then you lovely people .. bed time for me as well
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 5:43 PM
namarie!
Sandalf13 — Today at 5:43 PM
OK...I can take a hint. Sei gesund!
Arien Valar — Today at 5:43 PM
Namarie !
Varda — Today at 5:43 PM
Sleep well, Sunshine!
[5:43 PM]
Namarie from me too
[5:43 PM]
Not a hint, actually, I have to go. : )
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 5:43 PM
watches everyone disappear
Sandalf13 — Today at 6:47 PM
Namarie!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 6:47 PM
Namarie!
Sandalf13 — Today at 6:47 PM
Ar - are you still here?
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 6:47 PM
Yep
Sandalf13 — Today at 6:48 PM
I hope that you don't mind that I mentioned you in my notes to the
Group tonight.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 6:49 PM
No, it's fine In fact, wasn't it in last week's transcript
on the site?
Sandalf13 — Today at 6:51 PM
I do not know. I just finished my tasty dinner (sardines in tomato
sauce, hot wings...) and now I am munching on some late Xmas
cookies that a friend gave me three weeks ago. It is a GOOD night
to be snuggled in. It was sunny today, but the high was only 25
Grad F. We will be close to zero again overnight.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 6:51 PM
Cookies still good, then?
[6:51 PM]
Yeah, that's pretty much the case over here as well.
Sandalf13 — Today at 6:52 PM
Yes...still fresh and tasty. They were wrapped well.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 6:53 PM
Ah, nice.
Sandalf13 — Today at 6:54 PM
Do you have an extended vacation at Xmas? My first host-son from
Germany E-Mailed me a few days ago to tell me he and his wife were
taking two weeks to start the New Year on an isolated island in
the North Sea!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 6:54 PM
Usually about two weeks.
[6:54 PM]
But can always take more time off
Sandalf13 — Today at 6:54 PM
Is that more or less common in the NL?
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 6:54 PM
I think lots of people go on ski-vacation later in the month.
Sandalf13 — Today at 6:55 PM
Is the snow any good in the Alps?
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 6:55 PM
Or earlier. It varies.
[6:55 PM]
Dunno, I'm not one of those
Sandalf13 — Today at 6:56 PM
I am a skier, as are all the member of my family. Way back in 1982
and wife and I bought a time-share Condo at Swan Mountain, in
Colorado. Only 2 miles to Keystone and 4 miles to A-Basin.
Breckenridge is just over the pass, and Copper Mountain is not too
far away. I am due to go there the 22 of January, but when I was
in Denver in December, the snow was so bad in the mountains that I
thought it wouldn't be worth a $464 lift ticket for four days!
[6:58 PM]
BTW, what is your little emoji (?) figure? Is it a blue elf?
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 6:58 PM
Heh. Actually it's fanart (not mine) of Princess Luna, my favorite
My Little Pony character
Sandalf13 — Today at 6:58 PM
Ah! Now I see, said the blind man.
[6:59 PM]
I guess mine is pretty bland, by comparison.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:00 PM
It always reminds me a bit of Ian Mckellen.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:00 PM
I think I can see the resemblance.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:01 PM
Is it you?
Varda — Today at 7:01 PM
Back
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:01 PM
I don't recall your age
[7:01 PM]
Aiyata!
Varda — Today at 7:01 PM
Hantal : )
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:02 PM
My age? older than old, on par with the eons of geologic time. I
was born in late 1950.
[7:03 PM]
What does Hantal mean?
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:03 PM
Not bad. About my parents' age.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:04 PM
So you must be close in age to my childrens' ages.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:04 PM
36.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:04 PM
My youngest just turned 40.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:04 PM
About right, then.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:04 PM
I have eight grandchildren.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:04 PM
My parents have none
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:05 PM
You better get busy! ha ha.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:05 PM
My brother's trying, but it's a whole medical thing. And me...
I've been single for...
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:05 PM
Parents ALWAYS want grandchildren!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:05 PM
22 years or so.
[7:06 PM]
Not that I have the patience for children, I think.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:06 PM
Do any of the other members of the Valar Guild ever participate on
Sundays?
