Valar Guild

ArPharazonV: I think it was you..
AriehnV: yes indeed it was me
AriehnV: u helped me getting doomriggers clasp ffrom the rookery and made Drakki a head shorter
<>ArPharazonV: Yes! I helped Arien through Upper Black Rock Spire this week, on one of her characters.
AriehnV: rather clipped his wings i think
Eonwe Valar: There's also a Developer Diary on the revamp to LotRO instances, and a Beta Journal on the LotRO store.
Eonwe Valar: Links on the Games Site for anyone interested.
AriehnV: my priest to be Precise who is now proude lvl 62 :-)
VardaValar1: Galdor says hi, has to cook dinner.
Eonwe Valar: Heya to Galdor.
AriehnV: and Varda helped my little hunter with some quests in the Barrow Downs and Book I chapter 11 in Lotro
AriehnV: hmm maybe
AriehnV: i just wondered for costumes for the Festival in the Shire fitting for a hobbit bounder
VardaValar1: Thanks Eonwe
AriehnV: maybe u can give tips ? what would be clothing fit for such a role?
VardaValar1: There are quite a variety of choices. Shirt and pants outfits as well as dresses.
Eonwe Valar: While I'm at it, make sure you're keeping your Gaming INfo up-to-date, and the GPMU is coming in 2 months :}
VardaValar1: The bounder hat and something that looks as if you could walk around the countryside.
VardaValar1: Wow, the year's flying past.
AriehnV: does the bounder hat look a bit like a traditional bavarian hat ?
AriehnV: if u know what i mean ;-)
VardaValar1: It says Bounder hat on it, and kinda.
VardaValar1: There's another a lot like it with a bigger feather. :-)
VardaValar1: Shall we move on to Tolkien now? : )
VardaValar1: If anyone has any other business, be sure to say something even if we've moved on.
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VardaValar1: Tolkien:
VardaValar1: About the rp, you've been busy. So I added a post too.
VardaValar1: Your suggestion of waves of enemies has been noted. ;-)
VardaValar1: http://valarguild.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=MEORP
VardaValar1: We can wait on discussing the rp further, if we like, since Menel and Indis are not present.
Eonwe Valar: I'm willing to discuss it.
ArPharazonV: Uhm. Yeah. I guess I'll take this time to write a long overdue post, which I promised to make a week ago.
Eonwe Valar: I have nothing jumping to mind to say, but I'm willing to discuss it :}
VardaValar1: Ok. Next wave is now starting to move in.
VardaValar1: okie dokie

VardaValar1: Another thought I'd had was about Gilraen in the books.
Eonwe Valar: So we have orcs *and* spiders this wave to watch out for.
VardaValar1: Right.
Eonwe Valar: Auros charging in already.
VardaValar1: Gilraen was raised as a ranger, but probably was already somewhat familiar with the elves.
VardaValar1: The twins especially were very intent on killing orcs because of their own mother, and would have had the chance to do this with the rangers as well as on their own.
VardaValar1: It may or may not have been the norm for the mothers of future chieftains to stay at Imladris while their sons were being taught.
VardaValar1: They may have even had a traditional room.
VardaValar1: Would most of the young chieftain's sons have been older than 2-year old Aragorn? Since they were there for training?
VardaValar1: That would mean the mothers might not have had to be there as constantly as Gilraen.
VardaValar1: She would possibly have had an unusually close relationship with the elves.
VardaValar1: Yet she was very ready to go back to the Rangers when her son was ready to go off on his own.
VardaValar1: But mostly it seemed as if she was going home to die, from the feel of it.
Eonwe Valar: I got the impression the situation with Aragorn was rare if not unique.
VardaValar1: One has to wonder what it was like for her. She was a lady human growing old in the middle of ageless elves of great ability.
VardaValar1: Aye, same here.
ArPharazonV: As for the age: It makes sense, yes. Not every son would've lost his father at the age of 2, and the first few years were probably spent being raised by the parents instead.
VardaValar1: The others would have come in for training, but not necessarily all that long. And if they lived long enough to get old, they went back to Imladris to be cared for.
ArPharazonV: If the other chieftains' sons did go there for training, it would have been at least a few years later, and parental supervision might not be all the convenient.
ArPharazonV: *all that convenient.
VardaValar1: The books do say they went in for training.
VardaValar1: They might not have stayed all the time either, maybe going back to the rangers for a weekend or a week off here and there.
ArPharazonV: Then yes. Probably starting education at the ages of 6 or 8 or something, or if not, simple training from about.. 12-14?
VardaValar1: The rangers could take care of a lot on their own, so the elves might have been for higher level stuff both book and martial?
AriehnV: Post
VardaValar1: Thanks Arien. :-)
ArPharazonV: Yes. But for heirs of the royal line, that higher level education could have been traditional.

VardaValar1: Aye, Phar.
VardaValar1: Arien, lively post. I especially like the comment about the web.
karakedi25 has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Hmm. So Estarion's hiding behind a trunk, and I've got the opportunity to surprise him.
karakedi25: hi, sorry I'm so late
AriehnV: Aiya Indis :-)
VardaValar1: Aiya
Eonwe Valar: Heya Indis.
