October 3, 2004 Meeting
AIM: Valar Guild Meetingplace
5pm EST, 22:00 GMT
Back to News
Before-meeting
Meeting
Attending (15)
Aerandir/mordacil, Ar-Pharazon, Beregond, Elatan,
Elwing, Eonwe, Fladrif, Gil-galad/Xseanzee
disco, Mablung/DemonicHorde69,
Orodreth, Theoden, Thorondor, Thror/Chugin
Chub, Turgon, Varda (presiding)
Member News
Web News
Gaming News
Guild Wars
WoW (Worlds of WarCraft)
European and US betas
Tolkien
Character bios: Fladrif, Beregond
Letters of JRRT: Letter 246,
p. 330
Seventh Anniversary discussion
After-meeting
Before-meeting:
You have just entered room "Valar Guild
Meetingplace."
TheodenValar: Aiya
ArPharazonV: Aiya
VardaValar1: Aiya
V Beregond: Aiya
FladrifV: aiya
V Beregond: ^_^
ArPharazonV: lots and lots of aiya's
V Beregond: yup
V Beregond: and
we haven't even started yet
ArPharazonV: Turgon will be present
here tonight
VardaValar1: Pre-meeting may be a
good European meeting time : )
VardaValar1: Laptop behaving for him?
ArPharazonV: yup
ArPharazonV: although he might be a
little late
VardaValar1: Yay!
V Beregond: we
noticed ^^;
VardaValar1: afk, will scroll
ArPharazonV: he asked me to tell
you, for reasons you are probably aware of
FladrifV: I have some game news but arphara will tell in the real
meeting
ArPharazonV:
neh, Fladrif, it's your news ;-)
FladrifV: but i need to get to sleep early today
ArPharazonV:
ah, that's too bad...
VardaValar1: Jotted down, Phar can
tell it if our Ent is gone
FladrifV: hehe
V Beregond: I'll prolly drop out mid-meeting...
TheodenValar: same
V Beregond: I need the sleep, as I have a king-sized japanese test
tomorrow
ArPharazonV: we have a local holiday
here, I'm free tomorrow
V Beregond: :P
ArPharazonV: so I can stay long at
the meeting :-)
FladrifV: I work on the same local place but by a internation
company
FladrifV: so no free for mee
FladrifV: -e
ArPharazonV:
ah, that's too bad
V Beregond: heh,
you'll live ;-)
Eonwe Valar has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Aiya
TheodenValar: Aiya
VardaValar1: back
FladrifV: aiya
V Beregond: hail Eonwe
VardaValar1: Aiya Eonwe : )
Eonwe Valar: heya
DemonicHorde69 has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Aiya Mablung
Eonwe Valar: I just logged into TFT
to help ensure the branch stays alive,.. seems I've got more games than
I remember playing,..
ArPharazonV: Aiya
ArPharazonV: I've spent most of the
day playing TFT :-)
VardaValar1: Sounds fun
ArPharazonV: mauls, troy, notd,
defend the lich king, and ringwar-style maps
FladrifV: weather was too good today for a pc day
Eonwe Valar:
yeah, but I haven't done any real gaming since I got it, and I've got
about 64 total games :} (don't remember having time to get that many
games :})
VardaValar1: For those of you guys
who can't come to the Tolkien part, we could run the game we did last
time for you right quick
VardaValar1: One person starts, then
taps the shoulder (so to speak) of the next person
VardaValar1: Phar, Eonwe, and I
already did it
VardaValar1: The person tells a
little about the character he role-plays in the guild
ArPharazonV: I tap Fladrif, to begin
;-)
TurgonjustTurgon has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Aiya Turgon
FladrifV: ok
ArPharazonV:
Aiya
TurgonjustTurgon: Aiya
TurgonjustTurgon: I made it! :-D
VardaValar1: Congrats
ArPharazonV: you sure did
V Beregond: welcome
^_^
TurgonjustTurgon: this time I made sure I
got the laptop last night
ArPharazonV: :-)
TurgonjustTurgon: and otherwise I
would've gone off to my mom and use her comp :-)
FladrifV: my role here is being ent and watching to the guild and
sometimes discuss the realy important matters
VardaValar1:
The game is to tell about the book character that you role-play
ArPharazonV: :-D
FladrifV: almost the same :P
VardaValar1:
hehe
TurgonjustTurgon: easy on mine :-)
Chugin Chub has entered the room.
FladrifV: Fladrif
is one of the first ents
TurgonjustTurgon:
Turgon and Gondolin is my specialty :-)
VardaValar1: Aiya Thror
Chugin Chub: hello
ArPharazonV:
Aiya
DemonicHorde69 has left the room.
VardaValar1: Let Fladrif tell his
until he taps someone who has to go soon and hasn't gone yet
Eonwe Valar: then you need to tell
about everything not involved with Turgon, Turgon :}
FladrifV: ok
MablungV has entered the room.
FladrifV: an ent in general is quite long of speaking
MablungV:
hi all
ArPharazonV: Aiya
FladrifV: ...
VardaValar1:
This is about the ent Fladrif. Won't make you tell about all ents : )
VardaValar1: Congrats, Mablung!