[7:06 PM]
You might surprise yourself!
[7:07 PM]
Children are indeed a Gift from Iluvatar.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:07 PM
Heh. If I lived in Middle-earth that might persuade me.
[7:08 PM]
But no, overall I'm pretty neutral towards having them. If I had a
partner who wanted them, I'd be for it. If not, I don't really
care.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:09 PM
The years may change your perspective, perhaps.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:09 PM
A couple of years ago I couldn't have pictured myself having kids
with anyone ever. So I've already mellowed.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:09 PM
Good for you!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:10 PM
I'm not even all that bent on finding a relationship, though. So
it's a long shot.
Nothing wrong if you can be happy single
[7:11 PM]
And adopting a kid on my own is... yeah, heck no.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:11 PM
I am single myself, right now. I have been married twice. My first
wife died in a car accident in 1985, leaving me with two small
children. I remarried, but that relationship ended in divorce
after about 10 years. I have been single ever since.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:11 PM
Ah, see, it works!
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:11 PM
But I do get lonesome, sometimes.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:12 PM
I've got family, friends, colleagues, gaming...
Of course if I didn't have my parents around me that might be
different.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:13 PM
It sounds as if your life is full
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:13 PM
Quite!
Nary a dull moment.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:13 PM
That is wonderful. Do you ever travel to the States?
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:14 PM
Nope. Not been out of Europe.
[7:15 PM]
My world is behind a screen
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:15 PM
Forgive me for saying, but I see both good and bad in that.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:15 PM
I don't mean my world is very small, just that I'm adept at
broadening my horizons through a digital medium.
[7:16 PM]
I'm sure it's not the same as actually visiting places, but you do
get to see a lot.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:16 PM
I think I can understand that, but I was raised in a world
pre-personal computers. When I took a trip with my parents,
looking out the window to see new scenery was a reason for being,
it was so much fun and enlightening.
[7:17 PM]
And of course, as the saying goes, Join the Navy and see the
World! And I did.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:17 PM
Ah, yes
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:17 PM
I never did stop in NL, however...I saw it from my ship...but we
were offshore in the North Sea.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:17 PM
I bet you mostly saw a lot of blue though!
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:18 PM
Oh yes. And a lot of starlit nights on the open ocean.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:18 PM
I bet you know all the constellations.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:19 PM
I still know a lot of them. I am remembering the beautiful quotes
from the Silmarillion about Voronwe and his fellow Elves remarking
how brilliant the stars were on the western edge of the world, as
they sought Valinor.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:20 PM
Yep, that must speak to a navy man.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:22 PM
"But very bright were the
stars upon the margin of the world..."
[7:22 PM]
Voronwe to Tuor.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:24 PM
Maybe that's just the angle
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:25 PM
"And tales and rumours
arose along the shores of the sea concerning mariners and men
forlorn upon the water who, by some fate or grace of the Valar,
had entered in upon the Straight Way and seen the face of the
world sink below them..." From the last notes of The Akallabeth.
[7:26 PM]
I was at times forlorn, but I had my Tolkien with me, and
persevered.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:27 PM
Not forlorn enough to enter the Straight Way, then.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:27 PM
Thank goodness, no. And I apologize for waxing poetic.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:27 PM
Then I must apologize for my snarky comments on it
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:28 PM
Absolutely no need!
It is a pleasure for me to be able to "speak" with you, Varda,
Eonwe, Arien, and others of the Valar Guild upon a subject very
near and dear to my heart.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:29 PM
Hmhm, I really should try to join the topics earlier again, but
it's tough.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:30 PM
I hope that you can, someday. I have learned a lot from you and
all of the others. Sometimes listening is the best strategy...
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:30 PM
I do always read up, so listening works for me
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:30 PM
Do you read the notes of our meetings afterwards?
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:33 PM
Actually I read up during the meeting itself after I arrive.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:36 PM
Your command of English is extraordinary. I wish I could speak my
second languages (Spanish and German) as well as you speak
English!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:37 PM
Well, being Dutch, English is taught quite early, and I've always
surrounded myself with English media as well.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:38 PM
I also speak a little Yiddish, but it is so close to German...I
heard it as a young child growing up.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:38 PM
I remember starting to play Warcraft 2 when I was 10 or 11 and
only a few words gave me trouble.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:38 PM
I am very impressed.