AriehnV: just in time for the rp discussion .. i wrote a new post
ArPharazonV: One version I have right now, has me surprising him and throwing myself into him, landing us both on the ground. No injuries, nobody having an advantage over the other in that situation after they land...
VardaValar1: We were talking about Gilraen at Imladris and posting to the rp.
ArPharazonV: think Menel could agree with that?
VardaValar1: I would never assume what Menel thinks. :-)
ArPharazonV: Yyyes. That's a problem in a close confrontation unless you plan the thing out in great detail, as I believe he and Eonwe had done.
Eonwe Valar: Aye, we worked together on our dual-post, discussing it back and forth.
VardaValar1: Being online together helps. He tends to show up late.
ArPharazonV: I'd rather have it posted before he arrives though, so he doesn't get a chance to complain about me not having posted ;-)
Eonwe Valar: hehe
ArPharazonV: is "agily" a word?
ArPharazonV: probably not
Eonwe Valar: Probably missing an "e"
ArPharazonV: agiley?
Eonwe Valar: Agilely is probably a word- in an agile manner.
karakedi25: with agility
ArPharazonV: it's that they both landed on the ground... yes.. with agility, smoothly, elegantly...
ArPharazonV: nimbly?
VardaValar1: Just added a forum thread under Other Authors for Terry Pratchett. Including his website.
Eonwe Valar: Nimbly might work better.
VardaValar1: Nimbly is better, aye.
Eonwe Valar: SOme readers might trip over a word like "agilely"
VardaValar1: pun! *duck*
Eonwe Valar: D'oh, no pun intended :}
ArPharazonV: :-)
AriehnV: Nimbly , Phara i think is best
ArPharazonV: yes, I used nimbly
ArPharazonV: Allright, I have the Calaron part finished. Should I post it now, and make a new Calion post after, or add it one post? Dual posting seems a bit iffy.
ArPharazonV: *add it in one post
ArPharazonV: I could just post and edit immediately afterwards, so you've got something to look at anyway.
Eonwe Valar: Go with post/edit I think, unless you end up with some replies after.
Menelvagor Valar has entered the room.
VardaValar1: You have the two characters both in your own head, making it easier to post them at the same time.
VardaValar1: Aiya Menel. :-)
ArPharazonV: Yeah, I'm posting it now.
Menelvagor Valar: Aiya!
Eonwe Valar: Or put them both at the same time.
VardaValar1: Just who we needed for the rp. :-)
ArPharazonV: Gonna edit the Calion-part in now.
AriehnV: aiya Menel :-)
karakedi25: aiya Menel :-)
ArPharazonV: Aiya Menel! Just made a new post. Took some liberties, you'll have to check it out. Basically comes down to me tossing both of us to the ground.
ArPharazonV: The point was that to speed up the process you'd be bolting off to join the main battle after this, but of course that's your choice.
Menelvagor Valar: I'll check it out and see what I can twist your words into ^^
ArPharazonV: If you don't agree it's understandable, just thought I'd help things along.
ArPharazonV: Let's see now, what was Calion's last bit...
ArPharazonV: Looks like Calion's not in the clearing yet in his last post. I'll start there, or just cut it out with the "flashback" mode and start where we are now without explanation of what he's done in the previous round of the fight.
ArPharazonV: Hmm, I think I'm coming across as "let's get it over with" today... this can't be a good attitude to the RP. On the other hand I don't feel like posting what I did along the 10 or so posts you all made, because it just seems redundant.
ArPharazonV: What do you think?
Menelvagor Valar: up to you.
Eonwe Valar: You can just focus on the current battle, I think. No need to retrace our steps all the way back to your last post if you have nothing significant you want to add.
Menelvagor Valar: usually I think it a good idea to recap, especially if you were "present" during it all.
Menelvagor Valar: But doesn't need to be more than a sentence or two saying you were fighting alongside or some such.
ArPharazonV: True.
Menelvagor Valar: but that's just me of course.
ArPharazonV: I'll do something like that.
ArPharazonV: I don't trust my own judgement at the moment.
ArPharazonV: Maybe I'm just tired. I've been awfully tired the last week or so.
ArPharazonV: And I'm still not sure if I have a sword. Reading back a bit, I seem to have equipped myself with a long knife. I could really use a D&D character sheet about now ;-)
ArPharazonV: if Legolas can have a pair of knives, so can Calion ;-)
Eonwe Valar: Book Legolas had a long knife :}
Eonwe Valar: Movie Legolas had two :}
ArPharazonV: Good! Good.
AriehnV: HMM I see a rescue approaching .. or do u want Estarion captured?
ArPharazonV: Well, I'll stick to one knife.
ArPharazonV: The point is with my post that Estarion would make a break through it (probably killing an Orc or two in the process) and head along the ground to meet you at the battle.
ArPharazonV: If Menelvagor agrees with this, Calaron and the Orcs will follow and we can have our actual confrontation to conclude this ambush.
Menelvagor Valar: If Estarion truly sees no other way out than to flee, he will do so.
ArPharazonV: As I said, I just want to hurry things along now. It's been going on for too long, in my current opinion.
ArPharazonV: He might do it because of that. He might also think that the rest of the party is in trouble, and ambush some Orcs from behind there.
Menelvagor Valar: just a couple posts really, not long for the RP, just quite a bit of time IRL.