MablungV: yea i use deadaim it
works
ArPharazonV: woot, new name for my
buddylist
MablungV: i have work in a minute
so once again ill be reading the log later
MablungV: :(
sigh
FladrifV: the short edition FLadrif is one of the oldest ents who
lives near isengarth after sourons destruction he fled and was never
spoken of
FladrifV: like this?
VardaValar1:
That's why we have transcripts : )
VardaValar1: Aye
VardaValar1: He fled?
TheodenValar: afk for some time (need to finsih this paper on
socrates)
VardaValar1: Sounds interesting
FladrifV: whell he got higher up in the mountains
ElatanValar:
Back
VardaValar1: Welcome back
ElatanValar: thx and hello to all
FladrifV: and now I tap.....mablungv
ArPharazonV:
mablung, you still here?
FladrifV: ok I tap ....chugin chub
ArPharazonV:
thror already went, I believe... last week
FladrifV: ok ok
FladrifV: I tap the meeting
FladrifV: :P
VardaValar1:
I don't see him in the list
VardaValar1: Thror, I mean
FladrifV: gtg
ArPharazonV:
chugin chub is thror
FladrifV: namarie
ElatanValar:
Namarie mellon
Chugin Chub: i thror :P
V Beregond: aagh
V Beregond: the
colours
Elwing V has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Thror is not in the
list of those who went last week
VardaValar1: Aiya Elwing : )
Eonwe Valar: turn off highlight
please Thror
ArPharazonV: hmm... I'll check the
transcript
VardaValar1: I just did : )
Elwing V: Aiya (always surprised
when I make it in :-)
ElatanValar: Heyas Elwing
Chugin Chub: there :-)
VardaValar1: Let's go to the main
meeting now, getting late enough
V Beregond: true
top
Meeting Begins:
VardaValar1: Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo
VardaValar1: Membership News:
VardaValar1: Four members got
together live and in costume this weekend for the Texas RenFaire:
VardaValar1: Elwing, Merry, Sauron,
and Varda
VardaValar1: Much fun had by all
ElatanValar: ohh cool :-)
VardaValar1: Any other member news?
Chugin Chub: i turn 18 today :-)
VardaValar1: Woot!
ElatanValar: but does it really
count Varda :-) I mean you are family right ;-)
VardaValar1: Happy birthday
Orodreth V has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Elwing is not family
ArPharazonV: Aiya
ElatanValar: Gratz Chugin
VardaValar1: If you'd rather, I
won't mention
Chugin Chub: thanx
ArPharazonV:
GRatz
VardaValar1: Aiya Orodreth
Orodreth V: Aiya.
VardaValar1:
And we live in different cities
VardaValar1: but ok
ElatanValar: blea no it is still
cool Varda
top
VardaValar1: Web News:
VardaValar1: I have no new Web news.
Has anyone else worked on their pages?
ArPharazonV: we should come
together, all of us, some time... a true global meeting
VardaValar1: Sure, come to RenFaire,
Phar : )
ElatanValar: if you pay i`ll come
ArPharazonV: heh
ArPharazonV: the journey, you mean?
Eonwe Valar: so everyone's flying to
Texas on Phar? :}
VardaValar1: Elatan, did you have
news on your MeO page?
ElatanValar: yep :-)
ElatanValar: and no..
ArPharazonV: if only I could afford
it....
VardaValar1: heh - ok. Eonwe?
ElatanValar: it has been 2 weeks
since last update
VardaValar1: I emailed some more
updates this week to keep Eonwe busy ; )
ArPharazonV: heheh
top
VardaValar1: Gaming News:
Eonwe Valar: I'll be starting on the
new updates for the Games Page soon
VardaValar1: Fladrif, you had news?
Eonwe Valar: pardon, was typing a
bit slowly :}
VardaValar1: Tough to collect all
the info neatly and upload. Take the time you need for quality : )
ArPharazonV: Fladrif seems to be
gone... I'm surprised he let aim running
VardaValar1: Phar, you were his
designated teller if Fladrif left. Go ahead
ArPharazonV: ok
Orodreth V: Namarie
Orodreth V has left the room.
ArPharazonV: as you may recall,
earlier this year (or was it last year) there were 3 days when the game
'guildwars'
was free to everybody to download and play
ArPharazonV: in the end of october,
there will be another such 3 days
ArPharazonV: this time, the game is
(almost) finished, I think
ArPharazonV: hang on, I'll get the
exact date
VardaValar1: Thanks. Have an URL on
that?
ArPharazonV: 'The Guild Wars World
Preview Event takes place October 29 through 31, 2004.'
ArPharazonV: http://www.guildwars.com/preview/default.h
tml
FladrifV: thanks arphara :-)
FladrifV: /me is packing atm
ArPharazonV:
:-)
ArPharazonV: np
VardaValar1: Thanks!
ArPharazonV: any other details you
would like mentioned?
VardaValar1: We should be able to
pick them up from the URL, thanks
ArPharazonV: okidoki
VardaValar1: Orodreth asked me to
pass on some Game news. He had to leave
VardaValar1: I got WoS on
here, tested, and found I could not connect to any servers, so I
uninstalled. TFT is right out.
If I ever get a loaded Vanilla disk for SC, I might try that.
VardaValar1: Orodreth V: My idea for last week srill stands.
VardaValar1:
Does anyone else have Game news?
