Valar Guild

February 27, 2022 Sunday Meeting

5:00 P.M. Eastern Standard Time
Discord: Valar Guild/meeting_place

Back to News
Transcript work by Varda.
[times are Central Time from Varda's Discord. Add one hour for Eastern.]


Attending (and typed): (5)
    Discord: Arien
, Ar-Pharazon (After-meeting), Eonwe, Sandalf13, Varda (presiding)
Before-meeting
Meeting begins
Membership news:
Web:

    Forum: we have a new post for our RP story from Arien.
Gaming:
   
World of Warcraft, Lord of the Rings Online
Tolkien:
    Topic from Eonwe: Nienna and Melkor
    Topic from Sandalf13: Influence ratio of different characters in the books.
After-meeting:
    (non)Flashgaming Reviews (plus) by Ar-Pharazon. Includes Blizzard games.
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Before-meeting

Varda — Yesterday at 4:00 PM
Aiya
[4:00 PM]
@Bounder Aiya! Time to say hi to old friends, maybe even chat about gaming and Tolkien!
[4:01 PM]

Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo!

[4:01 PM]

Membership:

[4:01 PM]
A batch of us are online, gaming. Yay!

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:02 PM
Ye! Utuvienyes! Hallo all!

Varda — Yesterday at 4:02 PM
Aiya Sandalf : )

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:02 PM
Aiya Varda! Are you back aat home?

Varda — Yesterday at 4:02 PM
I'm happy to be home again. : )

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:03 PM
Good for you! I hope your trip was safe, secure, and happy!

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:03 PM
Aiya all and Namarie to all who are going

Varda — Yesterday at 4:03 PM
Hoping to play the great game of catch-up this week. ; )
[4:03 PM]
Aiya Sunshine!
[4:03 PM]
We just got here! : )

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:03 PM
Welcome home then

Varda — Yesterday at 4:04 PM
Hantal!

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:04 PM
Hello.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:04 PM
Any other membership news? Arien on vacation maybe?

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:04 PM
Aiya Eonwe!

Varda — Yesterday at 4:04 PM
Eonwe, aiya!

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:04 PM
Aiya Eonwe  I was back at work today for two weeks

Varda — Yesterday at 4:05 PM
Here's hoping you make enough money working to keep you in gaming too!

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:05 PM
that is i am working two weeks and then i ve got another two weeks

Varda — Yesterday at 4:05 PM
Two on, two off?

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:05 PM
sort off xD

Varda — Yesterday at 4:05 PM
Just glad you're here right now. : )

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:05 PM
just the remaining annual vacation
[4:06 PM]
och i am believe me i am

Varda — Yesterday at 4:06 PM
hehe
[4:06 PM]

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Web:

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:06 PM
"Och"...must be Scottish.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:06 PM
I believe it's something like "Oh"
[4:06 PM]
And aye.
[4:07 PM]
The Forum has a post by Arien!

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:07 PM
Sounds like Garrison Keilor reporting that tghe Norwegians sayt "uff dah"

Varda — Yesterday at 4:09 PM
whoosh Right over my head, there.

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:09 PM
we have the nice expression "uff da da ump dah" ...

Varda — Yesterday at 4:10 PM
Sounds like drumming. : )

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:10 PM
for stupid music indeed
[4:11 PM]
never mind that
[4:11 PM]
back to the meeting ~

Varda — Yesterday at 4:12 PM
Hey now. What did the uff etc mean? : )

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:12 PM
oh it was just some nonsense sylabbles which were in a music video .. tried to find it but could not

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:13 PM
As far as I know, Norwegian "uff dah" (sp) is close to Yiddish Oy Weh, or perhaps "what a dumb head I am."

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:14 PM
kind of warrior dining in the post .. saw that actually Maligant in First Knight was eating like Frali from tip of his knife .. but without buckler as plate

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:15 PM
Yup. Could be like that too. Also maybe "oh crap."

Varda — Yesterday at 4:15 PM
Onward to
[4:15 PM]

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Gaming!

[4:15 PM]
Happy to have seen a few online that haven't been around for a while. : )
[4:17 PM]
tosses the gavel to Eonwe

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:17 PM
Catches gavel
[4:17 PM]
World of Warcraft:

This week's Bonus Event: Battlegrounds.

Check out the following blogs:
[UPDATED FEBRUARY 22] Shadowlands: Eternity's End Content Update Notes --- https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/news/23770462/updated-february-22-shadowlands-eternitys-end-content-update-notes
    World of Warcraft
    [UPDATED FEBRUARY 22] Shadowlands: Eternity's End Content Update No...
    Shadowlands: Eternity's End is now live!