VardaValar1: So that would be Wave Three? : )
ArPharazonV: Then again, his plan was to draw off my forces. Leading them back to the battle would seem counterproductive.
ArPharazonV: Although the time he did split them up already, might have been enough. This way, he can get the drop on "our" second wave.
Menelvagor Valar: no, the plan was to split up the ambush.
ArPharazonV: Which you've already done. I'm not sure when you consider your plan a success.
Menelvagor Valar: by doing so, I've given the party better numerical odds.
Eonwe Valar: And allow the group more time to escape, which was shot when Auros decided to fight.
Menelvagor Valar: also true.
Menelvagor Valar: but I know when it's time to fight and when to fly.
ArPharazonV: And what is this here? You against an Orcs and an Elf with some unknown powers, a fight worth fighting? :-)
Menelvagor Valar: to quote Gandalf on two separate things: "This is one foe you cannot fight" and "Fly you fools!"
ArPharazonV: I only recall "Swords are no more use here" and "This foe is beyond any of you." Were those in the book as well?
ArPharazonV: I'm afraid my rereading has faltered a bit, I picked it up a bit in the last week but so far they're still at Bombadil's place.
Eonwe Valar: "'Fly you Fools!' and then he was gone." More or less, when he fell into the abyss.
ArPharazonV: Yeah, I remember that.
Eonwe Valar: "This foe is beyond any of you!" as the Balrog was revealed.
Menelvagor Valar: well, you know I tend to garble my quotes, so pah!
ArPharazonV: Good, at least the movie stayed true to that one.
Eonwe Valar: "Swords are no more use here." As he ushered them down the stairs from the Chamber of Mazarbul.
ArPharazonV: And that one too. Though I think in the movie he uttered that when the Balrog's glow made his first appearance?
Eonwe Valar: "This os one foe you cannot fight!" don't recall off the top of my head.
Eonwe Valar: *This is
Menelvagor Valar: and Pharzie, you know I am loath to disclose any plans I may or may not have until I actually post :-)
ArPharazonV: Probably a garbling up of the other ones, yes.
VardaValar1: In the book, Gandalf falls because the whip is around his foot and pulls him down. In the movie, there's a space when it looks as if his friends should have pulled him up.
ArPharazonV: I know, Menel. But I also like to remind you that this is not a competition, and I have no reason to make this into a personal rivalry beyond story purposes, so you deliberately trying to "see what I can twist your words into" is a bit worrying :-)
ArPharazonV: so yeah :-)
Menelvagor Valar: no worries, I was just kidding :-)
Menelvagor Valar: I just have a knack for finding interpretations you didn't even think possible :-D
ArPharazonV: In the movie it seems the whip pulled him down to him hanging on by his arms, and then letting go, before he lets go.
ArPharazonV: That would give them a chance to pull him up, yes.
ArPharazonV: In the book it's a straight tug, I think?
Menelvagor Valar: I can tell you this much, I will most likely flee, and also most likely in the general direction of the party, but depending on their exact location I may not find them.
VardaValar1: Aye, Phar.
Menelvagor Valar: which side of the path are they on btw? north or south?
ArPharazonV: Hm. Not sure how my last sentence is interpretable (I found it confusing for a bit), but the point was that the sounds of the battle were clearly to be heard, so it should not be too hard to find.
ArPharazonV: I think the clearings are to the North of the path.
ArPharazonV: At least, that's what I assumed.
ArPharazonV: If it's to the south, it would make for an easier retreat to the northwest, though.
Menelvagor Valar: well, that may be a bit of a problem.
Menelvagor Valar: if I flee, that's the side of the path I would avoid.
ArPharazonV: south?
Menelvagor Valar: the north side.
Menelvagor Valar: because that is where your force is located.
ArPharazonV: True.
VardaValar1: Party is north, I believe.
Menelvagor Valar: so I would flee along the southern part, but a goodly distance from it.
Menelvagor Valar: in sight, but far enough away to make any archers hard pressed to hit me through the foliage, underbrush and what not.
ArPharazonV: and then cutting across the path again to go north to the battle, or just continuing?
Menelvagor Valar: How can I join a battle I am not aware of?
Menelvagor Valar: as far as Estarion knows, the party has gone west.
ArPharazonV: You can hear it. And I already mentioned it. Though I realize Calaron's not the most trustworthy.
Menelvagor Valar: I haven't read your post yet.
ArPharazonV: Ah.
ArPharazonV: So.... what are we talking about here then?
Menelvagor Valar: my possibilities :-)
ArPharazonV: riiight...
Menelvagor Valar: you'll see what I do with them :-)
Eonwe Valar: Well, the sounds of battle would imply that Calaron's forces aren't chasing after us :}
Eonwe Valar: Either they were engaged by a patrol, or we stopped to fight.
ArPharazonV: This is true. Estarion might take the chance of it not being the party, and just head west along the path.
Eonwe Valar: Considering the forces, maybe a company rather than just a patrol, which if true, might be a good direction to flee since Elves aren't likely to target an Elf they see running into their field of battle.
Eonwe Valar: It's us, of course, but Estarion can hope, hehe :}
ArPharazonV: Of course. Like in any RP, splitting the party can be a lot of fun :-)
Menelvagor Valar: hehe :-)
Menelvagor Valar: reading up.