VardaValar1: Unusually fast business
meeting : )
VardaValar1: Any other news,
suggestions, comments you want to bring up?
ArPharazonV: yeah
ArPharazonV: WoW
VardaValar1: Go ahead Phar
ArPharazonV: European Beta starts this week!
ArPharazonV: I haven't gotten in
yet, though
ArPharazonV: the WoW european forum has gotten
online, too
VardaValar1: Good luck!
ArPharazonV: but only beta-testers
can post... everyone can read, though
VardaValar1: Makes sense
ArPharazonV: mails are still going
out, these few days
ArPharazonV: so there is still hope,
and even afterwards there will be different phases, with new players
VardaValar1: Eonwe has a related
correction for my last week's meeting notes
Eonwe Valar: Last week's meetings
notes said the US beta was
over. I wanted to clarify that the US closed Beta is not over, just the
7-day stress test beta.
VardaValar1: Yay!
FladrifV has left the room.
VardaValar1: So they will run both
at once and give real stress : )
ArPharazonV: oh, right, I remember
noticing that statement
Eonwe Valar: Also, they've let in
some more guys from the initial closed beta signups
Eonwe Valar: That's it from me :}
VardaValar1: Thanks!
VardaValar1: Copy/pasted onto News
page, not uploaded yet
top
VardaValar1: Tolkien:
VardaValar1: Oops. Did we have any
more comments?
ArPharazonV: no, not here
VardaValar1: Tolkien:
VardaValar1: We were continuing our
Tolkien character tag game at the before meeting
VardaValar1: Fladrif got in his
description of the ent, Fladrif, from the books
VardaValar1: He tagged Thror
VardaValar1: Thror, are you back yet?
VardaValar1: Besides making us think
about who we are, and familiarizing each other,
VardaValar1: it can help us come up
with a basis for an article about our own characters
VardaValar1: or help make a
plot-bunny for a story or poem : )
VardaValar1: No response from Thror.
VardaValar1: Fladrif's alternate tag
was Mablung
VardaValar1: Mablung are you there?
VardaValar1: This could be fast : )
ArPharazonV: Turgon perhaps?
VardaValar1: nope
VardaValar1: Beregond needs to go next, time
problem
ArPharazonV: oh, ok
VardaValar1: Go ahead, Ber
V Beregond: hm
V Beregond: I
seem to recall being a guardsman in Gondor
VardaValar1: Remember your boy?
V Beregond: friend
to Peregrin Took as well
V Beregond: My
son gave Pippin a tour of the citym as I recall
VardaValar1: Aye, Bergil did indeed.
VardaValar1: What major service did
Beregond do for Faramir?
V Beregond: I
saved him from burning ^^;
V Beregond: alongside
the Denethor
V Beregond: -the
VardaValar1: Now that's service : )
V Beregond: indeed
it is
VardaValar1: For breaking all those
rules, what were you sentenced to do?
VardaValar1: For this game, it's ok
to look up stuff : )
VardaValar1: Not a test
V Beregond: hehe
VardaValar1: Aragorn did the
sentencing
V Beregond: captainship,
wasn't it?
VardaValar1: Special captain
VardaValar1: also banishment
V Beregond: had
to guard Faramir in the healing houses
V Beregond: too
Aerandir V has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Aiya
Aerandir V: aiya
V Beregond: aiya
VardaValar1: Thanks, Beregond
VardaValar1: We have an announcement
V Beregond: Captain
of the white company ^^;
V Beregond: *done*/
ArPharazonV: Aiya
VardaValar1: Tomorrow is the Seventh Anniversary
of the Valar Guild
TurgonjustTurgon: w00000h00000 :-)
VardaValar1: Those who would like to
game, might like to check on some of the available Tourney style games
on the Tourney page and send the results to Eonwe with a cc to Varda
VardaValar1: Most will not be gaming
for the Anniversary
V Beregond: I'd
game if I could
VardaValar1: So you might like to
send a little something in to the Tolkien Encyc
VardaValar1: This tag game is partly
to give you material for that : )
VardaValar1: Poem, art, article,
drabble, story, whatever your favorite medium is
ArPharazonV: game? anniversary? what?
ArPharazonV: is there something
organized for the anniversary?
VardaValar1: I am trying to organize
something now : )
VardaValar1: Please scroll up and
see what is written, then please ask specific questions and we will try
to help
VardaValar1: Do you all know where
to find the Tourney page?
TurgonjustTurgon: under games I believe
MablungV has left the room.
ArPharazonV: trying to find it..
Aerandir V has left the room.
Aerandir V has entered the room.
Aerandir V has left the room.
Aerandir V has entered the room.
Elwing V: Happy Guild Aniversary!
(a day early)
ArPharazonV: so far, no luck
VardaValar1: hehe - yay us : )
Aerandir V has left the room.
Aerandir V has entered the room.
Eonwe Valar: www.valarguild.org/eonwe/Tourney.htm
Aerandir V has left the room.
Aerandir V has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Not FoundThe requested
URL /eonwe/Tourney.htm was not found on this server.
Aerandir V has left the room.
Aerandir V has entered the room.
Eonwe Valar: hmm then just follow
the link on the Games Page :}
Aerandir V has left the room.
Aerandir V has entered the room.
