Valar Guild

February 12, 2012 Sunday Meeting

5pm EDT (GMT - 5)
AIM: Valar Guild Meetingplace

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Transcript work by
Ar-Pharazon and Varda.

Attending: (5)
    AriehnV, ArPharazonV, Eonwe Valar (presiding), Galdor-(V)/galdorandwe, Glorfindel VG

Meeting begins
    Varda, Fangorn, Eowyn, and Melkor
    Maia and Vala Honors in the guild, and what they are in the books.
    RP discussion, including how to address Legolas.
    What is quinoa?
    The difference between "who" and "whom".

You have just entered room "valarguildmeetingplace."
Eonwe Valar has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Aiya
Eonwe Valar: Heya.
galdorandwe has entered the room.
Eonwe Valar: Oh good, it won't be only two of us after all :}
Eonwe Valar: Heya Galdor :}
galdorandwe: Heya
galdorandwe: I'm off and on...trying to tune a ukulele for my daughter...very different form a guitar
Eonwe Valar: Hehe, sounds like fun :}
Eonwe Valar: OK, let's go ahead and begin.

Eonwe Valar: Elen Sila Lumenn Omentielvo!
galdorandwe: back
Eonwe Valar: Membership:
Eonwe Valar: Varda and Fangorn are visiting Eowyn for the week.
Eonwe Valar: Any other membership news?
galdorandwe: And Melkor from what I'm told.
Eonwe Valar: Aye, I think Melkor was supposed to be there at some point.

galdorandwe: I have no other membership new, but I do have a question? Are we actively recruiting in Lotro?
Eonwe Valar: We're always looking for polite individuals interested in Tolkien in any game we play.
galdorandwe: I see.
Eonwe Valar: Did you know someone who's interested?
AriehnV has entered the room.
AriehnV: Aiya there alltogether :-)
Eonwe Valar: Heya Arien :}
galdorandwe: no, not at the moment, but I did hear some talk not long ago about recruiting...wasn't sure how one does that other than run with someone in a fellowship a few times and see if they read Tolkien and were nice people...then refer them to Varda for the quiz
galdorandwe: Most of the folks I run with are already in the VG or in another kin. I don't see many folks who are not in a kin.
galdorandwe: Aiya Arien.
AriehnV: Membership canditates can also be recruited in the presence of two maias other than a vala of course
Eonwe Valar: We have a Recruiting Handbook on the guild site that gives a general idea for both Scouting and Recruiting.
AriehnV: but yes your way is absolutely the best