[4:18 PM]
Shadowlands: Eternity’s End Class Set Preview --- https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/news/23778646/shadowlands-eternitys-end-class-set-preview
    World of Warcraft
    Shadowlands: Eternity’s End Class Set Preview - WoW
    Here’s everything you should know about obtaining and collecting Eternity’s End new Class Sets when Shadowlands Season 3 arrives.

[4:18 PM]
Shadowlands Season 3 begins March 1 --- https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/news/23778647/shadowlands-season-3-begins-march-1
    World of Warcraft
    Shadowlands Season 3 begins March 1 - WoW
    It’s time for the stouthearted to prepare for combat—the third season of Shadowlands draws near.

[4:18 PM]
World of Warcraft News and Development Updates --- https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/news/23780548/world-of-warcraft-news-and-development-updates
    World of Warcraft
    World of Warcraft News and Development Updates - WoW
    Catch up on the latest World of Warcraft release dates, news, hotfixes, and more in our update.

[4:18 PM]
Check out the latest hotfixes. --- https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/news/23770463/hotfixes-february-25-2022
World of Warcraft
Hotfixes: February 25, 2022 - WoW
Here you will find a list of hotfixes that address various issues related to World of Warcraft: Shadowlands, Burning Crusade Classic, and WoW Classic.

[4:18 PM]
Lord of the Rings Online:
[4:18 PM]
Update 32.0.1 came out this week. --- https://www.lotro.com/update-notes/lotro-update-32-0-1-release-notes-en
    The Lord of the Rings Online
    Update 32.0.1 Release Notes
    Here are the release notes for Update 32.0.1, released on Wednesday, February 23rd, 2022.

[4:18 PM]
There's a known issue with Hrνmil Frost-heart. --- https://forums.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?692850-Known-Issue-Hiddenhoard-of-Abnank%C3%A2ra-Hr%C3%ADmil-Frost-heart
    Known Issue: Hiddenhoard of Abnankβra - Hrνmil Frost-heart
    We are currently working to correct an issue that can cause the Hrνmil Frost-heart encounter to not reset properly if you are defeated after entering the Mind of the Frost-heart. This will be     corrected in the near future and we apologize for the inconvenience.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:19 PM
People are running the Hidden Hoard anyway. : )

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:19 PM
Thus ends my gaming news.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:19 PM
Thank you, Eonwe. : )
[4:20 PM]
A small addition to LotRO:
[4:20 PM]
Lord of the Rings players in kin this past week:

Landroval:
Celebrian
Eonwe
Fangorn
Ioreth
Irmo
Nar
Nimrodel
Tulkas
Varda

Anor:
Eonwe
Fangorn
Varda

Shadowfax:
Varda

Treebeard:
Varda
[4:20 PM]
Any other games anyone would like to mention news for or comment on?
[4:21 PM]
On to
[4:21 PM]

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Tolkien!

[4:21 PM]
Eonwe spotted an interesting comment. Go ahead!

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:21 PM
Thanks.
[4:22 PM]
So I was reading TVTropes, which is a wonderfully fun place to waste your entire day should you have nothing more exciting to do,...

Varda — Yesterday at 4:23 PM
Or even if you do. ; )
[4:23 PM]
https://tvtropes.org/
    TV Tropes
    TV Tropes
    TV Tropes, the all-devouring pop-culture wiki, catalogs and cross-references recurrent plot devices, archetypes, and tropes in all forms of media.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:25 PM
Can I attach a picture here, somehow? In My Character Development chapter I am discussing Northrup Frye, the Canadian literary critic who discussed the use of Archetypes in literature. Guess where a friend in Omaha invited me to join her for coffee? THE ARCHETYPE CAFE. I even took a picture. I doubt that Northrup Frye ever made it there, however.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:25 PM
How about after we get Eonwe's topic done. I think I linked wrong?

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:25 PM
And I decided to delve into some of the Fridge Logic sections. Fridge Logic, in short, is when you what or read something, walk away from it, then later, all of a sudden (like when you're standing in front of your fridge), you start questioning things you saw.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:25 PM
The pic has to already be online to link.

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:26 PM
Fridge Brilliance is when you are standing there later and realize something has an incredibly good explanation.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:26 PM
Alas, it is not, It is in my pictures folder only on my laptop,,,,but it IS a good pictuyre!

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:28 PM
"Fridge Brilliance" is where I was this day, and I came to the section on The Silmarillion, and one piece of fridge brilliance, while I have seen nothing that could indicate it is the case, I found the idea fascinating.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:30 PM
My fridge brilliance is trying to figure out which leftover is still safe to eat. ha ha.

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:32 PM
In The SIlmarillion, we're told that except for three Valar, all the others were paired off. These three unpaired are Melkor, Ulmo, and Nienna. This piece of fridge brilliance suggests that Nienna was supposed to be the spouse of Melkor (not Morgoth mind you, Melkor).