ArPharazonV: Ok, posting my edit.
ArPharazonV: Calion-part seems a bit rushed. But it'll do.
ArPharazonV: The Calaron-part is long enough anyway.
ArPharazonV: Could be fun to have some melee combat beside Frali in the next few battle-posts.
Eonwe Valar: Hey, Auros was melee-ing :}
ArPharazonV: Yeah, but I have the feeling I'm more likely to combat-bond with the dwarf than the Noldo ;-)
Eonwe Valar: Hehe :}
Eonwe Valar: Oh, read "beside" as "besides" i.e."and not just" rather than "next to."
ArPharazonV: ah :-)
Eonwe Valar: A post for Auros is formulating in my head to give more reason to later occurrences.
VardaValar1: It looks as if you made two posts in one post anyway. It's a good way to keep someone else's post from slipping between.
ArPharazonV: I should get into the head of my main character more. After this is over we've got a bit of a stretch of no Calaron coming, so a chance to develop the first brother.
AriehnV: ok people time for beddi byes :-)
VardaValar1: Sleep well!
ArPharazonV: Yeah, I did. I posted the first part, then edited in the second part.
ArPharazonV: Namarie Arien!
Eonwe Valar: Sleep well Arien :}
AriehnV: Namarie all :-)
VardaValar1: That works.
AriehnV has left the room.
Menelvagor Valar: replying :-)
ArPharazonV: as in typing, or posting?
Menelvagor Valar: typing.
ArPharazonV: Anyone ever heard of the Stratagus game engine?
Menelvagor Valar: fraid not.
ArPharazonV: It seems there's a Warcraft II version for Stratagus called "Wargus", and that's the Let's Play I'm watching now... looks like a very interesting version, with some added features.
ArPharazonV: Originally Linux I think, but apparently this person is playing it on Windows XP as well.
ArPharazonV: I think I might try it.
ArPharazonV: It's got buildqueues, groupactions (like the paladin's heal), rally points, the possibility to group up more than 9 units..
ArPharazonV: makes the whole game a bit more userfriendly
Menelvagor Valar: Is Calaron left or right handed=
Menelvagor Valar: ?*
ArPharazonV: ...I have no idea. You're going to assault him in melee then?
Menelvagor Valar: yes, and no.
Menelvagor Valar: just a feint.
Eonwe Valar: Hehe, so only the lefties stopped to think about which hand their characters used? :}
Menelvagor Valar: aye :-)
ArPharazonV: hah
Menelvagor Valar: the idea is to make a stab at Calaron's sword-arm shoulder.
Menelvagor Valar: Which I expect to be dodged or parried.
ArPharazonV: While it would be interesting to have a handed-contrast between the two brothers, unless I've said anything else before, it's probably right-handed for both so I can identify with them better.
VardaValar1: Fainan is right-handed.
ArPharazonV: Not sure yet though. There's a post earlier where I have Calaron running beside Estarion, waving a sword at him.
Eonwe Valar: You could just say "sword-arm" to escape the need to saw which arm it was, Menel.
Menelvagor Valar: but with the intention of quickly spinning, catching the Orcs midlly off-guard, managing to slay a few to break the encirclement, and flee to the party.
Menelvagor Valar: yes, but it's aimed at the shoulder, would be much easier to say right or left.
ArPharazonV: If he's running to the right of Estarion, he might as well be left-handed.
Menelvagor Valar: hey, we trade blows for a short time even though I am left-handed.
ArPharazonV: Hmm.
Menelvagor Valar: could be that he's ambi-dexterous, but which is his main hand?
Menelvagor Valar: on which side does he carry his sword for example.
Menelvagor Valar: or the sheath.
ArPharazonV: Oh well, let's not get into unnecessary details. He waved the sword in his left hand while swinging loosely at Menel, but considering it was not a deliberate attack, it needs not be his main hand.
ArPharazonV: Let's just make him right-handed.
Menelvagor Valar: okay.
Menelvagor Valar: Ah, I just figured a way of saying which side without actually saying which side :-)
ArPharazonV: Ah, that's good :-)
VardaValar1: A well-trained swordsman might be able to use either hand, although best with one.
ArPharazonV: Maedhros comes to mind, of course.
Eonwe Valar: Aye.
VardaValar1: Aye.
Eonwe Valar: And once again, The Princess Bride comes to mind... :}
Eonwe Valar: Inigo:"I must admit it, you are better than me."
Eonwe Valar: Wesley: "Then why are you smiling?"
Eonwe Valar: "Because I'm not really left-handed!" *switches sword to other hand, gains the advantage*
VardaValar1: hehe
ArPharazonV: I've heard the quote. I've heard a lot of quotes from that one. Still haven't seen it though.
Menelvagor Valar: Pharzie, may I presume that you will parry the attack?
Eonwe Valar: Wesley, losing:"There's something you should know."
Eonwe Valar: Inigo: "Oh?"
ArPharazonV: Sure, Menel.
VardaValar1: This is good.
ArPharazonV: Neither am I?