Aerandir V has left the room.
Aerandir V has entered the room.
Eonwe Valar: I was trying to do it
from memory, but I know it exists :}
Aerandir V has left the room.
TurgonjustTurgon: found it
TurgonjustTurgon: on Eonwe's games page
in the left frame
ArPharazonV: eck, this just for
Diablo?
Eonwe Valar: we have stuff for
Starcraft as well
TurgonjustTurgon: http://valarguild.org/eonwe/Tourneys.htm
Eonwe Valar: we have
yet to have any Guild Members make Tourney maps for WC3/TFT
VardaValar1: http://valarguild.org/eonwe/Tourneys.htm
Eonwe Valar: THanks
Turgon, suspected it might need the s
ArPharazonV: oh, cool, yes, I found
the starcraft-thingies
Eonwe Valar: thanks to Varda as well
:}
V Beregond: well,
I'll be leaving now. You all have a good night ^_^
ArPharazonV: Mara Lome!
VardaValar1: Thanks for gaming,
Beregond1
VardaValar1: Namarie
TurgonjustTurgon: afk for a quick sec
ArPharazonV: so, any chance for a
starcraft-tourney tomorrow?
V Beregond: Namarie
V Beregond has left the room.
mordacil has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Aiya
mordacil: aiya
VardaValar1: Problems, Aerandir?
VardaValar1: Aiya
mordacil: wouldnt let me get to
the chat with my aerandir name
ThorondorV has entered the room.
VardaValar1: ouch
VardaValar1: Glad you had a second
account
VardaValar1: Aiya Eagle : )
ThorondorV: Heya, sorry had to do
some schoolwork
ArPharazonV: Aiya
VardaValar1: Good. Don't want our
eagles to be stupid ;-)
VardaValar1: Tomorrow is our
anniverary, #7
TurgonjustTurgon: bacl
ArPharazonV: I still wish we could
have War3 tourneys like Ringwars, Lotr: Second Age, and
Silmarillion/War of the Jewels....
VardaValar1: Some of the guys might
want to get together and game, tell about their anniversary gaming on
the News and/or Forum
ArPharazonV: just too bad they're
for 12 players
VardaValar1: WE can, Phar
VardaValar1: Just get together
ArPharazonV: and how do you propose
getting 12 war3 players together for a long enough amount of time?
Eonwe Valar: mass e-mail
VardaValar1: Aye
VardaValar1: For anniversary game
VardaValar1: good luck ; )
ArPharazonV: heh
ArPharazonV: I'll think I'll stick
to the Starcraft tourneys, until we have a sufficient amount of
frequent war3-players
VardaValar1: We can also do gaming
with just guild guys according to Tourney rules we have, and having fun
trying to adapt them to other games or making new games
VardaValar1: Diablo has a lot of
Tourney set-ups
VardaValar1: and feel free to add to
the Encyc as an Anniversary contribution, especially those who have
gaming problems
VardaValar1: Who would like to play
Phar SC or BW this week?
VardaValar1: We have some SC Tourney
games
ArPharazonV: yes, I saw that on the
page
TurgonjustTurgon: I would if I could, but
this is not my comp unfortunately
TurgonjustTurgon: though with luck, my
comp will be fixed again tomorrow
ArPharazonV: wow, with a lot of
luck, I assume?
ArPharazonV: the maps seem cool
VardaValar1: Need three to play the
maps
TurgonjustTurgon: actually, tomorrow,
I'll be getting a new motherboard and processor
VardaValar1: Designed for SC, but
can be played in BW
ArPharazonV: I don't mind, I could
play either of the 2
VardaValar1: Articles etc for
Anniversary, please tag that they are for that. They will have a
special comment on them when published.
VardaValar1: Be sure to tell if you
used SC or BW on the maps : )
ArPharazonV: heh...
ArPharazonV: I guess it's really up
to the other players
ArPharazonV: assuming there are any,
of course
VardaValar1: Any other suggestions
for the Anniversary?
mordacil has left the room.
ArPharazonV: no, not really... I
don't have an article prepared or anything, and my stories are far,
far, really far from finished
mordacil has entered the room.
VardaValar1: You don't have to have
one already made
ArPharazonV: in fact, I should start
to work on them again soon...
VardaValar1: We were just doing
those quick bits helping us figure out what we could tell about our
characters
VardaValar1: Then we look them up in
the original materia
VardaValar1: l
VardaValar1: This can give ideas for
poems, stories, articles, etc
ArPharazonV: I think I'll build my
Mendara-story a bit like Tolkien built the Silm...
VardaValar1: Sometimes all we need
is a push
VardaValar1: How about something
short you can have up for next Sunday?
Elwing V: Going to say my
"namarie"s now...huzzah again (7 times!) for the Guild!
ArPharazonV: I already have an
outline, and I can add detailed pieces to it, and tie it together, in
time....
ArPharazonV: something short?
ArPharazonV: not good at short
stories
ArPharazonV: the last one I made was
how the chicken truly crossed the road ;-)
ArPharazonV: most of my stories are
huge, and take much time to finish... even if I do bring myself to
finishing/not continuing one
ArPharazonV: and these two stories
are the longest I've ever come up with....
VardaValar1: How about a poem?