Varda — Yesterday at 4:32 PM
No one for Ulmo? : )

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:33 PM
He lived in the water..who wants to live in the water?

Varda — Yesterday at 4:33 PM
Uinen, but she is a Maia.

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:33 PM
Apparently not, at least not in Ea. But he moves around alot anyway, with no settled abode.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:33 PM
Seaweed is her hair.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:33 PM
The Maia are less fussy.
[4:33 PM]
Perhaps Melkor's hubris got in the way of a budding relationship with Nienna.

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:34 PM
When I look at the personalities of the two, I can't help but appreciate the symmetry: Melkor is impatient, always rushing to start things but never finishing them, while Nienna is so patient she can teach it.

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:34 PM
Nessa was the spouse of Osse .. who was a wild Maiar attached to Ulma wasn t she ?

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:34 PM
Someone who thinks of themselves too much makes for a poor partner in a relationship, nicht wahr?

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:35 PM
Note also that when Melkor is freed after being imprisoned for three Ages of the Trees, only Nienna speaks in favor of his release.

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:35 PM
well not so wild i mean but she managed to control Osse a bit

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:35 PM
Thank goodness.
I saw firsthand the wrath of Osse once at sea, that I related to Ar Pharazon last week after meeting.

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:36 PM
and Nienna was a maiden of Nessa if I remember rigbht?

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:36 PM
Nienna was a Valiλ, the sister of Irmo and Namo.

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:36 PM
maybe it was hoped that she could control Melkor a bit

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:36 PM
Good luck with that.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:36 PM
This may help with the Nienna question: : )
[4:37 PM]
http://valarguild.org/varda/Tolkien/encyc/articles/n/Nienna/Nienna.htm

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:37 PM
"She is acquainted with grief, and mourns for every wound that Arda has suffered in the marring of Melkor." --- The Valaquenta
Varda — Yesterday at 4:38 PM
Nienna is involved with Pity, Mercy, Compassion.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:38 PM
It must be tough to work with her in a meeting or conference....she would be grieving all the time...maybe crying? Wow.

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:38 PM
She was so sorrowful, she started crying before the AInulindallλ was even done, and if this idea were true, you can imagine part of it may be a bit of "You're going down a road I can't follow" towards Melkor.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:38 PM
She would be the one giving the compassionate suggestion in a council meeting.

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:39 PM
right

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:39 PM
One would hope.
[4:39 PM]
If she cold stop grieving long enough...

Varda — Yesterday at 4:39 PM
That actually works, Eonwe. If she was intended for Melkor, it fits.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:39 PM
I think you are right on target, Eonwe.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:40 PM
Pity/Nienna is one of those that Gandalf worked for.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:40 PM
Yes. There are some good pictures of Olorin talking to Nienna in fan artwork.

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:40 PM
It makes it all the sadder if Melkor rejected her to try and get with Varda, who of course rejected him flatly.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:40 PM
In an early version, Nienna was sister to Melkor and Manwe, so there was already a tie-in.

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:41 PM
it was  with pity Bilbo using the ring .. he didn t kill Gollum because he had pity with him

Varda — Yesterday at 4:41 PM
Of course. ;) [Note: refers to Varda rejecting Morgoth.]
[4:41 PM]
Aye, Arien.
A major deciding factor of how good operates: pity, compassion.

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:42 PM
remember Gandalf said "it was because of this , that he started his way with the ring with pity he was granted rich reward in giving up the ring* .. thats paraphrased of course but it was something like that

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:43 PM
Yes. I think that Tolkien's religious views on forgiveness and redemption are evidenced in all of his writings.
And that is why among all the fathers of Men, the Noldor loved the House of Beor, because they were moved sooner to pity and compassion rather than laughter.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:44 PM
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/FridgeBrilliance
    TV Tropes
    Fridge Brilliance - TV Tropes
    The Fridge Brilliance trope as used in popular culture. You watch a movie and something about it just seems off, you don't like it. One night, as you get up …

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:45 PM
"So great was her sorrow, as the Music unfolded, that her song turned to lamentation long before its end, and the sound of mourning was woven into the themes of the World before it began."
Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:45 PM
I wish I could grow as much hair on top of my head as he can!

Varda — Yesterday at 4:45 PM
Faramir was another who was like that. He and Denethor could see the minds of men (understand) but Faramir was moved to pity rather than contempt.

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:46 PM
"But she does not weep for herself; and those who hearken to her learn pity, and endurance in hope."
Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:46 PM
Faramir LACKED his father's overweening pride (hubris).

