Valar Guild

November 10, 2013 Sunday Meeting

(and into the chat marathon)
5pm EST (UTC - 5)
AIM: Valar Guild Meetingplace

Back to News
Transcript work by
Ar-Pharazon and Varda.

Attending: (4)
    ArPharazonV, EonweValar (presiding Tolkien), Indis-(V)/karakedi25, VardaValar1 (presiding business)
    Fladrif V side window, unable to join the main chat room. Menelvagor Valar during After-meeting.

Meeting begins
    Games Site updated
    Heroes of the Storm
    WoW: upcoming expansion
    LotRO: upcoming expansion (NDA lifted)
    Calculating Smaug's gold.
    Hobbit movie
    More gaming talk

You have just entered room "valarguildmeetingplace."
ArPharazonV: Aiya
VardaValar1: Aiya Golden One :-)
karakedi25 has entered the room.
karakedi25: Aiya
VardaValar1: Aiya Indis :-)
ArPharazonV: Aiya
karakedi25: I have workmen in the house, so I'll be in and out.
VardaValar1: okie dokie, thanks for letting us know, and good luck!

VardaValar1: Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo!
VardaValar1: Membership:
VardaValar1: I'm back in town after being away all week.
ArPharazonV: Aiyata
VardaValar1: Sadly no chance to fire up my notebook computer, but that's the breaks.
Eonwe Valar has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Any membership news from the rest of you?
VardaValar1: Aiya Eonwe :-)
Eonwe Valar: Heya :}
VardaValar1: Gimli, Sauron, Bilbo, Elwing, and other friends are at my house. :-)
VardaValar1: Amusingly that makes the same number that are here virtually.
VardaValar1: Any other membership news?

VardaValar1: Web:
VardaValar1: New News on Eonwe's Games Site

VardaValar1: Gaming:
VardaValar1: Non-WoW, non-LotRO news time.
VardaValar1: SWTOR has had activity from Bilbo and Sauron and myself on our Ebon Hawk branch. Gimli has been around too.
VardaValar1: Any other news?
ArPharazonV: Not much. Same old stuff, flashgaming and the GoT mmo. Not much progress to report.
Eonwe Valar: New game from Blizzard.
Eonwe Valar: Heroes of the Storm.
ArPharazonV: And Aiya Eonwe!
VardaValar1: (Fladrif shows as having a session already, although not seeing one.)
Eonwe Valar:
Eonwe Valar: I show as having invited Fladrif. That's it.
Eonwe Valar: Or no, apparently not me (thought I'm sure he was in the invite list), but I show him as having a pending invitation in the channel.
VardaValar1: I invited him earlier, that's probably it.
VardaValar1: Thanks for the link, Eonwe. : )