Eonwe Valar: Wesley: "I'm not left-handed either." *switches hands and wins*
ArPharazonV: hehe
VardaValar1: Aye. :-)
VardaValar1: It was a good scene. :-)
Eonwe Valar: Aye, one of my favorites, right up there when the 6-fingered man is confronted by Inigo, looks like he's going to fight, then runs :}
VardaValar1: Of course you could be a pirate and say it's not much incentive to fight fair.
Eonwe Valar: *right up there with when
Menelvagor Valar: I would have loved: Wesley: "I was just holding back for a fair fight. redoubles his attack with his left hand and wins"
VardaValar1: The running made me feel like I could believe he was the boss, had some judgment. : )
Eonwe Valar: :}
Menelvagor Valar: gah.
Eonwe Valar: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3gfFVmw0kA for those who want to see it.
Menelvagor Valar: usually I have not much trouble with spelling... but now I require some aid :-P
Menelvagor Valar: Instantaniously?
Eonwe Valar: Instantaneously.
Menelvagor Valar: yeah, thanks :-)
Menelvagor Valar: Pharzie, I have another question :-)
ArPharazonV: hmm, nice scene
ArPharazonV: yes?
Menelvagor Valar: mind if I wound you slightly?
ArPharazonV: How?
Menelvagor Valar: a shallow gash on the leg.
ArPharazonV: ...Interesting mirror to his brother. Why?
Menelvagor Valar: not much, just a stroke turned into a sweeping downwards motion, while simulataneously turning to flee.
Menelvagor Valar: basically just meant to hamper Calaron's abilities to follow.
ArPharazonV: Hmm. He'll still follow though. And he needs to be able to retreat quickly later.
Menelvagor Valar: I don't expect it to be much of hamperage, but might give an advantage at a later point.
Menelvagor Valar: just a shallow gash, nothing deeper than a quarter of an inch at its deepest point.
Menelvagor Valar: you would be able to keep going for quite some time, but eventually you'd need to worry about blood loss.
ArPharazonV: Allright. It'll give me an excuse to retreat, eventually.
Menelvagor Valar: cool.
ArPharazonV: Hmm, finished the scene now.
ArPharazonV: I want to watch this movie eventually.
Menelvagor Valar: Ok...
Menelvagor Valar: I've come to a part where I have to decide at which point to fall in with the party.
Menelvagor Valar: since time lines seem to have gotten a bit dodgy at this point, would it be possible for me to arrive just as the spiders start their advance while the orcs regroup?
Eonwe Valar: I believe last week we talked about wave 3 being when Calaron arrives?
Menelvagor Valar: and you're at wave 2 now?
ArPharazonV: Could be. Could match up, since we're behind a bit on Estarion, especially with a wound.
Eonwe Valar: Yes.
Menelvagor Valar: no worries, you'll be right on my tail.
ArPharazonV: Calaron's the only one who could match Estarion's speed, out of the Orc company.
Menelvagor Valar: I've seen to that :-D
Eonwe Valar: Yes to that we're on wave 2.
ArPharazonV: So yes. We're on wave 2, with the spiders just advancing.
Menelvagor Valar: Let me clarify, I've just taken a... what's it called, a brush from a crossbow bolt across my leg.
Menelvagor Valar: in dutch it's "schampschot"
Eonwe Valar: Flesh wound perhaps?
ArPharazonV: Didn't it hit a branch near you?
ArPharazonV: it's a graze
ArPharazonV: brush works
Menelvagor Valar: yeah, or glance :-)
Menelvagor Valar: glancing shot :-)
Menelvagor Valar: just looked it up on the net :-D
Eonwe Valar: ok.
ArPharazonV: Me too. The first page I came across said "graze" ;-)
Menelvagor Valar: you'll see what I mean soon.
Menelvagor Valar: so, the most plausible is that I will arrive as you're mopping up wave 2.
ArPharazonV: there's also a ricochet wound...
Menelvagor Valar: nah.
Menelvagor Valar: just a graze :-)
ArPharazonV: allright :-)
Eonwe Valar: For fun, another scene from Princess Bride :} http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EkBuKQEkio
Menelvagor Valar: Eonwe, do you feel there's need for more posts from the party to mop up the second wave?
Eonwe Valar: I intended one more for Auros for the second wave.
Menelvagor Valar: then I'll adjust the final part of my reply accordingly.
Eonwe Valar: Varda and Indis, did either of you plan to insert any more for the secodn wave?
Eonwe Valar: *second
ArPharazonV: the bald guy looks... so familiar...
karakedi25: I will if I see an opportunity
Menelvagor Valar: posted.
Menelvagor Valar: I've left the ending so that it gives you an opening to write me into the battle at the clearing at your convenience.
Eonwe Valar: It sounds like the second wave will be coming to an end soon.
Eonwe Valar: Post-wise, that is.
Menelvagor Valar: I was thinking of coming to you just as you are mopping up the last ones, possibly taking some out myself, but that's up to you now :-)
ArPharazonV: what do you mean with the 'better targets"?
Menelvagor Valar: better than the grazing shot on my legs :-P
Menelvagor Valar: 2 or so orcs dead / unable to pursue.
ArPharazonV: You saying they shot their own guys while trying to shoot you?
Menelvagor Valar: yup.
Menelvagor Valar: sounds like Orcs :-P
ArPharazonV: Allright, that works.
Menelvagor Valar: also why I said "unintended ones".