Varda — Yesterday at 4:46 PM
The sorrow was part of the weaving of the music that gave it far more depth than the parts by Morgoth.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:47 PM
So sorrow and joy were woven into the tapestry of the Song of the Ainur, even as Ecclesiastes says "there is a time for everything..." of which Tolkien was certainly aware.

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:49 PM
So that's what I had to share. I found the idea fascinating, as I said.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:49 PM
A part of Fridge Brilliance: the viewer might be putting more thought into it than the creator ever did.

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 4:49 PM
Aye.

Varda — Yesterday at 4:49 PM
Thank you, Eonwe. That is intriguing, and amazingly probable.
[4:50 PM]
As the sister of the lords of death and of dreams, compassion fits well.

[4:51 PM]
Sandalf, you had a subject you would like us to discuss?

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 4:51 PM
interesting idea .. so let me try to define this fridge brilliance .. a sudden unexpected aspect in a context that seems obvious although you can not explain why that aspect is there at the moment you think about it

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Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:54 PM
Yes. I mentioned to Varda that in Chapter Seven of my book, I am studying the "influence ratio." I introduced the idea of the influence ratio in my chapter on Denethor, Chap. 5. I define the influence ratio as the number of times a minor character is mentioned in the text divided by the actual number of chapters in which they appear in the flesh, so to speak. Denethor, Elrond, Galadriel all have VERY HIGH influence ratios. Not surprising, although Denethor may be the most surprising of that group. Interestingly enough, Hamfast Gamgee has a higher influence ratio than a lot of other characters you might think of...
[4:54 PM]
What does it all mean?

Varda — Yesterday at 4:58 PM
A particular point is being pushed. What point does each of these minor characters bring out where they are shown?

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 4:59 PM
I agree. i believe that each of these characters has some influence on the direction or course of action undertaken by a "major" character in the plot, such as Sam or Frodo, or especially Gimli vis-a-vis Galadriel.

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 5:01 PM
right folks .. forgive Sandalf.. it s not your topic  but i am afraid i have to go as i am working an hour earlier to catch some sleep

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 5:02 PM
Great! PLEASE - if you have any geologic references from the LoTR, please send them to me ASAP! I am finishing up Chapter 3 for Varda and need to include as many as I can. Thanks! Namarie!

Arien  Valar — Yesterday at 5:02 PM
Namarie for now !

Varda — Yesterday at 5:03 PM
Namarie, Arien!
[5:03 PM]
It is the hour. : )
[5:06 PM]
It's hard to know which geologic references you don't have yet until we can see it. But we could make a stab at it.
[5:07 PM]
Does the Hobbit count? : )

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 5:07 PM
Anything that relates to rocks, minerals, mountain ranges (descriptive), faults, river courses/flows, and YES...the Hobbit counts...BUT NOT THE SILMARILLION! Too geologically implausible to sink mountain ranges beneath the wave...

Varda — Yesterday at 5:08 PM
How about those giants flinging boulders about? : )

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 5:09 PM
Do we know what the boulders are made of?

Varda — Yesterday at 5:09 PM
Mythology is born partly to explain what people see. Islands that look like mountains rising up from below, for instance.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 5:09 PM
Could be of interest...where do the boulders come from?

Varda — Yesterday at 5:09 PM
One presumes they pulled them from the same mountains around them, since they were right there by their hands.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 5:10 PM
I note in my Intro to Chapter Three that by the time of the action in the LoTR, the lands and the stories of the First and Second ages are legends out of the dim and misty past...so the Legendarium is, in a sense, only a legend, whereas the Middle-earth of the LoTR is as "real" as one can get.

Varda — Yesterday at 5:14 PM
One thing causing you problems is that this is fantasy, not science fiction, with folklore and mythology. Intended as the mythology for England since it had none of its own. Also, the story gave reasons for the way his made-up languages worked.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 5:14 PM
Furthermore, Tolkien's view of the First and Second Ages is that the world (Middle-earth) existed on a FLAT DISK...not a round world. Totally ungeologic.
[5:15 PM]
I have enough dealing with the collision of two major plates (Eriador-Gondor and Rhovanion), with the possibility of a third, smaller plate (Gondor alone), and the volcanism of Mordor.
[5:16 PM]
I think I justify my exclusion of everything except the Middle-earth of the Hobbit and LoTR pretty well in my text.

Varda — Yesterday at 5:18 PM
Yep. : )
If one thinks of the flat disk as Pangea, wouldn't that help?

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 5:20 PM
No...I am walking a tightrope here. I want to make the geology of Middle-earth as plausible as possible. I am only using the LoTR and Hobbit version, because they seem the most "real" of all the Legendarium. There are too many density differences to allow for the sinking of Beleriand, or the drowning of Numenor, so I chose to relegate those legendary events to the ash heap of history (to borrow a phrase from Leon Trotsky) and concentrate only on the real world of the LoTR/Hobbit.