VardaValar1: WoW:
VardaValar1: Eonwe, would you like to tell it?
Eonwe Valar: Watch the promo trailer for Heroes of the Storm when you get the chance :}
Eonwe Valar: Sure.
VardaValar1: Sounds fun. : )
ArPharazonV: That's the team brawler game, right?
Eonwe Valar: The next WoW expansion has been announced. It is called Warlords of Draenor.
Eonwe Valar: (On Heroes of the Storm:-)Aye, it's the DoTA-style game Blizzard's been working on
ArPharazonV: Ahh, I hadn't made that link yet.
Eonwe Valar: (On Warlords of Draenor:-) Apparently we'll get to see Draenor at a point prior to its destruction via Nerzhul opening too many portals.
Eonwe Valar: I won't give too much of the currently-announced plot away in case there's anyone who doesn't like spoilers, but time travel and alternate timelines are involved.
VardaValar1: Swiss cheese world! Wonder if it'll be like the Portal game. We'll see.
ArPharazonV: Nah, this is *before* all those portals.
Eonwe Valar: Aye, and before the Orcs drank the demon blood.
ArPharazonV: Or, well, according to timelines I've seen it's *after*, but they never happened.
Eonwe Valar: Long story short, a certain person goes into the past and spins off an alternate timeline where the Orcs didn't drink the demon blood of Mannoroth. Whether we're dealing with the past of that Draenor shortly after, or the present in that alternate timeline, I'm still not sure on.
VardaValar1: Hope they're not having too much trouble advancing the main plot line.
Eonwe Valar: What we do in this alternate timeline will not affect our own past.
ArPharazonV: Slightly later in the alternate timeline, I think, after the differences have made their consequences.
ArPharazonV: I could give you a link to a timeline overview but it might be spoilerish
Eonwe Valar: It has the potential to be a very interesting story,... or a very bad one.
VardaValar1: Pre-warned like that, the link is fine.
VardaValar1: Thank you.
Eonwe Valar: My personal apprehension is that they say they're going to go into more detail on the Light and how it works. Given that I'm not a particular fan of some of the ways they've handled the Light's lore, I'm a bit concerned how the new stuff will go.
ArPharazonV: If they're turning Elune into a naaru, I won't like it!
VardaValar1: I wouldn't appreciate that either, Phar.
VardaValar1: That's a lot of WoW news. Do we have any more?
Eonwe Valar: Eluune = Naaru is the not a dealbreaker for me, but it's also not neccesary in my opinion.
VardaValar1: Not a dealbreaker, just dissappointing.
ArPharazonV: Hmm, garrisons!
Eonwe Valar: Well, there is alot to look forward to that they've announced, so I'll tryu to be a bit briefer.
Eonwe Valar: Given how they've handled the concept of "God" in the Warcraft universe, I doubt they're going to leave Elune defined as "a true diety" however.
ArPharazonV: My theory's on "benevolent old god".
Eonwe Valar: OK, so stuff to look forward to in brief:
karakedi25: back
Eonwe Valar: Toybox and heirloom UIs, maybe even tabards.
Eonwe Valar: Player housing, after a fashion, in garrisons.
Eonwe Valar: You'll be able to show yours off to friends by grouping with them.
Eonwe Valar: The stat squish.
Eonwe Valar: Some stats going away (hit, expertise, dodge, parry) as well as reforging going away.
ArPharazonV: Hang on, dodge is going away?
Eonwe Valar: Yep, apparently.
VardaValar1: Why no reforging, I wonder, too. All sounds strange.
VardaValar1: We'll see how it works out.
Eonwe Valar: No point in reforging if the stats you're getting cap benefit you with no actual cap. Hit and expertise you get to the cap and then don't want any more of.
VardaValar1: ok
Eonwe Valar: Reforge was to avoid wasted stats as much or more than it was to customize gear.
ArPharazonV: Well that all depended on your playstyle and stat-preference, really.
ArPharazonV: I know I always went more mastery and less crit than our other beartank.
VardaValar1: All those runs we did just for the cosmetics. : )
Eonwe Valar: And luck with gear.
Eonwe Valar: Well yes, Ret prefers haste, so I would reforge crit/hit/expertise to haste, but generally speaking, the problem was hit/expertise of the cap was wasted, so if you have alot of hit gear you're weaker than you could be.
Eonwe Valar: *hit/expertise over the cap
Eonwe Valar: That's why reforge was brought in.
Eonwe Valar: The final thing I'll mention (and let you all look into the rest) is new character models.
Eonwe Valar: So far, Dwarf and orc look pretty good to me.
Eonwe Valar: They're still working on the rest. Worgen and Goblin aren't slated to get new models yet, but everyone else is. Whether they'll all make it to launch is the question.
ArPharazonV: I had to look hard to see any difference, really. They just looked darker and maybe a bit wrinklier.
Eonwe Valar: And apparently, they're not looking at giving us a 5.5 so they can get Warlords of Draenor out faster.
ArPharazonV: Good. More time to get the wolf!
Eonwe Valar: I'm personally betting on spring at the soonest.
Eonwe Valar: Normally it'd be at least another year.
Eonwe Valar: If they can manage to put the expansion out as fast as they've been putting out patches, they may be able to get it out in time for people not to get too bored with Siege of Orgrimmar/Timeless Isle.
Eonwe Valar: (hehe)
VardaValar1: ^^
Eonwe Valar: The official site:
Eonwe Valar: And that concludes my news :}
VardaValar1: Thank you. : )