TheodenValar: back and going to leave you at the same time :'( sorry about not being
more active (I would probably not said much anyway, thats just me, the
quiet type) well good night everybody
TheodenValar: Btw please send some happy thoughts my way, to help me
get this paper accepted
VardaValar1: Glad you came : )
ArPharazonV: Namarie
ArPharazonV: will do
VardaValar1: Happiness to you! And
happy 7th Anniversary!
ArPharazonV: Many thoughts of
happiness! May happiness master your life!
ArPharazonV: May nothing you strive
for ever fail again!
TheodenValar: Happy 7th anniversary! bye all
TheodenValar has left the room.
VardaValar1: Maybe we could make a
stab at keeping our AIM chat room open all day on the Fourth just for
fun : )
VardaValar1: maybe even chat!
ArPharazonV: heh, could be
ArPharazonV: although it'll be up to
the americans to keep it open for the next 12 hours or so...
ArPharazonV: we could have a virtual
party in the room :-)
ThorondorV: Well it's fourth here
already.. :-)
ArPharazonV: yup, indeed
ArPharazonV: here as well
VardaValar1: Woot! :-)
ThorondorV: I live in the future,
whee ;-)
Elwing V has left the room.
ArPharazonV: Congrats to the Guild,
for surviving 7 years, without having to lower its remarkable
conditions!
ArPharazonV: and Congrats to me, for
surviving the guild 1 year ;-)
VardaValar1: Congrats on your first
year anniversary, Phar : )
ArPharazonV: Thank you!
VardaValar1: I declare After-meeting
: )
Eonwe Valar: Only first year? Seems
longer than that :}
ArPharazonV: It's been great hanging
out with you all, and I hope to be a member for many many years to come!
ArPharazonV: no, believe me, it has
only been one year
VardaValar1: hehe
ArPharazonV: although I don't know
how I should feel about that remark ;-)
ArPharazonV: complimented or...
Eonwe Valar: Just seems you've been
here longer :}
Eonwe Valar: Figured you were workin
on Second year already ;}
ArPharazonV: well, I've been
disturbing meetings so often... I'm just present a lot
ArPharazonV: if I were here longer,
I'd probably already been striving to reach Maia-status ;-)
Eonwe Valar: afk for a sec
VardaValar1: Eonwe and I are digging
through Letters
of JRRT
VardaValar1: Maia are regular
members who act like Maia and are recognized for it
Xseanzee disco has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Aiya Gil-galad : )
ArPharazonV: right, and if I were
here longer, I'd probably be trying to act like Maia a lot more :-)
Xseanzee disco: heyyyy
VardaValar1: Seventh Anniversary of
the Guild on Oct 4 : )
Xseanzee disco: Nice.
ArPharazonV: Aiya
Xseanzee disco: 17th anniversary of me
last friday.
Xseanzee disco: the 1st
VardaValar1: We may try to keep the
chat room open for the entire 4th, starting now since it's the 4th in
Europe now
VardaValar1: Congrats and Happy
Birthday!
Xseanzee disco: thanks :-)
ArPharazonV: Congrats!
Xseanzee disco: ty.
VardaValar1: Found it, Eonwe
ArPharazonV: for he's a jolly good
fellow...
VardaValar1: pg. 330
VardaValar1: Letter 246
Eonwe Valar: back
VardaValar1: Frodo, once his need
for possession of the Ring was satisfied, would have thrown himself
into lava
VardaValar1: Welcome back : )
VardaValar1: It's mixed into a
discussion about Gollum
VardaValar1: Here's a tidbit:
VardaValar1: JRRT quote:
Eonwe Valar: that's all on the
subject? darn,.. was hoping for a somewhat larger quote,..
VardaValar1: For me perhaps the most
tragic moment in the Tale comes in II 323 ff,
VardaValar1: when Sam fails to note
the complete change in Gollum's tone and aspect."
VardaValar1: "'Nothing, nothing',
said Gollum softly,
VardaValar1: 'Nice master!' His
repentence is blighted adn all
VardaValar1: and all Frodo's pity
VardaValar1: is (in a sense) wasted.
VardaValar1: Shelob's lair becomes
inevitable."
VardaValar1: Then it talks about the
logic of the story and what would have happened if's.
VardaValar1: That's how it leads to
Frodo and what he would have done.
VardaValar1: I know you don't have
the book with you. How much typing can you stand on this? :-)
Eonwe Valar: as much as you can :}
but I won't ask for more:} You've covered the part I was looking for.
Thanks.
VardaValar1: This is after-meeting.
I don't mind if others don't : )
VardaValar1: Thanks to Ar-Pharazon
for reminding me that the Anniversary was upon us
VardaValar1: I totally lost track,
and am deeply indebted to his reminder!
VardaValar1: Taking up from
"inevitable" and remembering this is halfway into the Letter : )
ArPharazonV: No problem, really
VardaValar1: "This is due of course
to the 'logic of the story'.
VardaValar1: Sam could hardly have
acted differently.
TurgonjustTurgon: Namarie everyone, I am
trying to get some rest, early rise tomorrow
VardaValar1: (He did reach the point
of pity at last (III 221-222)
ElatanValar: Namaria Turgon
VardaValar1: Footnote 4 here
VardaValar1: Namarie!