Varda — Yesterday at 5:21 PM
Ok, so Pangea breaking into continents when Eru separates Valinor from other parts of Middle-earth won't work?
[5:22 PM]
Ah well. : )
[5:22 PM]
the gavel hops across the table and trips over a golden plate
[5:23 PM]
bonking the hammerpad

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 5:23 PM
No...because the round world was created at the end of the second age, when Numenor was drowned. All we have left is a round world of Middle-eaarth in the LoTR. There is a "straight road" to Elvenhome, that allows the Elves to leave Middle'earth and return to Valinor, that is no longer attached to the rest of Middle-earth, so on that basis I did what I did.

Varda — Yesterday at 5:23 PM
thump!!
[5:23 PM]

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After-meeting!

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 5:23 PM
Bonk. I need to go home for dinner and come back later. Mayber Ar Pharazon will join in later, as usual?

Varda — Yesterday at 5:23 PM
Reasonable of you.
[5:24 PM]
He does that, aye. He makes his gaming report when he comes in.
Namarie and enjoy dinner!

Eonwλ Valar — Yesterday at 5:24 PM
Later parts of HoME go into Tolkien's attempts to reconcile his mythos with the (at the time) current understanding of natural history. I'm pretty sure part of that touched on geology and landmasses, but I'll be reminded of it soon enough since I'm perusing the Histories recently.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 5:25 PM
I will look for him later. As usual, I eat the remains of my Friday night salmon dinner on Sunday evening. It is all cooked and ready to go...I just need to warm it up, then back to work on Chapter 3 at the Telegraph Mill. Namarie! Thank you all!
[5:25 PM]
Thanks, Eonwe! Please let me know what you find! Namarie!

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 5:52 PM
Aiya, catching up!

Varda — Yesterday at 5:57 PM
Aiya, Phar : )

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 6:14 PM
As much as I like my lore pairings, Nienna and Melkor was not something I'd thought of. In a way they do seem to be opposite sides of the same coin.
[6:16 PM]
Also, while I would expect he's looked at it already, I recommend the Atlas of Middle-Earth to Sandalf, which extracts and extrapolates geological references from Tolkien's works as well.
And I think I mentioned it a few weeks ago as well, but it seems to me that the geographical structure of Mordor and even its vulcanism is not all natural, but rather part of Sauron's doings
[6:18 PM]
Final note, by coincidence I actually spent some time on tvtropes myself earlier today
[6:19 PM]
Of course, if Sandalf is trying to rationalize all geology, he might not accept Sauron as an answer

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:01 PM
Aiya Ar! Are you still here? I just checked in to the Telegraph Mill for some evening tasty beverages, and thought I might catch you here.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:02 PM
Yep, gaming a bit

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:02 PM
I went home for dinner after our first session. How are you? How has your week gone? Was ist neu, wie man sagt auf Deutsch?

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:03 PM
Eh, same old. Worked a bit, gamed a bit, watched some tv.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:03 PM
How are you feeling? Is everything good?

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:03 PM
Pretty good, for a sunday.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:03 PM
Do you have to do any work on SUnday, or is it a day off for yo?

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:03 PM
Day off.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:04 PM
Wonderful! BTW, I am not aware of the Atlas of Middle-earth. Is it a published volume, or is it online?

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:04 PM
Published.
[7:04 PM]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Atlas_of_Middle-earth
    The Atlas of Middle-earth
    The Atlas of Middle-earth by Karen Wynn Fonstad is an atlas of J. R. R. Tolkien's fictional realm of Middle-earth.
    It was published in 1981, following Tolkien's major works The Hobbit, The Lord of the Rings, and The Silmarillion.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:04 PM
I wonder if there is a used copy online somewhere.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:05 PM
Might be. I ordered it from some online shop a few years ago, I think.
[7:05 PM]
And by few, possibly 10-15. Time flies.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:05 PM
If you would be willing to give me your E-Mail address, I could send you a copy of my Chapter Three - The Geology of Middle-earth - to review pre-publication on the Valar Guild.
[7:06 PM]
Yes indeed. Time flies! Die Zeit fliegt!

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:06 PM
Could do, but I hope there's no rush in it, will try to find time when I can

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:06 PM
I am not able to send pictures or attachments on Discord, I believe.
[7:07 PM]
Not a problem. I will send you a copy . Whoa...I have to write down your E-Mail address. Hang on!