Menelvagor Valar: wouldn't be the first time someone shot a friendly in a melee trying to take out an attacker.
VardaValar1: The spiders I thought might be good for a few posts. Intelligent, webs, etc.
Menelvagor Valar: you indicated as much with your last post.
BFIIShotgunner has entered the room.
Menelvagor Valar: but it's not unheard of to start wave 3 while wave 2 is still attacking.
karakedi25: I'll see if I can think of a way for Meren to do some spiders in.
VardaValar1: Aiya Ecthelion
BFIIShotgunner: Aiya!
Menelvagor Valar: Aiya Ecthelion!
karakedi25: Aiya!
ArPharazonV: I had not actually counted on archers being in the troop, if that's what you mean. The whole caution-business was because I do not actually want you dead at this point.
Eonwe Valar: Hail and welcoem to the Valar Guild, Ecthelion!
Eonwe Valar: *welcome even
ArPharazonV: Aiya Ecthelion, welcome :-)
Menelvagor Valar: well, you indicated earlier, either in post, or in here, that you had some archers nearby.
VardaValar1: We were finishing up some role-playing posts on our forum.
Menelvagor Valar: I made use of that.
BFIIShotgunner: Cool :-)
Menelvagor Valar: which may be why they shot to wound.
Menelvagor Valar: and failed badly :-P
Menelvagor Valar: besides, they're orcs :-P
ArPharazonV: Allright, fine with me :-)
Eonwe Valar: Auros is mostly busy handling orcs, so unless the spiders involve themselves in that fight, he's not likely to fight them.
Menelvagor Valar: aye :-)
Eonwe Valar: It seems to me that if spiders did try to use webbing on Auros, it would cause just as much trouble for the orcs.
Menelvagor Valar: would it be possible that Estarion falls onto the rear of the orcs fighting Auros?
Menelvagor Valar: much more likely that the spiders would use webbing to keep Auros from returning to his companions.
Eonwe Valar: Let me read your post again, Menel, to get a better image in my mind.
Menelvagor Valar: okay :-)
Eonwe Valar: We're in a clearing though, so there's not a whole lot to fasten the webbing onto.
Menelvagor Valar: depends on how large the clearing is :-)
Eonwe Valar: Well, yeah, and how close Auros is to its edge,..
Menelvagor Valar: exactly.
Eonwe Valar: But I question how quickly they could put up a web adequately blocking off where Auros is engaging the orcs, and again, it would hamper the orcs' ability to engage the rest of the group.
Menelvagor Valar: and the trees surrounding the clearing are still quite large, therefore, vertically, there's still plenty of mooring for the webs.
galdorandwe has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Aiya Galdor :-)
Menelvagor Valar: true, but isn't it mainly Auros they are after?
galdorandwe: Aiya!!!!!! So happy to be back....(after being on vacation, that is)
Eonwe Valar: Heya Galdor :}
VardaValar1: The webline is good for the spider to drop down on to position itself.
Eonwe Valar: I suppos ethat is true, Menel.
VardaValar1: Yay vacations. :-)
galdorandwe: What's the topic?
ArPharazonV: How intelligent are these spiders? Do they know what Elf they're supposed to be after?
Menelvagor Valar: the RP :-)
galdorandwe: I know I'm late and all that..
VardaValar1: We're now on the forum role-play.
galdorandwe: Oh?
VardaValar1: Over three hours late, and we're still going.
Menelvagor Valar: well, they might just be content with singling one out.
Menelvagor Valar: making the rest of the group one fewer to deal with for the next wave.
VardaValar1: http://valarguild.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=MEORP
ArPharazonV: I mean, the Orcs might know "Noldo is most important" but the spiders?
Menelvagor Valar: see above comments :-)
Eonwe Valar: Calaron is leading them presumably, Phar :} Did Calaron explain it to them? :}
galdorandwe: Spiders....do you mean in game or in the books?
VardaValar1: They might notice that the Noldo is a little different looking, bigger and darker, on their own.
VardaValar1: Books.
galdorandwe: k.
Menelvagor Valar: or have a "lighter" aura.
Eonwe Valar: Looks tastier, hehe.
Menelvagor Valar: he is Noldo after all, he's seen the Blessed Land.
Menelvagor Valar: Aye.
ArPharazonV: To the Orcs, yes. The spiders are probably just there for reinforcements. You might have an Orc saying "See, that big one over there, with the dark hair, he's the one we want." to a spider?
Eonwe Valar: Well, seen, no :} Auros was born in the Second Age :}
Menelvagor Valar: after all, the more intelligent and larger spiders are descendants from Ungoliant.
Eonwe Valar: The spiders Thorin and Company ran into in Mirkwood seemed plenty smart.
ArPharazonV: Yeah, the Mirkwood spiders are intelligent enough, as we saw in The Hobbit.
VardaValar1: Whoever started the second attack wave might or might not have mentioned it. They might not realize he's important, just to kill the whole group, or wrap them up.
Menelvagor Valar: Still, Auros would seem different enough to them being of Noldorin descent :-D
VardaValar1: The spiders can speak Common, work together.
ArPharazonV: whether they can distinguish a Noldo from a bunch of Woodelves is a different matter though.
Eonwe Valar: Calaron: "I want the tall one." :}
VardaValar1: Like we might notice a larger, brighter spider in a group of spiders.