VardaValar1: skipping footnote
VardaValar1: but for the good of
Gollum too late.)
ArPharazonV: Namarie
VardaValar1: If he had, what could
then have happened?
TurgonjustTurgon has left the room.
ElatanValar: I will have to leave
too. Namarie all and a good night
ArPharazonV: Namarie
ElatanValar has left the room.
Eonwe Valar: sleep well :}
VardaValar1: The course of the entry
into Mordor and the struggle to reach Mount Doom would have been
different, and so would the ending.
VardaValar1: Namarie! Belatedly
VardaValar1: The interest would have
shifted to Gollum.
VardaValar1: , I think, and the
battle that would have gone on between his repentence and his new love
on one side and the Ring.
VardaValar1: Though the love would
have been strengthened daily it could not have
VardaValar1: wrested the mastery
from the Ring.
VardaValar1: I think that in some
queer twisted and pitiable way Gollum would have tried
VardaValar1: (not maybe with
conscious design)
VardaValar1: to satisfy both.
VardaValar1: Certainly at some point
not long before the end he would have stolen the Ring or taken it by
violence
VardaValar1: (as he does in the
actual Tale).
VardaValar1: But 'possession'
satisfied, I think he would then have sacrificed himself for Frodo's
sake adn have voluntarily cast himself into the fiery abyss.
ArPharazonV: How did he again fall
in the abyss in the end?
Eonwe Valar: he was dancing and
gloating
ArPharazonV: he tripped, or didn't
watch where he was going?
mordacil: tripped
VardaValar1: I think that an effect
of his partial regeneration by love would have been a clearer vision
when he claimed the Ring.
ThorondorV: I'm off now too,
fellows.. good night and happy 7th.
VardaValar1: Namarie, Thorondor1
ArPharazonV: who knows... he might
have tripped on purpose, unconsciously
Eonwe Valar: take care Eagle :}
ArPharazonV: Namarie
ThorondorV: Namarie :-)
mordacil: only 6:42 here
ArPharazonV: heh
ThorondorV has left the room.
VardaValar1: He would have perceived
the evil of Sauron, and suddenly realized that he could not use the
Ring and had not the strength or stature to keep it
Eonwe Valar: This is still GOllum
you're quoting for, correct?
VardaValar1: in Sauron's despite;
the only way to keep it and hurt Sauron was to destroy it and himself
together - and in a flash
Eonwe Valar: or, should I say,
Smeagol :}
VardaValar1: he may have seen that
this would also be the greatest service to Frodo.
mordacil: I always imagined that
hte ring was worn on the "ring" finger but in the movie it was on the
index finger. what is it with a magic ring always on the index
finger?
VardaValar1: Aye, Smeagol : )
VardaValar1: Ring finger is meant to
point to one's heart
VardaValar1: back to quotes:
ArPharazonV: I thought it was on
Frodo's middle finger?
VardaValar1: Frodo in the tale
actually takes the Ring and claims it, and certainly he too would have
had a clear vision -
VardaValar1: but he was not given
any time: he was immediately attacked by Gollum.
VardaValar1: End of that quote
VardaValar1: But tons more on the
subject : )
VardaValar1: Since you know about
Gollum, you can understand Frodo from this.
Eonwe Valar: agreed
VardaValar1: Here is more on what
Frodo was considering, next part of text, read along or not : )
VardaValar1: "When Sauron was aware
of the seizure of the Ring his one hope was in its power:
VardaValar1: that the claimant would
be unable to relinquish it until Sauron had time to deal with him.
VardaValar1: Frodo too would then
probably, if no attacked, have had to take the same way:
VardaValar1: cast himself with the
Ring into the abyss.
VardaValar1: If not he would of
course have completely failed.
VardaValar1: It is an interesting
problem: how Sauron would have acted or the claimant have resisted.
VardaValar1: Sauron sent at once the
Ringwraiths.
VardaValar1: They were naturally
fully instructed and in no way deceived as to the real lordship of the
Ring.
VardaValar1: The wearer would not be
invisible to them, but the reverse;
VardaValar1: and the more vulnerable
to their wapons.
ArPharazonV: Wow, this is
interesting... I've got to get me them letters.
VardaValar1: But the situation was
now different to that under Weathertop, where Frodo acted merely in
fear adn wished only to use (in vain)
VardaValar1: the Ring's subsidiary
power of conferring invisibility.
VardaValar1: He had grown since then.
VardaValar1: Would they have been
immune from its power if he claimed it as an instrument of command and
domination?
VardaValar1: Not wholly.
VardaValar1: I do not think they
cuold have attacked him with violence, nor laid hold upon him
VardaValar1: or taken him captive;
VardaValar1: they would have feigned
to obey any minor commands of his that did not interfere with their
errand -
VardaValar1: laid upon them by
Sauron, who still through their nine rings
VardaValar1: (which he held)
VardaValar1: had primary control of
thier wills.
VardaValar1: That errand was to
remove Frodo from the Crack.
VardaValar1: Once he lost the power
or opportunity to destroy the Ring, the end could not be in
doubt --
VardaValar1: saving help from
outside,
VardaValar1: which was hardly even
remotely possible."
VardaValar1: This is Varda again.
Can you stand more? : )
Eonwe Valar: Can you dish out more?