VardaValar1: LotRO:
VardaValar1: The Helm's Deep expansion comes out Nov. 18, grab your pre-purchase now if you're going to
VardaValar1: In big news, the NDA has been lifted. :-)
VardaValar1: Non-Disclosure Agreement
VardaValar1: so we can finally report on it.
VardaValar1: Indis, would you like to tell us a bit about it?
karakedi25: I have spent quite a bit of time in beta, and I like what I'm seeing.
karakedi25: The landscape is gorgeous and detailed (important to me, because I like neat graphics).
karakedi25: I'm enjoying the quests, both Epic Book and landscape. They've done a really nice job of integrating the book stories and ours as side players assisting the Fellowship as appropriate.
karakedi25: I'm still doing quests prior to the evacuation of Edoras (and the Golden Hall is somthing really special)...
karakedi25: so I have only been at the beginning of the storyline.
karakedi25: We get to watch and take a minor role in the exposure of Grima and the healing of Theoden.
karakedi25: The capstone, so to speak, of the expansion is the Battle of Helms Deep, in which we take part, again in minor roles, but still fun.
karakedi25: There are several separate instances, each of which takes place in a different part of the Deep and the Hornburg. I've done three of them so far.
karakedi25: They are confusing and a bit difficult at first; it helped that I had an expert partner in them, so I learned more about how they work.
karakedi25: As one gains Big Battle ranks (a separate system, with separate rewards), the battles become substantially easier, because with rank come some nice skills in whichever trait tree (again separate from the class trees) that one chooses.
Fladrifv has left the room.
karakedi25: I think we'll enjoy them as we gain expertise. They're not really like skirmishes nor raids. The aim isn't necessarily to kill lots of mobs, unless we take the 'Vanguard' (direct dps) specialty. Others are officer--give commands to squad leaders--and engineer--use siege machinery and lay nasty traps.
karakedi25: The other big thing is the major changes being made in class structure.
ArPharazonV: Engineer? Can you sabotage the bomb that'll blow up the wall? :-)
karakedi25: Turbine is implementing trait trees, so each class can take one of 3 specializations.
VardaValar1: (Fladrif trying to enter, problems.)
Fladrifv has left the room.
karakedi25: Sorry, no...they are sticking to the story as it is in the books, but you can mess up other enemy devices and plans.
karakedi25: I've been paying the most attention to the Lore-master. The 3 lines are really strong pets (blue), direct dps (red), and cc/debuffs/healing esp. power healing (yellow).
karakedi25: I've tried both blue and red, and I find them very playable. In blue, my pet has a lot more morale (HP) than I do, and he's lethal.
karakedi25: In red, I have some massive AoE damage.
karakedi25: There is still a lot of fussing about the yellow line, which a lot of forum posters think is in need of beefing up.
Fladrifv has left the room.
karakedi25: I also looked at the burglar and minstrel trait trees. All three lines for each seemed quite playable and fun, though I didn't actually try them.
karakedi25: Questions?
VardaValar1: How many players are needed to try a Big Battle?
karakedi25: Minimum solo (or duo). Maximum 12.
karakedi25: From what I read, the guardian and champion have fared well. There is a lot of grumbling from wardens.
karakedi25: RKs have some really powerful new dps stones.
karakedi25: Rune-keepers, that is.
VardaValar1: Since the stones were nerfed earlier, that's especially good to hear.
karakedi25: I'm looking forward to the expansion, even if it means another 10 levels to grind out for my multiple characters.
VardaValar1: More to do!
VardaValar1: (Fladrif has a new pc!)
karakedi25: LOTS to do.
karakedi25: New crafting tier.
karakedi25: Any more questions?
VardaValar1: Yay, crafting!
VardaValar1: One more
VardaValar1: Do we need to get a different trait set this go around?
karakedi25: Virtues go up to 18 max.
karakedi25: Not sure what you mean.
karakedi25: Youcan switch instantly from one trait tree to another, after you set them up, as long as you're not in combat.\
karakedi25: The bard only sells instruments now.
karakedi25: Travel rations not needed.
VardaValar1: Sounds like heavy streamlining.
VardaValar1: The quick switch is very good news!
VardaValar1: Terribly expensive for some classes to keep having to switch trait lines.
karakedi25: You get two trees free, and have to pay mithril coins for others.
VardaValar1: Are there more than three trees?
ArPharazonV: So, like doublespec?
VardaValar1: Aye, sounds like. : )
karakedi25: Yes, it's an improvement. On the other hand, if you want to retrait, it's pricey. Switching trait trees is free.
VardaValar1: Will our old sets of traits now be so changed that we need to work up different ones?
karakedi25: There are three trees per class. You pay one point per trait or trait rank in your current spec, and 2 points for each in one of the other trees.
karakedi25: Most of them are still there in one tree or another. Plus new ones. And we keep a lot of our base skills.
karakedi25: For example, if I'm specced red, each red trait or rank is 1 point, but if I want to get a blue trait, it will cost me 2 points while I'm specced red. If I'm specced blue, on the other hand, each trait or rank within the trait will cost 1, and red will be 2 each.
VardaValar1: Paying one point... a mithril?
karakedi25: No, you get points as you level up and complete class deeds (skill use deeds as currently). One point every 2 levels.
VardaValar1: So spending carefully is a must!
karakedi25: Indeed.
VardaValar1: A goof could be permanent towards the end
karakedi25: If you're already at a level beyond beginner, you get all the accumulated points at once.
karakedi25: no, just expensive to fix
VardaValar1: In-game gold?
karakedi25: yes
VardaValar1: That sounds workable then. : )
karakedi25: very
karakedi25: For most classes that have stances currently, the trees will correspond to those stances.
VardaValar1: ahhh
karakedi25: so one of the trees for hunter will be trapper of foes, and so on
karakedi25: for the burg, quiet knife, mischief, and gambler
VardaValar1: So like the current color lines
karakedi25: exactly
VardaValar1: I really have to leave, will read the transcript with great interest.
VardaValar1: *Hands the Hammer to Eonwe*
Eonwe Valar: *Accepts hammer*
ArPharazonV: Have fun, Varda!
VardaValar1: (Fladrif is making new LotRO characters, will need an invite later on)
VardaValar1: *flies into the sunset*
Eonwe Valar: So I've got alot to look into after the 18th, hehe.
karakedi25: I think so. :-)
Eonwe Valar: I should get in and get some more Bounders tokens to get those used up before the 18th as well.
karakedi25: Yes, good thinking.
Eonwe Valar: Thanks for all that info, Indis :}
karakedi25: There isn't much I want from the Bounders except the healing potions.
karakedi25: You're most welcome. I hope we'll get a lot of Valarites into or back into LotRO.
Eonwe Valar: Well, the mount would be something to add to my collection, but I'm not going to get 1200 or so tokens in 17 days :}
Eonwe Valar: *7 days