Menelvagor Valar: but, as I said, they may be content with singling one of the party out.
VardaValar1: There you go. :-)
galdorandwe: It's likely in a previous post....but have you discussed Ungoliant "taking the form of a spider"? I seem to recall that..."evil spirit" taking spider form....eventually rumoured to die from "running out of food and devouring herself.."
VardaValar1: Ungoliant and Shelob aren't the ones we have to worry about in the rp at the moment, fortunately. :-)
Menelvagor Valar: but not until after mating and devouring lesser spiders.
Menelvagor Valar: Shelob is the only "true" descendant of Ungoliant we know about.
Eonwe Valar: The only one we have left, and the spiders of Mirkwood are her descendants.
Menelvagor Valar: the others are all of lesser "stock"
galdorandwe: Shelob is the only one "still left" in the 3rd age...as a direct decendent....I believe.
VardaValar1: That's why the Mirkwood spiders are intelligent.
Menelvagor Valar: Aye, that's what I recall.
galdorandwe: So we're sticking with the spiders referred to in the Hobbit then?
Menelvagor Valar: Aye.
VardaValar1: That's what is attacking us in the role-play that we are discussing, aye.
VardaValar1: It's not the general chat section right now, although we can easily digress back into it. :-)
galdorandwe: They couldn't have been too intelligent...Bilbo sent them scurrying with a few well tossed stones and yells, right? Animal instinct...
Menelvagor Valar: We won't be encountering Shelob, unless we intend to take the high pass from Minas Morgul to Cirith Ungol, which I highly doubt :-P
Eonwe Valar: Aye, but since Shelob's intro in TT mentions that the spiders of Mirkwood are her children/descendants, we know they're going to be dangerous/intelligent.
VardaValar1: Humans aren't too intelligent either, often enough. : )
Eonwe Valar: Distractions can work on anyone :}
Menelvagor Valar: Elves tend to at times as well.
galdorandwe: Not part of the same gene pool.
Menelvagor Valar: not nearly as often as humans, but they do make mistakes.
VardaValar1: Bilbo was able to turn invisible. Neat trick.
Menelvagor Valar: no?
Menelvagor Valar: remember, all comes from Eru.
galdorandwe: They reacted to sound....I believe.
Eonwe Valar: None of the Free Peoples are perfect.
VardaValar1: They talked.
VardaValar1: They had teamwork.
Menelvagor Valar: Not even the Valar are perfect.
Eonwe Valar: And aye, the spiders of Mirkwood are able to communicate with language, and they are able to work together.
VardaValar1: If you're referring to that little mistake on the star on your left...
galdorandwe: Stick wiht the spiders and temawork...I believe they all worked as a team, that in and of itself is different than "regular" spiders....thus lending evidence to their "higher" intelligence.
Menelvagor Valar: btw, has anyone else noticed the seemingly coincidental similarity between Cirith Ungol and Shelob?
VardaValar1: Or maybe that little error of trying to bring all the elves to Valinor for their protection? : )
Eonwe Valar: Cirith Ungol = Spider's pass...
VardaValar1: The Pass of the Spider. It refers to that fact that Shelob is living in the tunnel.
galdorandwe: Direct translation?
Menelvagor Valar: Or maybe that little error Aule created?
VardaValar1: Nice of Eru to fix that.
galdorandwe: That's not an orc phrase....who then named it such?
Menelvagor Valar: though any dwarf would rightfully resent me for that comment ^^
VardaValar1: Elvish.
galdorandwe: Did the Eldar know she was there for sure?
ArPharazonV: Elvish... Numenorean/Gondorian, most likely
VardaValar1: Faramir knew about it.
Menelvagor Valar: it was a fortress built by Gondo to keep watch on Mordor after the Last Alliance.
Menelvagor Valar: Gondor*
Eonwe Valar: Minas Ithil was a GOndorian holding at one point...
Menelvagor Valar: aye.
Eonwe Valar: It would make sense that they would go up there, and seeing webbing, whether or not anyone saw Shelob herself and lived to tell the tale,...
Menelvagor Valar: As you may have read, the gates, and the watchers of Cirith Ungol weren't facing the pass, but Mordor.
VardaValar1: Guys, did you manage to finish your post before the digression?
ArPharazonV: "Yeah, let's build a tower right here, near that big nasty spider which might come down and eat all our men whenever it feels like it, but let's not rid ourselves of it first."
galdorandwe: But the name and origin...was the building of the fortress and the knowledge of Shelob...were they made at the same time?
VardaValar1: After Shelob moved in, they called it the Pass of the Spider.
galdorandwe: Previous name?
ArPharazonV: When did Shelob move in?
Menelvagor Valar: dunno actually.
galdorandwe: I'm not sure, but Sauron "left her alone" and occasionally sent prisoners there to "feed her".
Menelvagor Valar: and you have to remember that both Elves and Gondorians were greatly diminished after the Last Alliance.
galdorandwe: I seem to reall a plague and bad winter in between all that.
Menelvagor Valar: if Shelob was there already when the fort was built, it might have been in the event of an Orc host bypassing the fortress of Minas Ithil by ways of the high pass.
Eonwe Valar has left the room.
Eonwe Valar has entered the room.