:}
VardaValar1: You bet. : )
VardaValar1: JRRT:
VardaValar1: Frodo had become a
considerable person, but of a special kind in spiritual enlargement
rather than in increase of physical or mental power;
VardaValar1: his will was much
stronger than it had been, but so far it had been exercised in
resisting not using the Ring and with the object of destroying it.
VardaValar1: He needed time, much
time, before he could control the Ring or
VardaValar1: (which in such a case
is the same)
VardaValar1: before it could control
him;
VardaValar1: before his will and
arrogance could grow to a stature in which he could dominate other
major hostile wills.
VardaValar1: Even so for a long time
his acts and commands would still have to be seen 'good' to him,
ArPharazonV: I think I'll go work on
my story... I've got nothing to add here
VardaValar1: to be for the benefit
of others beside himself.
VardaValar1: This is for your
benefit. Namarie!
VardaValar1: JRRT:
ArPharazonV: meh, I'll remain in
this room, try to read up with the quote, it's interesting
ArPharazonV: but still, I'll write
in the meanwhile
VardaValar1: The situation as
between Frodo with the Ring adn the Eight might be compared to that of
VardaValar1: a small brave man armed
with a devastating weapon, faced by eight savage warriors of great
strength and agility armed with poisoned blades.
VardaValar1: The man's weakness was
that he did not know how to use his weapon yet
VardaValar1: ; and he was by
temperament and training averse to violence.
VardaValar1: Their weakness was that
the man's weapon was a thing that filled them with fear
VardaValar1: as an object of terror
in their religious cult, by which they had been conditioned
VardaValar1: to treat one who
wielded it with servility.
VardaValar1: I think they would have
shown 'servility'.
VardaValar1: They would have greeted
Frodo as 'Lord'.
VardaValar1: With fair speeches they
would have induced him to leave the Sammath Naur
VardaValar1: -- for instance 'to
look upon his new kingdom, and behold afar with his new sight the abode
of power that he must now claim adn turn to
VardaValar1: his own purposes'.
VardaValar1: Once outside the
chamber while he was gazing some of them would have destroyed the
entrance.
VardaValar1: Frodo would by then
probably have been already too enmeshed in great plans of reformed rule
-- like but far greater
VardaValar1: and wider than the
vision that tempted Sam (III 177) -- to heed this.
Xseanzee disco has left the room.
VardaValar1: But if he still
preserved some sanity and partly understood the significance of it, so
that he refused
VardaValar1: now to go with them to
Barad-dur, they
VardaValar1: would have simply have
waited.
VardaValar1: Until Sauron himself
came.
VardaValar1: In any case a
confrontation of Frodo and Sauron would have soon taken place, if the
Ring was intact.
VardaValar1: Its result was
inevitable.
VardaValar1: Frodo would have been
utterly overthrown: crushed to dust, or preserved in torment as a
gibbering slave.
VardaValar1: Sauron would not have
feared the Ring!
VardaValar1: It was his own and
under his will.
VardaValar1: Even from afar he had
an effect upon it, to make it work for its return to himself.
mordacil: Time to go . namarie
everyone
VardaValar1: In his actual presence,
VardaValar1: Namarie!
Eonwe Valar: Take care :}
mordacil has left the room.
ArPharazonV: Nam... too late
Xseanzee disco has left the room.
VardaValar1: none but very few of
equal stature could have hoped to withhold it from him.
VardaValar1: Of 'mortals' no one,
not even Aragorn.
VardaValar1: In the contest with the
Palantir Aragorn was the rightful owner.
VardaValar1: Also the contest took
place at a distance, and in a tale which allows the incarnation of
great spirits in a physical and destructible form
VardaValar1: their power must be far
greater when actually physically present.
VardaValar1: Sauron should be
thought of as very terrible.
VardaValar1: The form that he took
was that of a man more than human stature but not gigantic.
VardaValar1: In his earlier
incarnation he was able to veil his power (as Gandalf did)
VardaValar1: and could appear as a
commanding figure of great strength of body and supremely royal
demeanor and countenance.
VardaValar1: Of the others only
Gandalf might be expected to master him -
VardaValar1: being an emissary of
the Powers and a creature of the same order, an immortal spirit taking
physical form.
VardaValar1: "
VardaValar1: Break in quote.
VardaValar1: Eonwe, do you want this
further discussion on the other strong people who might have gone after
Sauron?
Eonwe Valar: It's interesting, but
you've already covered what I was looking for :} I'm enjoying the quote
though :}
VardaValar1: My pleasure
VardaValar1: The letter finally ends
after a discussion of these strong ones
ArPharazonV: yes, I'm enjoying it
too, I apologize for the stretch of IM interruptions, just trying to
set a background for my Mendara story :-)
VardaValar1: The upshot is Gandalf
would have been the only one, really, and would have been worse than
Sauron, self-righteous.
VardaValar1: Feel free to do your
own research Phar : )
ArPharazonV: good idea
ArPharazonV: although I might not
have the literature here you have access too
VardaValar1: You'll pick up more
ideas that way
ArPharazonV: *to
Eonwe Valar: Does that include or
exclude Saruman?
