Valar Guild

July 7, 2013 Sunday Meeting

5pm EDT (UTC - 5)
AIM: Valar Guild Meetingplace

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Transcript work by
Ar-Pharazon and Varda.

Attending: (6)
    AriehnV, ArPharazonV, Indis-(V)/karakedi25, Gwaihir Valar, Nar-(V)/mcioutpost, VardaValar1 (presiding)

Meeting begins
    Gaming Site: LotRO, News
    Tolkien Site: Stories
    Topic: Where would the West be in our time?
    Tangent topic: Do you think Aman might be more.. transparent, from our distance?
    Topic because of the rp during After-meeting: Were the Mirkwood elves, and Thranduil, aware of Bilbo's Ring, around the time of the Battle of Five Armies? Did he ever tell them?
    LotRO talk about pipe-weed leading into health stuff.
    Gaming character bios for Valarites, for their special name in-guild.
    Celeborn and Ioreth returned to LotRO. Ioreth is having serious computer problems and may disappear again suddenly..
    Ar-Pharazon completed a post for the forum rp.

You have just entered room "valarguildmeetingplace."
ArPharazonV: Aiya
AriehnV: Aiya phara :-)
AriehnV: how are you?
ArPharazonV: Good, making our last pull of the raid in a moment :-)
VardaValar1 has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Aiya
AriehnV: very nice
VardaValar1: Aiya Arien and Phar : )
AriehnV: aiya Varda :-)
VardaValar1: Mrieil and Hurin and Irmo are on Ventrilo :-)
ArPharazonV: still in WoW, give me a few minutes
AriehnV: och aye i am sitting and the three time cursed chamber of knowledge and enjoying the view ^^
AriehnV: in Moria
VardaValar1: trying to get loose but keep getting attacked by orcs a sec.
VardaValar1: Nar is trying to come in now
mcioutpost has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Aiya Nar :-)
mcioutpost: Thanks for the invite Varda
VardaValar1: My pleasure
VardaValar1: Phar is trying to get loose from WoW
VardaValar1: Who all is here? : )
AriehnV: here and a half
VardaValar1: Very here then!
VardaValar1: We'll let the others scroll to catch up. : )

VardaValar1: Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo!
VardaValar1: Membership:
VardaValar1: Thank you to Eonwe for dealing with the spam we've been experiencing on the forum.
VardaValar1: He usually catches it before I come on, and clears it very well along with the spammer.
VardaValar1: Miriel and Irmo and Celeborn are doing fine, and we just chatted with them in Ventrilo.
VardaValar1: they said they're not on Vent much right now because the people they're gaming with [Note: in Guild Wars 2] mostly use Teamspeak, although it doesn't seem as good to them.
VardaValar1: Main thing is they're fine. : )
VardaValar1: Glaurung has covered himself with glory in testing and is joining the Navy.
AriehnV: congratulations to him :-)
VardaValar1: AECF - really nice : )
VardaValar1: Any news from the rest of you?
GwaihirValar has entered the room.
karakedi25 has entered the room.
karakedi25: aiya
VardaValar1: Aiya Indis :-)
GwaihirValar: g'day
AriehnV: Not really just that its very busy in the shop these days
AriehnV: evening both :-)
VardaValar1: Aiya Gwaihir :-)
VardaValar1: We're in membership news, if you two have anything to add?
karakedi25: nothing special other than being a year more ancient
VardaValar1: Glaurung is in boot camp so he's not even allowed a cell phone atm, but should be back in pixel land in about 6 months.
karakedi25: that's a long time to be in boot camp
VardaValar1: Ahh, Indis is our July 4 birthday! Congrats and may you see many more fireworks in the future. :-)
karakedi25: thanks

VardaValar1: Gaming:
VardaValar1: Blizzard is testing out a new launcher. Good luck with that.