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:07 PM
I messaged you my email.
[7:07 PM]
hehe
[7:08 PM]
Imagine what that looks like to someone who doesn't know Tolkien. I've had to spell it many times

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:12 PM
I just sent you a "test" E-mail to see if I got your address entered in correctly. I added you to my E-Mail contacts list. Wow! I can actually do this stuff. Just today I was talking with a friend at the Coffee House in downtown Lincoln (they close at 1500, or I would be there now...), and I remarked how my father, who lived to age 99, was born in 1915....in Brooklyn, BEFORE there was even RADIO! He learned how to use a computer in his last few years. What a remarkable lifetime of changes.
[7:13 PM]
When my father was a boy, they still had horse-drawn wagons and carts in Brooklyn...but they also had autos and trolleys.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:13 PM
Heh. My mom has no idea how to use the internet, nor does she want to. She's got an old laptop without internet just so she can play some games like patience and various versions of bejeweled, and I have to be the one that installs them and show her how they work.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:14 PM
Is she unwilling to learn how to use E-Mail?

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:14 PM
My dad's a bit better at the internet, but still quite rusty, and limited in his capabilities there.
[7:15 PM]
She doesn't have an email, everything goes through either mine or my dad's.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:15 PM
Hang on a moment...I need to plug in my laptop. Please stand by.
[7:16 PM]
I am plugged in and back in business.
[7:17 PM]
I would suspect that your parents are younger than I am, based upon your age. My youngest daughter is 40, and has three little girls at home.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:18 PM
Yeah, they're mid-60s.
[7:18 PM]
ah, there you are, it had put you in spam

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:19 PM
I am curious as to why you picked Ar-Pharazon for a name. He was a mortal, obviously, with all the weaknesses that being mortal entails. He was seduced by Sauron,, but it seems that the majority of the people in Numenor were ripe for the plucking in terms of turning to evil.
[7:19 PM]
I am NOT spam! I am for REAL!
[7:19 PM]
he he.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:19 PM
Well, let me think... it's been a while, and I was kinda into the whole bad guy thing when it came to fiction.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:20 PM
Your parents and I could probably share a few memories over a beer sometime. Maybe someday? I still hope to do some traveling when I quit work altogether.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:20 PM
And I assumed most of the good guys were already taken.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:20 PM
But you could have been Aragorn 15, or something...or whomever.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:21 PM
Nah, full Valarguild members are supposed to have unique Tolkien-character-based names, I don't think we take Aragorn 2 to 15
[7:22 PM]
Anyway, Pharazon himself... struck me as a powerful figure, flawed as he was.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:22 PM
Oy Weh! If I ever learn to do gaming, Varda said you might consider me for full membership...but I have never played an online game, anytime, anywhere, so I do not know how to start. I have a new Lenovo laptop with an i7 processor and lots of memory, but it is not a "gaming" computer.


Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:27 PM
And while Pharazon, and much of Numenor as a whole, was flawed and ultimately had their downfall, it was still a pinnacle of a sort.
[7:27 PM]
Also I've developed a fascination with Numenor as a whole since then, so I don't regret the choice

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:27 PM
Good for you!
[7:28 PM]
Sie sind ein guter Mann, und ich wόnsche nur gute Dinge fόr Sie!

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:29 PM
Thanks
[7:29 PM]
You too!

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:30 PM
Vielen Dank! Back to English. I believe that Tolkien's deeply held religious views, as a Catholic, informed all of his writing. I also believe that Tolkien believed in the weakness of men/women, but that we have to forgive the weaknesses of our nature. He was big on pity, compassion, and forgiveness.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:31 PM
He was.
[7:31 PM]
And it's a good ideal.
[7:31 PM]
I'd also say that being aware of one's own weaknesses makes it easier to forgive them in others.
[7:31 PM]
Glass houses and whatnot.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:31 PM
Over the years, I have learned to become more and more forgiving, as I recognize weaknesses in myself, and still hope for redemption.
[7:32 PM]
You are right!
[7:32 PM]
Meanwhile, in the real world, what do you think about the invasion of the Ukraine?

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:33 PM
Frankly I was hoping we'd be able to get the Ukraine into nato before it happened, and I was a bit shocked at the reasoning Putin managed to give for the invasion, misinformed though it seems to be.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:34 PM
I was always worried about bringing Ukraine into NATO. If we did it, we should have done it as soon as Ukraine became its own nation, back in the 1990s. My gosh...you were just a kid then!
[7:35 PM]
I believe your birth year is 1986?

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:35 PM
I'm not sure what his actual plan is; so far I've heard he intends to overthrow the government there as considering it non-democratic, though how he's going to put in a puppet government on his own and claim it's more democratic than the old one, I've no idea.
[7:35 PM]
Nor how long it'll last.
[7:35 PM]
'85. My birthday's in May.
[7:36 PM]
I do know enough about history to be reminded of the Warsawpact business, though, and I don't know how far he's going to go in making sure his puppets stay seated.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:36 PM
Ah! I was close. I think that Russia is going to lose in the long run because of this. It will be more isolated than ever, and its burgeoning friendship with China is problematic for China as well. China still does most of its trading with the West, and I don't think Xi wants to piss off Europe and the U.S. He may be sorry about giving Putin support right now.
[7:36 PM]
But despite all Russia's best efforts, it still fell apart in the 1990s!