VardaValar1: Saruman is not mentioned
VardaValar1: The other two
ringbearers, Galadriel and Elrond, are
ArPharazonV: and Radagast? ;-)
VardaValar1: Not mentioned
Eonwe Valar: guess he's ruled out of
the discussion since he was no longer one of the good-guys
VardaValar1: Not in direct
opposition to Sauron, aye
VardaValar1: The ringbearers did not
contemplate a face to face confrontation either
VardaValar1: Only Gandalf could have
pulled that off
Eonwe Valar: I find it particularly
interesting even Aragorn was not up to par with Sauron
VardaValar1: Gandalf was more
powerful than Saruman
VardaValar1: Aragorn was mortal
VardaValar1: Aye
ArPharazonV: he had a ring, and he
was a Maia... Gandalf was the number one archenemy of Sauron
Eonwe Valar: maybe if he claimed the
ring, he could fight Sauron long-distance via the Palantir to gain an
edge :}
VardaValar1: :-)
VardaValar1: Since Gandalf's powers
were limited to be an Istar, he would have needed the edge, aye.
Eonwe Valar: I meant Aragorn :}
VardaValar1: Doubt if it would have
been enough, but it would certainly have helped!
VardaValar1: Now how are we going to
keep this chat room up for the Fourth?
ArPharazonV: no edge would have been
enough for Aragorn to defeat Sauron in a will-to-will-contest, I think
VardaValar1: I agree
top
After-meeting:
continuing until Oct 5 ; )
ArPharazonV: I don't think anyone of
us would be willing to keep his pc running the entire night?
VardaValar1: Night is different for
us
ArPharazonV: but still, knowing me,
I won't get back online for about 12 hours from here
VardaValar1: I'll try to keep mine
up for a few more hours
ArPharazonV: which is a part of the
night for you
VardaValar1: I might be able to do
it. Would rather have help : )
VardaValar1: But I'm going afk!
Eonwe Valar: I could probably pick
up before I go to class tomorrow,.. would be afk of course :}
Eonwe Valar: that's about 7-8 am
central
ArPharazonV: and what's the
difference with my timezone? 9-10 hours?
Eonwe Valar: hmm, gmt -600 I think
ArPharazonV: in that case, I would
be earlier than you
VardaValar1: No quest for three
since 2003? That can't be right
ArPharazonV: or about the same time
VardaValar1: I thought I reported
one for 2004 at least
VardaValar1: Will have to do it
again this week, for sure!
Eonwe Valar: hmm might've either
missed the e-mail or forgot to upload the updated TOurney page
VardaValar1: It is 6:30 pm here CST
VardaValar1: Might try that upload,
easiest fix
ArPharazonV: right, that would be..
7 hours earlier than me
VardaValar1: Go to bed, Phar : )
Eonwe Valar: assuming it's there,..
but haven't transferred everything to my new comp yet,..
ArPharazonV: I would be around an
hour earlier tomorrow than Eonwe
ArPharazonV: bed? so early? ;-)
VardaValar1: Ah the problems
Eonwe Valar: Now that I've managed
to get through the Free People missions of WotZR, I should probably put
a review up as well
Eonwe Valar: *WotR
ArPharazonV: missions? I thought it
was fully multiplayer?
Eonwe Valar: Nice graphics, terrible
World Editor,..
Eonwe Valar: WotR has single-PLayer
campaigns as well
Eonwe Valar: one for Free Peoples,
one for servants of Sauron
ArPharazonV: sounds cool, perhaps I
should consider buying it after all...
Chugin Chub has left the room.
Eonwe Valar: be sure you meet all
the minimum requirements
ArPharazonV: link?
ArPharazonV: to the requirements?
Eonwe Valar: one sec
Eonwe Valar: 800 mhz processor,, 256
RAM, 2 gig hd space,..
Eonwe Valar: I take that back, you
better have a much better graphics card than minimum :}
Eonwe Valar: or better processor/RAM
:}
Eonwe Valar: It says 32 meg
Graphics, supporting T&L
Eonwe Valar: I can tell you meeting
those min requirements aren't enough
ArPharazonV: speed: 1.66 ghz
ArPharazonV: ram: 512
ArPharazonV: hd space: about 10 gig,
could always remove stuff
ArPharazonV: graphics card... hmm...
ArPharazonV: is that like Geforce?
Eonwe Valar: My dad's comp had min
ram and processor with doublke the Graphic card, and it ran painfully
slow
Eonwe Valar: Geforce or Radeon
ArPharazonV: Geforce4 MX 420
Eonwe Valar: needs a DirectX 9 or
compatible driver
ArPharazonV: that I have
Eonwe Valar: I have't tried any
regular maps on it yet, but the missions were fun
ArPharazonV: just a sidenote: the
War of Wrath lasted 50 years?
Eonwe Valar: fate powers can make a
difference, and the very last free people mission is alot of fun :}
Eonwe Valar: not sure
Eonwe Valar: don
ArPharazonV: I don't suppose an
Elven civilization can develop much in 50 years...
Eonwe Valar: 't recall seing a
number of years assigned
VardaValar1: A lot can happen in 50
years. Take a look at Gondolin's being built
VardaValar1: Forum rp not being
updated much. Hate for it to get down to just Eonwe and me, although
we'd be terrific ; )
ArPharazonV: Hey, I'll still post...
from time to time
ArPharazonV:</