I believe that I would like to visit the NL on my next trip to
Europe...
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:39 PM
We're not going anywhere
When I'm online I always think in English as well.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:39 PM
Ah...but rising sea levels threaten the dikes, do they not?
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:39 PM
We'll make em higher!
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:40 PM
The old saying is that when you can dream in a foreign language,
you really understand it The Germans have such a good word for
it...Sprachgefühl...literally "language feeling."
[7:41 PM]
And where will you get the dirt? Dirt ain't cheap, ya' know!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:41 PM
Yep, that sounds about right.
[7:41 PM]
Heh, we'll dig up the inland
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:41 PM
Plenty of dirt still remains on the Continent...
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:42 PM
If everyone coming back from the Alps brought back some terrain...
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:42 PM
Yes. I would love to walk the streets of Amsterdam, and look in on
the Rembrandt Muesumes. I believe the name of the one is the
Reyksmuseum?
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:43 PM
Rijksmuseum, rijk = realm, country, empire... it's basically the
national museum.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:43 PM
I was born and raised in New YORK City, formerly called "New
Amsterdam." So I feel a kinship with your country.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:44 PM
I do suppose you'd pronounce it Reyk in English.
[7:44 PM]
Heh, yes, we traded it for... something.
[7:44 PM]
Suriname?
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:44 PM
Just like "Reich" in German.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:44 PM
Yes, exactly.
[7:44 PM]
So you could call it the Reichsmuseum
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:44 PM
No...I think that the Duke of York just told Peter Stuyvesant to
turn over the keys to the Brits and get the hell out of there.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:44 PM
And you'd have the pronounciation too.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:45 PM
Wall Street in Manhattan is the site of the old wall that Peter
Stuyvesant built to keep out the Native Americans.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:45 PM
After the Second
Anglo-Dutch War of 1665–67, England and the United Provinces of
the Netherlands agreed to the status quo in the Treaty of Breda.
The English kept the island of
Manhattan, the Dutch giving up their claim to the town and the
rest of the colony, while the English formally abandoned Surinam
in South America, and the island of Run in the East Indies to
the Dutch, confirming their control of the valuable Spice
Islands.
[7:45 PM]
That's from wikipedia.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:46 PM
Wow. Now I know...you were right!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:46 PM
So yeah, the English did take it, but it was formalized in a trade
of sorts.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:46 PM
I wonder who got the better deal...the Spice Islands or Manhattan?
[7:47 PM]
BTW, the sale price of Manahatta from the Natives to the Dutch was
about $24.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:47 PM
Back then, or now?
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:47 PM
I was raised on "Suanhacky" (alternatively spelled Sewanakee), or
"pile of wampum shells."
[7:47 PM]
Then, of course, but today's dollars.
Varda — Today at 7:48 PM
Indians knew no one could own land, so they were getting the
better deal.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:48 PM
And they were truly right!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:48 PM
Well, I mean... 24 dollars then would be a lot more than now.
But I don't suppose we had dollars back then.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:49 PM
Nope. The last I heard, the $24 figure was in 1960 dollars.
Whatever the actual cost, it was a steal.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:49 PM
Certainly the Dutch didn't, but you might have had an exchange
rate.
Ah, ok.
To be fair, a lot of investments must have gone into the place
over the centuries since then.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:50 PM
My oldest daughter, Elicia (aka Luthuen Tinuviel III) was a
midwife in Brooklyn (hey - another Dutch name!) before she and her
husband and young baby boy packed it up for London. She retook all
her midwifery courses and is now delivering babies in London.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:50 PM
Breukelen, yep
Delivering babies in London gives a bit of a weird image, like
she's a human stork...
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:51 PM
My parents were both PROUD Brooklynites!
Maybe she is...
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:51 PM
Heh. Any Dutch ancestry?