galdorandwe: I read it. Do we have any Maia right now?
Eonwe Valar: Any Maia or Valar can test a potential person for Membership.
AriehnV: "shines in a wild solar outbreak"
Eonwe Valar: Helps to have more so you don't have to think of alll the questions yourself, hehe.
AriehnV: eruption even thats what i mean , we should know that word by now
Eonwe Valar: Do you mean, do we have any Maiar available, or do we have any Maiar in the guild?
AriehnV: causes some nice trouble with the weather in some regions
galdorandwe: In the guild. I though you all were Vala.
Eonwe Valar: Airen here is a Maia. Menelvagor is a Maia. I am a Vala.
Eonwe Valar: *Arien
galdorandwe: I see
ArPharazonV: The names usually give it away.
AriehnV: there are plenty of other Maia i think
Eonwe Valar: Theres being a member of the Valar Guild and being Valar Honor :}
galdorandwe: Learn something new everyday :-)
AriehnV: Officer ranks are Maiar Honor
Eonwe Valar: Maiar and Valar are earned through commitment, contribution, and demonstration of Tolkien knowledge.
galdorandwe: OK
Eonwe Valar: This page should have some info interested to you:
Eonwe Valar: Bah, link didn't work, one second.
Eonwe Valar:
Glorfindel VG has entered the room.
Eonwe Valar: Gives a general idea of what members can do, and what the Council looks for in potential Maiar.
galdorandwe: Thanks
Eonwe Valar: Any other questions on Recruiting, Maia and Vala Honors, etc.? :}
galdorandwe: So one needs to apply? I though you guys selected them...Like the War Leader thing with me.
Eonwe Valar: You can apply for Maia, or you can be selected. It's happened both ways.
galdorandwe: OK.
Eonwe Valar: Applying lets us know you're interested though.
Glorfindel VG: Is name change necessary if one becomes Maia?
AriehnV: No Glorfindel only if you wish it and the namechange makes the rankchange more obvious
AriehnV: but its not obligatory
AriehnV: or honorchange rather :-)
Eonwe Valar: It's tradition, and I would encourage it to avoid confusion if nothing else (Maiar Honor bear the names of Maiar and Constellations), but it hasn't been absolutely necessary of late.
Eonwe Valar: Or rather, absolutely required.
Eonwe Valar: A name change would be required at the Vala Honor level, however, to a Vala name.
Eonwe Valar: Eonwė is the Vala Fionwė in the Lost Tales :}
ArPharazonV: Since when is Eonwe a Vala-name? :-)
Glorfindel VG: So, you're not a Vala Eonwe?
Glorfindel VG: ^^ ;-)
AriehnV: ah there we go
Eonwe Valar: I became a Vala at a time when all the standard Vala names were taken, so we had to use the names of Valar from the History of Middlr-Earth
You have just entered room "valarguildmeetingplace."
AriehnV: welcome back Phara :-)
ArPharazonV: Sorry, was kicked out after "Eonwe Valar: I became a Vala at a time when all the standard Vala names were taken, so we had to use the names of Valar from the History of Middlr-Earth"
Eonwe Valar: :}
ArPharazonV: Can I ask for an accurate recap?
Eonwe Valar: Eonwe Valar (4:30:48 PM): Before the concept of Maiar, Eonwe was Fionwe, the son of Manwe and Varda.
Eonwe Valar: That's all you missed.
ArPharazonV: Allright.
ArPharazonV: Fionwe was officially a Vala then?
Eonwe Valar: Aye.
ArPharazonV: Or just the offspring of some?
Eonwe Valar: Just like being born of two Elves makes you an Elf... :}
ArPharazonV: I was under the impression that the Valar were set, and its lesser kin or offspring were Maiar. But I might just be thinking of the great 8.
Eonwe Valar: The only real distinction in the early tales between Valar at that point was the Aratar, and there were only four ofthem at the time.
Eonwe Valar: Maiar as a concept weren't in existence yet. Generally anyone that would be a Maia in later tales were Valar in the early tales. That includes Salmar, who was the first Vala name of our current Irmo.
Eonwe Valar: Ilmarė, the handmaid of Varda, was also a Vala and Fionwė's sister.
AriehnV: land Fionwe was in love with Urwendi .. who we know as Arien
ArPharazonV: Allright, should reread the History it seems.
Eonwe Valar: Feel free to read my article, linked above *shameless plug* :}
AriehnV: did did ^^
Eonwe Valar: Any other questions on this, or any other Membership news? :}
ArPharazonV: Out of curiosity, who were the great 4? I can think of some names, but unless they were male-only, I've got more than 4 names in mind.
ArPharazonV: Aratar, that is.
Eonwe Valar: At the time, Manwė, Ulmo, Aulė, and Melkor.
ArPharazonV: Right, that's what I figured, if they were all male.
Eonwe Valar: OK, if there's no other Membership News, on we go.

Eonwe Valar: Web:
Eonwe Valar: No web news this week.