ArPharazonV: Hmm, now reading on the WoW blogsite about the expansion features. The UI improvements are looking really good. Should really clear up my inventory anyway, a lot of "toys" in my bags :-)
Eonwe Valar: Any other gaming news or other business before we move to Tolkien?
ArPharazonV: is what I'm talking about.
Eonwe Valar: for the US site :}
Eonwe Valar: And aye, does sound nice, especially if they get the tabards in there too.
Eonwe Valar: Giving all my Paladins access to my Argent Dawn tabard picked up during Scourge Invasion 1 would be nice.
Eonwe Valar: Anyway, if there's no other business,..

Eonwe Valar: Tolkien:
Eonwe Valar: Varda left us with the following link provided by Merry:
Eonwe Valar:
Eonwe Valar: Skimming through it, it seems amusing.
karakedi25: yes, looks like a fun topic
ArPharazonV: Just 4 piles of gold in the entire mountain?
Eonwe Valar: Well, he's estimating four in that area at least. As I recall Smaug did gather up all the gold into that one chamber.
Eonwe Valar: *Four in that chamber.
Eonwe Valar: In the books at least.
karakedi25: need/
Eonwe Valar: Now did he have enough gold in the books to actually submerge himself in it, or did he just have enough to lay on top of? That would be a question I'd add to this.
karakedi25: Dragons are usually shown lying on top of their gold. I believe Tolkien showed Smaug that way.
ArPharazonV: I'm sure he didn't swim in it like a certain duck?
Eonwe Valar: Lol, I'm certain of that as well.
Eonwe Valar: Depending on the amount of gold, how lazy Smaug is, and if he shifts in his sleep, a tall pile of gold could avalanche over him, covering him in gold.
Eonwe Valar: Checking the book, Bilbo saw him pretty clearly it seems, as Indis has already indicated is standard that Dragons lay *on* the gold.
Eonwe Valar: Both times. Smaug didn't suddenly submerge himself in the treasure to try and catch Bilbo, hehe.
ArPharazonV: That would be something. Smaug digging around under his gold, and suddenly this giant maw comes out to swallow Bilbo.
Eonwe Valar: The Dwarves of Erebor, based on the math in the article, aren't quite trillionaires.
Eonwe Valar: Of course this is based on the value of gold, not of the gems, jewels, armour, and weapons that are also supposed to be there. The Arkenstone itself has got to be worth a pretty penny.
ArPharazonV: But still a sizeable portion of the gold in this part of Middle-earth, probably.
Eonwe Valar: Probably, aye.
Eonwe Valar: I believe it says as much in the Hobbit.
Eonwe Valar: Any other comments on Smaug and/or the treasure?
ArPharazonV: I'd like some?
Eonwe Valar: hehe.Who wouldn't? :}
Eonwe Valar: OK, let's go ahead and bang the gavel here.
Eonwe Valar: *Bangs Gavel*