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:52 PM
I did the 23andme thing. I am 98.5% northern European, .2%
unidentified, 1% eastern European,and, get this: .2% subsaharan
African. Now....I wonder where THAT came from!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:53 PM
Well, isn't that everyone's origin in the end?
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:53 PM
I also have a lot more Neanderthal than most modern humans.
[7:53 PM]
Or the beginning?
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:53 PM
I do believe people have about 2% neanderthal genes as well.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:53 PM
Europeans do....Africans have NO Neanderthal genetics. Asians have
less than Europeans.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:53 PM
In the beginning, sure, depending on the starting point of your
search...
True, true.
As I recall, Subsaharan is genetically more varied than everyone
else combined.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:54 PM
The 23andme report said that humans range between 0% and 4%
Neanderthal.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:54 PM
2% serves as an average then :)
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:55 PM
All I know, as a geologist who taught a course entitled "History
of Life" for many semesters, is that in the end, we really are all
related. If we look closely at our genetics, we all share a bit of
each other. Something to think about.
Varda — Today at 7:56 PM
Grandpa Noah : )
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:56 PM
Yup.
Varda — Today at 7:56 PM
Oh, and happy birthday to Meriadoc-(V) today!
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:56 PM
Is that Meriadoc a member of the Valar Guild?
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:56 PM
Happy birthday!
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:57 PM
Happy Birthday!!!
Varda — Today at 7:57 PM
Yes, for many years. Also my brother.
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:57 PM
Ah...all the more reason to wish him a happy birthday.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:57 PM
Varda's got her entire family wrapped in Valar.
It's almost a cult.
Varda — Today at 7:57 PM
Was just on the phone with him. He has to go to bed now, gets up
at 3 am to go to work.
hehe - our cult!
We used to have a whole mass of us on World of Warcraft. : )
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:58 PM
All I managed to get is my daughter Elicia. She was so involved in
the LoTR Movie site, that she was invited to ALL three of the
Oscar parties. She met her husband at the third and final
gathering...he was from London.
Varda — Today at 7:58 PM
Impressive : )
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 7:58 PM
LotR brings people together!
Sandalf13 — Today at 7:59 PM
I still have the pictures she took at the Oscar parties...I
particularly love her photos with Frodo, Sam, Elrond, and Gandalf.
She said that Arwen was a real haughty lady, who wouldn't do
pictures with anyone ( I could use some stronger language, but I
won't out of a sense of propriety!).
Varda — Today at 7:59 PM
My family didn't beat the Melkorrim though. Melkor, his three
sons, and the grandkids all in Valar.
Sandalf13 — Today at 8:00 PM
Well. I will have to try to get some of MY cult involved.
My grandchildren are too young to read the LoTR yet, although I
think they could manage the Hobbit.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:01 PM
My family liked the LotR movies - hence our current cat named
Frodo - well enough, but they're not gamers, and they don't get
into English fantasy literature like I can
My mother doesn't like fantasy at all.
Though I suppose some movies can be entertaining
Sandalf13 — Today at 8:03 PM
The movies were great, as far as movies go....and very deserving
of their fame. However, I am still disappointed with them. Maybe
it is generational. I read the books and had pictures in my mind's
eye of what the characters looked like....also, I think that to
achieve his "story arc," Jackson changed too many characters and
their relationships...especially that of Elrond and little Estel,
later Aragorn.
[8:04 PM]
I have NOT even seen the Hobbits....but I have heard that in the
Hobbit, Thranduil tells Legolas to go look for the ranger
Aragorn...huh? Estel was ten years old at the time of the
Hobbit....what a Ranger he would have been!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:04 PM
I consider the movies as good pieces on their own, based on the
books, so to speak. As for images in my head... I may have
mentioned in a past meeting that I first envisioned hobbits as
being green like Warcraft goblins. Just stuck with me.
Varda — Today at 8:05 PM
We have a great time bashing the movies, but they had wonderful
production values and acting, got the atmosphere. PJ must have
loved the world.
Agreed, based on the books, not to be considered same as the
books.
Sandalf13 — Today at 8:06 PM
In that sense, I agree too.