VardaValar1: WoW:
VardaValar1: Patch 5.4 is coming up.
VardaValar1: new feature is supposed to be "flexible raids". It allows between 10 and 25 people to take on a raid scaled for that many people. Loot quality is between Raid Finder and Normal, with Raid Finder looting.
ArPharazonV: Allright, I've escaped.
VardaValar1: Get back in the barrrel! Might be more arrows.
ArPharazonV: Congrats Indis!
VardaValar1: After Patch 5.4 goes live, the achievement for the 5.3 Escalation will not be possible, as the NPC's and vendors will be gone. Do it right away to still be able to get the achievement and the pet.
VardaValar1: Any other WoW comments, since you just got out of WoW? : )
ArPharazonV: let's see... we're at Lei Shen in the throne of thunder raid, which isn't bad.. I finished the 5.2 and 5.3 sections of the legendary questline this week, so I have a very good cloak and am ready for the next bit...
VardaValar1: Ahh nice!
ArPharazonV: And otherwise just doing a bit of questing. Should get my last scrolls of lore achievements done, but eh, that can wait.
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AriehnV: Which achievement and which pet is that?
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ArPharazonV: pet?
ArPharazonV: Oh, what Varda said.
AriehnV: i ve got the Darkspear revolutionary title on two characters
AriehnV: and working for it on a third
ArPharazonV: That would be the hydra pet you can get from the darkspear vendor.
AriehnV: ah right
VardaValar1: Nice

VardaValar1: LotRO:
VardaValar1: Update 11.1 patch note link for June 13 (fixes have been applied since then):
VardaValar1: Helm's Deep is the next expansion coming up later this year. People are leveling alts ahead of it.
VardaValar1: The three-man team of Tulkas, Hurin, and Varda does very well on the high level instances. We've
VardaValar1: been running hunter Astald, captain Hiuro, and guardian Timbridhil. Our main problem is coming on at the same time.
VardaValar1: Any other LotRO news?
VardaValar1: Indis? Nar?
mcioutpost: Nothing earth shattering from me
VardaValar1: And I thought you were a lore-master. : )
VardaValar1: Nar is selling himself short. He's closing in on level 85 and will be getting dragged into high level runs, if we're lucky. : )

VardaValar1: For the StarCraft 2 people:
VardaValar1: Patch 2.09 came out June 20. Here's the link to the patch notes:
karakedi25: nothing earth=shattering from me either.
VardaValar1: Two lore-masters? We may have an enormous earthquake any minute.

VardaValar1: Switching gears to Web news:
VardaValar1: Games Site:
VardaValar1: Eonwe and I continue to keep updating by his emailing the programming to me for
VardaValar1: uploading. Take a look. : )
VardaValar1: It now has a new page for people starting out in LotRO, similar to the WoW Basics page.
VardaValar1: Suggestions requested for both.
karakedi25: very nice

VardaValar1: Tolkien Site news:
VardaValar1: We have a story up from Alcardilme-(T), with more incoming:
VardaValar1: "Whisssspers"
AriehnV: haha i like that Valar Standard time .. grin
ArPharazonV: Ah, right, speaking of the site... I've managed to flesh out most of the dialogue etc of my upcoming post but it's been a bit too warm or too busy to sit down and type the thing out :-) I'll try to work on that during the meeting :-)
VardaValar1: I got behind, waiting for the go-ahead on "Ten Thousand Years", and never got it. So I quit checking and got way behind. Should be seeing more of her rather scary brand of story during the week.
VardaValar1: Hah, now we'll know why Phar is quiet!
VardaValar1: On to Tolkien:
ArPharazonV: That, and I've got some browsing to catch up on as well ;-) Been a busy raid.
ArPharazonV: Got flashgames for you if you want.