Eonwe Valar: Aftermeeting:
karakedi25: A pleasure seeing you all again. But time to say 'namarie.'
karakedi25 has left the room.
Eonwe Valar: Sleep well Indis :}
ArPharazonV: Namarie Indis!

ArPharazonV: By the way, whole bunch of posts and videos and images this week on PJ's facebook for The Hobbit. I admit I've not looked at them all yet, because I've had a bit of a time-shortage this week, but if it's anything like previous stuff it should be pretty good.
ArPharazonV: also,
Eonwe Valar: Cool :}

Eonwe Valar: Speaking of "by the way"s, I found out I can solo Trial of the Grand Crusader 10-man ( = ToC10 Heroic)
ArPharazonV: Heroic? Not bad. Paladins, eh.
Eonwe Valar: Did beasts, Lord Jaraxxus, and Horde Champions as Prot, switched to Ret for Twin Valkyr and Anub'Arak. With as easy as the last two were, I suspect I could've done most of the others as Ret too.
Eonwe Valar: If the tribute chest and Ardent Defender title still existed, I could've got them, hehe.
ArPharazonV: No deaths, then?
Eonwe Valar: 1 death as prot to twin Valkyr. Didn't kill them before the enrage.
ArPharazonV: Aw.
ArPharazonV: So that's why you switched.
Eonwe Valar: Aye.
Eonwe Valar: If it weren't for that, I would've got through with no deaths.
Eonwe Valar: I can solo ICC10N up to Valithria Dreamwalker last time I tried. I was within moments of winning that one but I might be able to do it in an upgrade or two if I can't already.
ArPharazonV: By healing her?
Eonwe Valar: It just got to the point where I couldn't kill the guys fast enough, keep myself up, *and* heal the dragon.
Eonwe Valar: Aye. I got her to somewhere within 5% of fully healed.
Eonwe Valar: Everything up to her was pretty easy.
Eonwe Valar: Now if only I could solo ICC25N up to Festergut and Rotface, hehe.
ArPharazonV: Hah, why?
Eonwe Valar: Well, past them really.
Eonwe Valar: Shadowmourne quest. Tabard of the Lightbringer is the closest tabard in the game we have to a Tabard of the Silver Hand.
Eonwe Valar: The other stuff is nice too, of course.
Eonwe Valar: Plus the guild achievment for having Shadowmourne.
ArPharazonV: Ah yes.
Eonwe Valar: Surprisingly (or perhaps not surprisingly) Ulduar still poses difficulty in me soloing it, at least since I don't seem to be able to get past the first boss.
ArPharazonV: Hah.
ArPharazonV: It doesn't scale up quite that well, does it?
Eonwe Valar: Doesn't seem so.
Eonwe Valar: Airship in ICC is doable, but the first boss in Ulduar is not, so kinda strange.

ArPharazonV: saving and sending transcript
ArPharazon-V: saved
ArPharazon-V: and sent
ArPharazon-V: Namarie!
ArPharazon-V (ArPharazonV) has left the room.
EonweValar: Sleep well, belatedly, Phar :}
VardaValar1: Good night Indis and Phar :-)

VardaValar1: PJ's Facebook:
VardaValar1: Hobbit Facebook:
VardaValar1: Wallpaper Generator  :-)
VardaValar1: No Arien tonight. Hope she was doing ok
Menelvagor Valar (Menelvagor Valar) has entered the room.
EonweValar: Likewise.
EonweValar: Heya Menel :}
VardaValar1: Aiya here too, Menel :-)
VardaValar1: Unusual day in LotRO. Fladrif joined and is here playing with Menel. Ioreth and Hamson are on. Sauron was on earlier.
EonweValar: Cool :}
VardaValar1: Aye :-)
Menelvagor Valar: Aiya Eonwe, and Namarie too :-P
VardaValar1: Namarie, Menel!
EonweValar: Take care :}