Elicia absolutely loved the movies...she was a true fan.
Varda — Today at 8:06 PM
That line from Thranduil was not expected to remain for that
reason, trying to find a way for Thranduil to give Legolas some
direction, and that one stuck.
Sandalf13 — Today at 8:07 PM
Ah. Now I think I understand...
Varda — Today at 8:07 PM
Aragorn only knew himself as Estel at that time.
Eonwë Valar — Today at 8:07 PM
Salutations once more.
Varda — Today at 8:07 PM
Aiyata, Fionwe! : )
Sandalf13 — Today at 8:07 PM
Aiya!
Sandalf13 — Today at 8:07 PM
Aiya!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:09 PM
Aiya!
Varda — Today at 8:09 PM
To answer a question, it's Quenya Elvish. Aiya for Hail, Namarie
for Farewell. Aiyata for Welcome back. Hantal for Thank you.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:09 PM
Hmm, tis getting late, so don't mind if I start throwing in my
gaming report throughout the conversation.
Varda — Today at 8:09 PM
If you think it's late, the sun must be coming out?
[8:10 PM]
Fire away!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:10 PM
And Ainuyaxe means holy cow, which I always loved on the
translation list
Varda — Today at 8:10 PM
hahaha
Sandalf13 — Today at 8:10 PM
Believe it or not, it is late for me too. I get up at 0500, and
usually climb into my nice warm bed to do some reading before
bidding farewell to the day...
I have got to write these down.
Varda — Today at 8:11 PM
We pick them up hearing them over and over for decades. So we're
lucky there.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:11 PM
http://valarguild.org/varda/Tolkien/encyc/lang/IrmoElvish.htm
is a good link for that.
Irmo's Quenya Role-playing Guide
Quenya Elvish words useful in role-playing.
Straight from Tolkien with some "yocariqenya".
Varda — Today at 8:11 PM
Irmo sometimes comes to meetings, tends to start at his bed time.
You asked if others ever come, and yes, we get different ones.
Sandalf13 — Today at 8:12 PM
I see a long list of names to the right of my screen, and the
little green dot suggests that they are online, but they are
probably gaming, right?
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:12 PM
Or just in Discord but away, or something.
Sandalf13 — Today at 8:13 PM
OK.
Varda — Today at 8:13 PM
The ones with green dots are actively doing something, yellow
crescents are away, gray are not on at all.
Lenwe is playing Minecraft. : )
[8:14 PM]
Treebeard is playing Starcraft.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:14 PM
And you're in LotRO!
Varda — Today at 8:14 PM
But it also shows a bit longer than is actually correct.
Aye : )
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:14 PM
And I'm in Hearthstone preparing for that report, but I'm
secretive that way.
Varda — Today at 8:14 PM
hehe
You can cover the game message with a note like Eonwe's and Nob's.
Sandalf13 — Today at 8:14 PM
Where is the hearthstone? I do not see it in the links to the left
of my screen...
Varda — Today at 8:15 PM
Sometimes the folks over there chat in side messages.
It's covered with a custom note.
A Gandalf quote, in fact. : )
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:15 PM
Well, since my avatar is Princess Luna, let's put a Luna quote on
it...
Varda — Today at 8:15 PM
I like seeing the games.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:16 PM
If I can find out how to put in a custom note.
Sandalf13 — Today at 8:16 PM
It will take me a while to learn all this Discord stuff...I am a
bit slow in the uptake, as you know. If you looked at that
video link I sent you - "Here come the Geologists!" - yup, that
is me.
Varda — Today at 8:17 PM
Your name on the left, click it.
[8:18 PM]
You are doing great, Sandalf. : )
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:18 PM
There we go!
Varda — Today at 8:18 PM
Most Tolkien-onlies never get this far!
hahhaa Phar
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:19 PM
And from the same episode we have...
This one
Varda — Today at 8:20 PM
hehe - you keep changing. Showed Sauron, got a smile. : )
Chatting with Ioreth in LotRO.
Sandalf13 — Today at 8:20 PM
I am not seeing this..
Varda — Today at 8:20 PM
Under Ar-Pharazon's name on the right.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:21 PM
Games! Personal gaming report.