VardaValar1: Ooops ok, backing up to Gaming. : )
VardaValar1: Go ahead Phar
ArPharazonV: Allright, starting with a bit of a puzzle game, which isn't too long (unless you have trouble figuring it out) but can really exercise your brain a bit with thinking and timing.
ArPharazonV: I won't give away anything else to play it because of spoilers and because it varies a bit between levels, but suffice it to say that the goal is to get through all the levels :-)
ArPharazonV: I also found a platform game which isn't *too* hard but still fun and with many varied levels, and a few extra hard goals to reach if you want.. as well as lots of different "skins" for your character to unlock, so it should keep you busy for a bit.
ArPharazonV: it's called Jelly Escape, but it's not related to the JellyGo game I showed last week.
ArPharazonV: Aaaand for the last one I've got a casual 2-key flight game which allows you to collect coins and clouds and perform stunts through hoops etc with a plane.
ArPharazonV: It's really casual, with some upgrades you can buy for the coins, but they're quite expensive so it'll take you a while to improve. But that seems fine to me, since it really seems to be made for you to take a flight now and then whenever you have a free minute; it doesn't really seem made to blaze through in an hour and then let it go. So as I said, really casual.
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ArPharazonV: just take a look, and if you have time, take a flight if you like it :-)
ArPharazonV: And that's it for me!
mcioutpost has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Thank you, Phar. :-)
VardaValar1: For those who don't know, Phar has a bit of a following on his flash posts in these transcripts. : )
VardaValar1: Especially nice for folks whose computers don't lend themselves to MMO's.
ArPharazonV: Well happy to share. There are several gaming websites I track daily, and though of course there are a lot of games that show up on multiple websites, it always gives me a varied experience.
VardaValar1: Any other comments, suggestions, news?
VardaValar1: Feel free to send in game reviews for Eonwe. Between us, we'll get them online.
ArPharazonV: And of course the Kongregate website has a "badge of the day" feature which allows me to go back and see old games I hadn't played before, like that jelly game.
AriehnV: jumping as usual from Rift to Swotr via WoW to LotrO ;-)
VardaValar1: Sort of a bookmark?
VardaValar1: Arien, keeps you from getting stale? : )
ArPharazonV: a bookmark?
VardaValar1: Try to get a character in LotRO on up to cap, going through the epic books. Helm's Deep will be on us before we know it.
VardaValar1: Shows where your old place was in a book or website.
VardaValar1: Stick a piece of paper in the book to show where you left off.
ArPharazonV: This is more a feature to introduce Kongregate gamers to other games than they're used to, and have a bit of a spotlight on games that have been forgotten.
VardaValar1: Beats turning down page corners, which is really hard to do with a computer.
VardaValar1: Ah, good thinking.
VardaValar1: As long as it doesn't feel like a pile of ads, but like help.
ArPharazonV: Indeed. You're not forced to do them.
VardaValar1: Thanks, Golden One. Always interesting.