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:37 PM
Well, I don't know. It's been 8 years since he took Crimea, and he hasn't relented. I don't know what we can do to isolate him that will actually make him reconsider anything. If we even bother to act as harshly as we talk.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:38 PM
Time will tell. But it takes a little while for economic sanctions to kick in. Be patient for a bit.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:39 PM
True.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:39 PM
Das Geduld ist eine Tugend!  Patience is a virtue!

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:39 PM
Yes, but it doesn't help Ukraine, does it?

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:39 PM
Unfortunately, no.
[7:40 PM]
You are right, of course.
[7:41 PM]
There ARE going to be lots of Russian casualties. We will see how the Russian people feel about that.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:41 PM
True.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:42 PM
Feel free to write.  I shall be back in a just a moment!

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:42 PM
I think I'm gonna microwave me a chickenburger, actually... kinda hungry.
[7:47 PM]
Back. Anyway, I can't be sure how much support he has from the Russian people. He's spinned a nice yarn of propaganda about protecting Russian people in the east of the Ukraine and overthrowing a neofascist government. I've seen several Russians agree with him online.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:47 PM
Good!  I am back too!

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:47 PM
*spun

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:48 PM
We don't, however, get to see too many of the opinions that are opposed to him, given the nature of the Russian government right now...
[7:48 PM]
Just ask Mr. Navalny!

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:48 PM
Indeed.
[7:48 PM]
We just don't know.
[7:48 PM]
And the discontent needs to be pretty darn big for it to have any effect.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:49 PM
I agree. Remember Winston Churchill's famous words...something like "Russia is an enigma, wrapped in a conundrum, and surrounded by a riddle.:" or something like that.
[7:50 PM]
Hey...even I wasn't born when he said that!
[7:52 PM]
BTW...I liked your idea about Sauron possibly rearranging Mordor geologically to suit his needs. Do you think he had the power to do that? I am not sure that even Melkor could change the shape or face of Arda.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:53 PM
The Valar were pretty decent at shaping the world, putting up pieces of land etc. Didn't Morgoth raise up Thangorodrim?

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:54 PM
I guess you are right, but Sauron was not as powerful as Melkor, was he?

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:54 PM
Might be a bit beyond Sauron's power normally, but he had tricks up his sleeve. Maybe with the use of the Rνng?

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:54 PM
I don't know...you will have to look at my chapter on geology and tell me what you think when you get a chance.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:55 PM
Right

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:55 PM
I don't know if I told you...I am a Professional Geologist, licensed in Nebraska AND Wyoming...I am having my chapter on M.E. geology reviewed by another professional geologist to make sure I am not overstepping any geologic realities.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:56 PM
Ah, interesting.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:56 PM
PG 0449 in Nebraska, and PG 1842 in Wyomming.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 7:56 PM
I knew about the professional thing, but getting it reviewed should make it interesting.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 7:57 PM
The name of the reviewer(s) will appear in the published version of my paper, as is typically done for geologic papers.
[8:01 PM]
Hey...I suspect you are tired. Please forgive me for keeping you up. Hope you have a wonderful week ahead, and I will keep you posted. Look for my Chapter Three later this week! Sei gesund! and Namarie!

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 8:01 PM
It's fine, still doing my gaming stuff and then the personal report

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 8:02 PM
I do not want to intrude on your time. Sometimes I say too much, as Merry says to Aragorn, when a jest is out of place.
[8:03 PM]
We had a heat wave here today...it got up to 45 F. Not bad for late February! We should see 65 F on Tuesday, but then back to cold later in the week.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 8:04 PM
Not sure how much that is in Celcius but it's been pretty warm here for the time of year. I don't think we'll see any snow this time around.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 8:05 PM
It seems to be warmer than usual everywhere this winter. When I went skiing in Colorado in January, most of the black runs were STILL closed due to a lack of snow. We are having a drought here on the Great Plains. No snow since 1 January. I am really worried about the groundwater, and how the farmers will fare this summer. Things are not looking good.
[8:06 PM]
Most every morning this past week the morning temperature was MINUS 18 C.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 8:09 PM
That.. is pretty cold.