Menelvagor Valar: Gondor was diminished greatly on a rather large number of events.
Menelvagor Valar: the Last Alliance was but the first.
galdorandwe: I seem to recall reading that Shelob had something to do with "carving some of the side tunnels", but the main one I'm not so sure.
Menelvagor Valar: and there's an entrance from the fort into the tunnels, though that could have been dug after Sauron moved back in.
Menelvagor Valar: or at least, Minas Ithil and Cirith Ungol were captured by his forces.
galdorandwe: AFTER, Gondor was ravaged by the plague, kin-strfe and the long winter....
Menelvagor Valar: southrons, wain riders, any number of wars.
Menelvagor Valar: Don't forget, Gondor had a relatively long term of peace and the opportunity to rebuild after the Last Alliance.

ArPharazonV: I should be going, folks. It's late.
Menelvagor Valar: Namarie Pharzie.
ArPharazonV: Will read the rest of this when Varda puts it up.
ArPharazonV: saving and sending
Menelvagor Valar: I think I might follow your example.
Menelvagor Valar: In fact, I know I will.

VardaValar1: Shelob built tunnels to intersect every orc-tunnel they tried to build around her.

After-meeting:
VardaValar1: Thanks Phar. :-)
ArPharazonV: Oh! Almost forgot.
Eonwe Valar: Well, internet disconnected, so that kills part of my transcript.
ArPharazonV: I'll be going on vacation for a week, from Friday.
VardaValar1: Sounds great!
Menelvagor Valar: not much Eonwe :-)
ArPharazonV: Yes, I promise it's the last one this summer.
VardaValar1: Awww
ArPharazonV: So anyway, no meeting for me next sunday
Menelvagor Valar: you got back immediately after.
VardaValar1: Maybe it will help make you feel less tired.
galdorandwe: Just got home from a great week on Cape Cod....completely re-energized....Vacations are under-rated.
VardaValar1: Not staying up late with us should help too. : )
ArPharazonV: I hope so. I don't think SCII will help, anyway :-)
VardaValar1: hehe
ArPharazonV: Gonna bring my mom's laptop, and a USB-stick with WoW novels in pdf form, so that should be fun.
Menelvagor Valar: Well, that's it for me, jaw splitting yawn pretty much settles it for me.
ArPharazonV: It's no E-book reader, but close enough. Maybe even reach to outside.
ArPharazonV: Ok, saving.
galdorandwe: I brought LoTR and reread every Appendix section...felt like hangin out with old friends, LOL
Menelvagor Valar: Namarie everyone!
Eonwe Valar: Sleep well Menel.

VardaValar1: Apparently Shelob was living in Cirth Ungol for around two ages of Middle-earth.

VardaValar1: Namarie!
ArPharazonV: Namarie!
ArPharazonV (7:36:35 PM): saved
Galdor (7:36:40 PM): Good night...anyone playing on-line next?
VardaValar1 (7:36:43 PM): Thank you again, Phar.  : )
VardaValar1 (7:37:02 PM): I'm going to find something to eat before worrying about anything else. But quite likely.
ArPharazonV (7:38:25 PM): Hmm. Apparently July has the same weekdays as April. *shrug*
Galdor (7:38:42 PM): BTW.....if any of you have need of class or craft-based items, please let me know...the chest in the kin-house is too small and I get LOTS of stuff (as you all know) that would be better served being given to you all than sold at the provisioner....My character is Andwe...send me mail and I'll try to send you what you need if I find it....
BFIIShotgunner (7:39:09 PM): I'm in LotrO right now while reading the conversation here :-)
VardaValar1 (7:39:56 PM): The way I handle giving out stuff is to check the kin list for people who've been online fairly recently and who might have need.
VardaValar1 (7:40:10 PM): They used to have a way to sort by craft, but annoyingly dropped it.
VardaValar1 (7:40:23 PM): We have to mouseover the name to see the craft.
Galdor (7:40:36 PM): so much easier to press "reply"
ArPharazonV (7:41:03 PM): transcript sent
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VardaValar1 (7:41:08 PM): So you just drop it on one of my characters to do it, aye. :-)
ArPharazonV (7:41:43 PM): Well, I'm off to sleep then. See you in 2 weeks!
Eonwe Valar (7:42:16 PM): Sleep well Phar.
ArPharazonV (7:42:47 PM): Namarie!
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Galdor (7:46:57 PM): Signing off to Deed in the Misty Mountains. Illordo (sp?) clued me in to the benefits of doing such a thing...very big help, that Kin...as well as others...see you all there.
Eonwe Valar (7:47:16 PM): Have fun Galdor.
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karakedi25 (8:01:09 PM): Namarie
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VardaValar1 (8:05:18 PM): Namarie all.
BFIIShotgunner (8:05:49 PM): Namarie.  I'll be in LotrO on Agarwing if anyone needs me
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Eonwe Valar (8:06:34 PM): Have fun and sleep well.
Eonwe Valar (8:06:42 PM): Working on a post right now.
VardaValar1 (8:06:48 PM): Sleep? None of us are going to sleep. : )
Eonwe Valar (8:06:51 PM): :}
VardaValar1 (8:06:55 PM): Namarie for now.
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9:05 pm Disconnected.