VardaValar1: Tolkien:
VardaValar1: Where would the West be in our time?
VardaValar1: It was once part of Arda when Arda was flat, and is still on that straight line ever after Eru folded Arda's shape into roundness.
VardaValar1: If we could find that straight path, where might it lead in today's terms? Or is there no other term?
VardaValar1: Apparently the other heavenly bodies were affected the same way.
ArPharazonV: Hmm.
VardaValar1: Perhaps Eru's fairness makes any rule apply to all.
ArPharazonV: Well, if the Earth is turning...
VardaValar1: The straight line might be figured to a geosynchronous orbit, or straight out towards some constellation?
ArPharazonV: the straight path to the west would swing about in several directions depending on the rotation of the earth and our orbit around the sun, assuming it's due west from the western shores of Europe.
VardaValar1: It would probably be west from England/Numenor.
ArPharazonV: Which is Europe.
VardaValar1: Just a bit narrowed down, and aye.
AriehnV: ohh Tolkiens Version Tir Nan Og ..
VardaValar1: If we figure it out, someone might dig Phar out. Maybe we'd better not!
VardaValar1: There you go. I was thinking Faerie.
AriehnV: the Land of the Young eh?
ArPharazonV: Well, one question...
ArPharazonV: did the straight path to the west get longer when the world was made round?
VardaValar1: Includes the land of the dead too, at least for the stop-over.
AriehnV: well for him it would be Faerie or Valinor i guess yes but it corresponds a bit to Tir Nan Og
AriehnV: yip aye agreed Varda
ArPharazonV: Because if it's the same distance, Aman would be rather closer to use than, say, the moon.
VardaValar1: As to the length, it might be related as much to the mind. But aye, seems most likely to be in physical terms nearer than the moon.
ArPharazonV: In fact, we should be able to see it when the sky is clear :-) Well, we wouldn't, but Americans might.
AriehnV: the path leading there in the earliest Version was the rainbow .. olore Malle
VardaValar1: More signs of JRRT's love of the Scandinavian stories, plus a touch of religion there. :-) But mostly poetic and it looks like a bridge.
VardaValar1: Arien's right, I think.
ArPharazonV: Let's see. Circumference of the earth is 40000 km or so? I think the Atlantic ocean might be around 10000 then. The moon is around 400000 km away.
VardaValar1: Ever try to chase down the end of a rainbow? Crazy thing to do, but it is in front then behind.
AriehnV: and dont forget the bowl of gold buried there ..
ArPharazonV: So let's see the distance would be 20000km? That's one twentieth of the lunar distance :P
ArPharazonV: *let's say
VardaValar1: I can see a range, but how do you get it down to 1/20th?
ArPharazonV: Moon is 400000 km away. Assuming the path to the west is about the same as half a tour around the world now... that's 20000 km.
ArPharazonV: 1/20th.
VardaValar1: So it's an assumption, but sounds good.
ArPharazonV: Yes. I figured that if the world was folded into itself, the original distance to Aman would be the breadth of the ocean, or the other side of the globe, or somewhere in between.
AriehnV: i guess you can only assume on this one since noone of us has been there or Tolkien has put down anything and i havent met King Arthur yet to tell us :-D
VardaValar1: Makes sense to be halfway, as are so many faerie-type things. They tend to be at boundaries, halfway points.
VardaValar1: Arien, you're pretty close to Avalon aren't you? Maybe someday. : )
AriehnV: *chuckles*
VardaValar1: Those islands appearing and disappearing at the edge of the water's surface... maybe one of them.
ArPharazonV: The path to Avalon is by rainbow?
AriehnV: I guess Avalon is a similar thing or a different name for it
VardaValar1: To King Arthur.
AriehnV: their natures are very similar anyway
VardaValar1: Faerie places you mean?
AriehnV: aye
VardaValar1: Ok - so we figure Valinor could be 2000km out from the west of England. : )
VardaValar1: The path is the rainbow.
ArPharazonV: 2000? That works :-)
VardaValar1: heh, add another zero. Oops
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VardaValar1: Olore Malle for the rainbow's name.
VardaValar1: Sadly we no longer see ships along its path.
ArPharazonV: Maybe we should find some elves to make some that can go that way.
VardaValar1: Arien has a lovely link she showed me. Like to share it with the others? Blind Guardian is often relevant for us.
VardaValar1: Thank you. : )
ArPharazonV: Hah. That's a huge playlist code.
VardaValar1: This one relates to King Arthur. Mostly we look at their Tolkien stuff.
VardaValar1: Phar is working on a post for the rp. We could shift to After-meeting and give him a break to finish up?
ArPharazonV: Nah, that's allright. I can shift my attention around :-)
VardaValar1: Any more comments on the topic or would you like to bring up a new one?
VardaValar1: Arien showed the lyrics to that song too:
AriehnV: its difficult to put a thumb on it but it sure is interesting topic and sorry for the sidetracking here

ArPharazonV: Do you think Aman might be more.. transparent, from our distance? Like it would get more real if you got closer?
ArPharazonV: After all, there's a reason we can't see it :-)
AriehnV: i am an old Arthurian to the bone and it is that that got me first into Legends and fantasy
AriehnV: so first step to Tolkien and what i am today :-)
VardaValar1: A fine path to take. : )
VardaValar1: Phar, very likely.
VardaValar1: If the world was turned from it, light would be deflected too, so we would see the light straighter once we were close enough. The mists might be not just vapor from the ocean.
VardaValar1: (yes, folks, this is just fiction talk)
ArPharazonV: hehe
VardaValar1: Look at this nifty hammer over here, under the mist....
VardaValar1: *thonk*
ArPharazonV: I can hear it all the way over here.