[8:22 PM]
For (non)flashgaming I'm getting kinda tired of repeating 3 old
ones every time, so I'll stick to one a week unless there's new
ones
Varda — Today at 8:22 PM
Sauron is my son, was behind me at the monitor. Dropped by to see
what was going on with the meeting.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:23 PM
So I'll give you https://www.kongregate.com/games/jronn/a-grim-love-tale
as the first in a series of grim reaper games I've linked before!
You play a young and ambitious reaper who goes out to collect
souls to increase his power and impress the girl reaper.
Kongregate
A Grim Love Tale
Casual puzzle-platformer. Help Grim find love
by becoming a grim reaper.
If you#39re experiencing lag / getting stuck on
corners or similar, using a different...
[8:24 PM]
You do this in a platformer made of small enclosed levels, where
you have to puzzle around to get all the various souls and make it
to the exit gate. Each soul has different properties: humans can
jump, for example.
top
[8:29 PM]
Blizzard gaming:
[8:30 PM]
Hearthstone:
Up to level 65 on the reward track now.
Not yet made it to Knight-Captain in the ranking system, but
getting there.
[8:31 PM]
Got Demon Hunter to level 47 this week, as well
[8:32 PM]
Brawl is the New Year Bash, work together with your opponent
to decorate the tavern while fighting off party crashers, and then
taking down the pinata boss. Of course there's always people who
don't understand you have to cooperate and who try to kill you
instead, which always ends in a loss for both.
But I did get it in 3 or 4 tries
[8:34 PM]
No new mercenaries gotten this week, but have been able to level
some low ones including my newest, Brightwing, and got Anacondra
and Tirion maxed at 30.
Sandalf13 — Today at 8:35 PM
Oy weh. I am lost. I think better head to bed and continue
reading "The Lincoln Highway." Namarie, all.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:35 PM
Don't get lost on the highway!
Sandalf13 — Today at 8:35 PM
I shall try not to. Sei gesund!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:35 PM
Namarie
[8:36 PM]
WoW:
[8:36 PM]
Raiding has started again, and we're doing okay in heroic raid,
though a few fights took some tries. Getting back in the habit. We
got 6 on the first night though.
Varda — Today at 8:38 PM
Namarie, Sandalf!
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 8:38 PM
Got honor to level 88, and through battlegrounds/weeklies/raiding
gathered enough to buy a new soulshape, the moose.
[8:40 PM]
Poked alts a bit more, rogue and mage, getting the rogue to 46 and
about to launch into the final scenario for his class campaign
(pre-7.2 chapters at least), which is fighting my way into
Stormwind and SI:7 to take down an imposter Matthias Shaw!
[8:41 PM]
And finally, had the WoW escape room game delivered 3
scenarios with puzzles to solve (with a real-life group), a
poster, some booklets, a lot of nice looking puzzle cards... even
if I can never get anyone to play, I'll still have a blast going
through all the cards and putting the puzzlees together
[8:43 PM]
https://titanbooks.com/70798-world-of-warcraft-unshackled-an-escape-room-box/
for an example link
Titan Books
World of Warcraft Unshackled An Escape Room Box
Will you escape the dangers of Azeroth?
You have 60 minutes to break free of the chains
that bind and the evils that threaten the World of Warcraft®!
Play as honorable members of the Horde and the
Alliance and overcome obstacles before time runs out!
Stop the spread of Professor Putricide’s plague
of undeath in his bizarre laboratory, dodge...
[8:43 PM]
I mostly got it for any lore, but at least it's fun to look at!
[8:44 PM]
Would be fun if I ever joined a WoW group meeting again though,
with enough people in a room.
And that's my transcript for the week!
[8:47 PM]
...and I just realized why these new cap headphones keep hurting
my left ear... one of my glasses' legs keeps getting stuck in
there. That should help.
Varda — Today at 9:01 PM
Glad you figured it out!
Thank you, Phar.
Ar-Pharazon-V — Today at 9:02 PM
Right namarie!
Varda — Today at 10:47 PM
Namarie
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