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 8:14 PM
It gets that way here...but Spring is just around the corner, as they say.
[8:15 PM]
I do not ride my bike to the CoHo at 0600 when it is that cold. Call me a wuss, but I take my car when it is under 15 F.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 8:15 PM
hehe

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 8:15 PM
-9 C.
[8:17 PM]
But cold temperatures make the sap rise in the Spring, they also say.

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 8:17 PM
Keeps it alert?

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 8:17 PM
Yes, he he.
[8:18 PM]
I need all the sap I can get!
[8:19 PM]
before I go....did you receive the test E-mail I sent you?

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 8:19 PM
I did, yep

Sandalf13 — Yesterday at 8:20 PM
Thanks. I will leave you to your devices. Thank you for chatting with me. Having a conversation with you across the ocean is a wonderful way to end the weekend, so thanks. I hope you have a great week ahead, again, and sei gesund! Namarie!!!!

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 8:20 PM
Namarie!
[8:24 PM]

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Personal gaming report:
[8:25 PM]
For (non)flashgaming, https://www.kongregate.com/games/snowroadgames/gragyriss-captor-of-princesses
    Kongregate
    Gragyriss, Captor of Princesses
    A strategy game about dragon life devour lambs, grow stronger, raid settlements, fight weak humans, elves and undead, kidnap beautiful princesses

[8:25 PM]
It's an old one, and I've linked it multiple times before, but I still find it a fun game and I couldn't help play through it again
[8:26 PM]
You upgrade idle-ish resources, grass, sheep and wolves, and use them to hatch and upgrade your dragon. Using the dragon you then fight enemies on the map, collecting their gold and capturing 3 princesses which give you buffs, as well!
[8:27 PM]
If you're having trouble with some fights, just upgrade the dragon more
[8:27 PM]
And there's a survival mode as well after you're done!

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 8:42 PM
Blizzard gaming:
[8:43 PM]
Hearthstone:
level 115 on the reward track, getting bits of gold as I go  Managed to get enough to buy the Onyxia's Lair miniset, as well.
[8:44 PM]
Along the way, also got the Demon Hunter to level 52, and Marshal rank in honor. 2 ranks to go!
[8:44 PM]
Brawl is the All-Star Squad: Choose a card, get 22 copies and 8 class spells in your deck.
[8:45 PM]
This time around I used Flik Skyshiv, the rogue legendary that destroys a minion and all copies of it within the game, whether it's board, hand or deck. If the opponent's chosen a minion and you manage to survive long enough to play it, it can make for a fun win
[8:46 PM]
In mercs, it seems the datamined quests for the event were true... and I'm not bothering with it. Just doing my normal mercenary playing.
[8:47 PM]
No new mercenaries gotten, but got the leveling underway for Sneed and Ragnaros, as well as getting Brightwing to level 30.
[8:48 PM]
When I'm not working on a task for a non-30 mercenary, the current target is the level 28 bounty which can give Anduin coins. Hopefully not too long until another addition to the ranks!
[8:49 PM]
WoW:
[8:50 PM]
No raiding this week. Between last week's Sylvanas kill and this week's patch, with the raid coming a week later, we took another reset off.
[8:50 PM]
Weekly is battlegrounds, where I got enough honor to reach honor level 91.
[8:51 PM]
Collected enough anima for the final weapon appearance from the armor vendor, the Harp of the Wild Hunt. Next up is the armorset from the Conservatory vendor
[8:52 PM]
Got stuff from Torghast! Finally got the Saurolisk soulshape from the Adamant Vaults, and also ran into 2 new souls to rescue in Torghast itself which were new in the patch.
[8:52 PM]
So now I've also got the Dragonhawk and the Pig soulshapes added to my repertoire
[8:54 PM]
I've not set foot in Zereth Mortis, and am hoping I can just be summoned to the raid next reset. Instead I've decided to continue on the alts, so I can continue my plan of doing the covenant campaigns before completing Korthia and then heading to Zereth.
[8:55 PM]
In doing so, I've completed Loch Modan on my mage, and most of Bloodmyst, where she had 15(!) quests in her log still. No wonder I ran into space shortage!
[8:56 PM]
In doing so she's reached 39. Next week I'll finish the last few Bloodmyst quests at the Vector Coil, and then ship her back to Azsuna to push forward to 45 again.
[8:56 PM]
And that's my report for the week!

Ar-Pharazon-V — Yesterday at 9:09 PM
namarie!

Varda — Today at 8:44 PM (Feb 28, 2022)
On the question of why Ar-Pharazon-(V) took his name, one big reason was to repair the name after a previous Ar-Pharazon had to be kicked out of the Valar Guild for horrible behavior. The name had a bad taste to us all, until our Phar redeemed it. Thank you! (edited)
[8:46 PM]
We prefer that those who use the villain names are very good people who can play the name with a touch of humor and help make gaming and text role-play fun.

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