VardaValar1: After-meeting!
VardaValar1: hehe

VardaValar1: Do LM's still need special pipe-weed to perform resurrections?
ArPharazonV: ...Pipeweed for resurrections? Now there's a trick I didn't expect.
ArPharazonV: Are all the herbs in LotRO a type of pipeweed?
VardaValar1: Nope
VardaValar1: but we can farm pipeweed for special rp effects, and we used to need it for the lore-master rez.
VardaValar1: I heard a rumor that it's no longer needed.
VardaValar1: I have some farmers if you LM's want some of the weed. : )
ArPharazonV: So much for smoking being *bad* for your health.
VardaValar1: I can leave it in the kin chest for whenever.
VardaValar1: When you're dead, not much hurts.
VardaValar1: Back in JRRT's day, no one thought it hurt.
ArPharazonV: *grin* and before that they doctored with leeches... knowledge of health and medicine does change over the years ;-)
VardaValar1: And now they're back to using leeches in some cases as better. :-)
VardaValar1: o cool. Googling Olore Malle brings up Annals of Arda first. : )
ArPharazonV: Apparently there's a trend now that bread and grains are bad for your health too.
ArPharazonV: I wonder how long that'll stick.
VardaValar1: O right, and eggs are back to being a food of choice.
VardaValar1: And studies are showing that second-hand smoke is not much of a big deal. Not like smoking directly.
VardaValar1: Of course being in a ton of smoke like a burning building is bad, heh.
VardaValar1: I figure use common sense, eat a variety of foods and not a ridiculous amount, and you're fine.
ArPharazonV: Actually I'd heard that most of the dangerous waste from a sigaret is released in the air, which means second-hand smoking is actually more dangerous.
ArPharazonV: As I said, things change :-)
VardaValar1: I wonder if it has to do with distance. Like if you're far enough away, it's attenuated enough or changed? These studies don't give much info.
karakedi25: LMs don't use pipeweed any more, thank goodness for the inventory space
AriehnV: "creeking voice" it all depends on the doses
VardaValar1: Ok, so my yeoman won't worry about it. Not much use in pipeweed farming left.
VardaValar1: Thanks Indis. : )
VardaValar1: I don't much like the smell in any case, Phar. : )

VardaValar1: Anyway, o fellow Tolkien fan club members, you are all welcome to add to the Tolkien Site.
VardaValar1: And for us using our names as gamers, its nice to make a sort of biography page telling what is the actual case for the character we were named for. Just like one for any rp group.
VardaValar1: Family members, where you were born and raised, what affects the personality and gear and muscle tone, etc.
VardaValar1: Ok, off to LotRO!
ArPharazonV: Oh, PJ's facebook has got another Hobbit production video.
VardaValar1: ah thanks!
VardaValar1: Comicon could just run these blog videos, be just great. : )
AriehnV: nice video :-) and fun too
ArPharazonV: Question!
VardaValar1: ?

ArPharazonV: Were the Mirkwood elves, and Thranduil, aware of Bilbo's Ring, around the time of the Battle of Five Armies? Did he ever tell them?
ArPharazonV: Do *we* know about the Ring he used?
VardaValar1: Nope. That almost got him killed when he was invisible and unconscious.
ArPharazonV: Thought so, upon rereading a bit. And he doesn't seem to have told them afterwards, either; we just thought he was one heck of a burglar.
VardaValar1: Gandalf had a suspicion that something wasn't right, but the others had no way of knowing what he was doing. But didn't Gandalf say he was really good? hehe
ArPharazonV: Would the Mirkwoodians know *anything* about the rings of power?
VardaValar1: Aye, but the One Ring was supposed to be long gone
ArPharazonV: So we don't know that Bilbo had a special ring, let alone that it was, as it were, the big one.
ArPharazonV: Well, that throws one option of my dialogue out the window, though maybe I might still be able to work something in.
VardaValar1: Right, we have no idea he has it.
ArPharazonV: Allright, thanks.
VardaValar1: Looking forward to your post. :-)
ArPharazonV: *grin* knowing me.. it's gonna be underwhelming
ArPharazonV: but it'll be nice
ArPharazonV: All these plans and ambitions and it turns into a really small piece ;-) wouldn't be the first time
VardaValar1: Reminds me of the apology for the long letter but he didn't have time to edit it to shortness. :-)
ArPharazonV: Heh.
ArPharazonV: That's the other side of the coin.
VardaValar1: hehe - my usual side
VardaValar1: I've posted a lot of short bits to help keep things moving. Not a bad thing to do.

VardaValar1: Celeborn is back, and Ioreth, in LotRO. :-)
VardaValar1: Ioreth's computer may give out soon, but she's with us for now.
ArPharazonV: Great :-) Always good to see friends online, no?
VardaValar1: For sure :-)
VardaValar1: Arien and Celeborn are in Ventrilo too
ArPharazonV: Let me think... it's been about 80 years between The Hobbit and our RP, right?
AriehnV: aye i remember Celeborn from a long time ago he wasnt on for a year or so
AriehnV: and aye thereabouts
VardaValar1: He's been in Guild Wars
VardaValar1: He works a lot so he only has about an hour a day to play.
AriehnV: Frali was born just after the Battle of the Five Armies
ArPharazonV: If someone in Rivendell would talk about Auros, would he call him Lord Auros? Mister Auros? Just Auros?
VardaValar1: Auros probably, but some might call him Lord Auros. Depends. I'm not sure what he's lord of.
ArPharazonV: "master Auros" will do for now. Always open for corrections of course.
ArPharazonV: Nah, I'll keep it Mr. Auros.
ArPharazonV: It's a tough one.
AriehnV: ah well he is in love with his ego anyway :-)
VardaValar1: Not really :-)
AriehnV: and carrie his nose a bit high hehe ... so a bit manners wouldnt be amiss
VardaValar1: His character is easy to misunderstand, causing interesing problems.
ArPharazonV: Posted :-)
ArPharazonV: Still quite a decent size.
VardaValar1: Thanks :-)
ArPharazonV: It doesn't mesh with the last line from your post though. I suppose I'll have to change that.
ArPharazonV: Since I'm obviously not heading to the practice grounds.
VardaValar1: Fainan was leaving it
ArPharazonV: "She strode off and spotted Calion, perhaps about to avail himself of the practice grounds as well."
VardaValar1: Looks long to me! :-)
ArPharazonV: Yes, but I like it :-)
ArPharazonV: It recaps some stuff we've been discussing and introduces a fun little.. element :-)
AriehnV: I like it too :-D
AriehnV: nice to meet Bilbo there
ArPharazonV: I actually spent some time during the meeting looking stuff up from the end of The Hobbit, as well as Many Meetings, to see what Bilbo was like at this stage.
ArPharazonV: The movie had instilled an image in my mind of a rickety old Bilbo and a bit slower in thought, but the book corrected me on that, so I made him rather more lively here.
AriehnV: nice work
AriehnV: nn all :-) Namarie
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ArPharazonV: Namarie!
VardaValar1: Great post, Phar. Just finished.
VardaValar1: Nicely handled that Fainan is coming from the direction of the practice range
VardaValar1: She's getting impatient
ArPharazonV: Hehe.
ArPharazonV: It looks like I didn't manage, in my ongoing revisions as I wrote, to put the 80 years in. But that's fine.
VardaValar1: We can't leave at all til morning, and Elrond is going to put a stopper to it anyway.
ArPharazonV: I'm just going on what Fainan asked him about being packed. Calion does not know what's decided either way, for all he knows you discussed it with Auros after Calion had walked away from the library.
ArPharazonV: That part of the conversation is yours to continue :-)
ArPharazonV: Well, it's pretty late here. I'll save and send the transcript.
VardaValar1: ok, thanks
VardaValar1: That was quite a post. Well done!
ArPharazonV: Thank you :-)
VardaValar1: Rest well. :-)
ArPharazonV: I don't post often, so when I do, I'd better make it good ;-)
ArPharazon-V: saved
ArPharazon-V: sent
ArPharazon-V: Namarie!
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VardaValar1: And you did. :-)
VardaValar1: Belated namarie!
VardaValar1: Hiya Gwaihir :-)
karakedi25: namarie
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VardaValar1: Namarie :-)