Eonwe Valar: Gaming:

Eonwe Valar: WoW:
Eonwe Valar: Lunar Festival is over. Hope you all got what you wanted from it.
AriehnV: no no wow news ?
AriehnV: i ve got some :@D
Eonwe Valar: Lothar Runs:
Eonwe Valar: Sunday:
Eonwe Valar: Pardon Arien, I'll let you report momentarily :}
Eonwe Valar: Attending:
Eonwe Valar: Members: Glorfindel, Bilbo, Varda, Eonwe, Eowyn
Eonwe Valar: Guild Friends: Kaz, Schlep
Eonwe Valar: First, Glorfindel, Bilbo, Kaz, Varda, and Eonwe took on Obsidian Sanctum, and Bilbo won the Black Drake this week. Then we ran the Valatneines bosses 4 times to max out our dungeon runs for the week.
Eonwe Valar: Afterwards, Schlep and Eowyn joined us and we gave Onyxia a go.
Eonwe Valar: (We won against Onyxia, of course :})
AriehnV: still a nice challenge if not too difficult
Eonwe Valar: Friday: Nothing here. I came in late, and everyone else was busy.
Eonwe Valar: Thus concludes my reports. Your floor, Arien :}
AriehnV: "stops jumping up and down"
AriehnV: thank you Eonwe

AriehnV: The SW:ToR has a new member
AriehnV: Riena, level 20 consular, on Republic
AriehnV: played by .. i wonder .. my brightnes i guss
AriehnV: thats the main news :-) , there is also a little bounty hunter on Empire, but she is only level 3 at the moment and still guildless
Eonwe Valar: I thought you said this was WoW news? :}
AriehnV: er i said it was no wow nes
AriehnV: sorry if i confused you there
Eonwe Valar: AriehnV (4:42:57 PM): no no wow news ?
Eonwe Valar: OK, now I know then :}
AriehnV: it was supposed to be a question , since i wanted to say is there no no-wow news then
AriehnV: my bad punctuation there
ArPharazonV: Oh, well, maybe we'd not gotten to that yet :-)
Eonwe Valar: Varda does the non-WoW, non-LotRo stuff at the top of Gaming. I usually do it at the end :}
AriehnV: yeah but normally that comes before wow .. oh right
AriehnV: thats why i was confused there
Eonwe Valar: Anyway, continue with your news :}
AriehnV: (oops on wow side just that my worgen in Pharaz guild reached lvl 85 and started a bit gearing ^^ , in normal cata heroics as it is now )
ArPharazonV: We reached lvl 15, btw ;-)
AriehnV: nice :-D
Eonwe Valar: Congrats :} Just a level behind us :}
ArPharazonV: We'll get there!
AriehnV: Annatar , that is Sauron on Republic, was kind enough to invite Riena into the guild branch and made her some nice gear
AriehnV: in the meantime she flies her own ship and flies through the quests , serious fun factor there
AriehnV: and overpowered like ... a jedi hehe
AriehnV: thats it :-)
AriehnV: Jedi Sage
AriehnV: this concludes my report
Eonwe Valar: Thanks Arien :} Glad to hear you're having fun there :}

Eonwe Valar: LotRO:
Eonwe Valar: Reports from the News Page before Varda left:
Eonwe Valar: Monday:
Eonwe Valar: Protectors of Thangulhad 6-man skirmish with 5 people: Galdor (Dolenatan, 72 captain), Gildor (Livinola, captain), Nimrodel (Cynthiajane, champion), Tulkas (Astald, hunter), and Varda (Tinwetari, minstrel).Breaching the Necromancer's Lair: same groupBattle in the Tower: Galdor (Dolenatan), Nimrodel (Cynthiajane), Pippin (Avengelina, champion), and Varda (Tinwetari).
Eonwe Valar: Wednesday:
Eonwe Valar: Wednesday instance run: We had the people, but they scattered over various pugs or were unable to come in until late.
Eonwe Valar: Saturday report from Galdor (who is afk right now):
Eonwe Valar: "The only news I can give you is that our regular Saturday raid group has begun to challenge Draigoch's Lair with the help of our friend Xax from Hobbitual."
Eonwe Valar: Thus end the LotRO report.
Eonwe Valar: Except to note that the servers are coming down tomorrow for a game update.

Eonwe Valar: Any other non-LotRO, non-WoW gaming done this week?
ArPharazonV: Some flash, but not really anything worthy that I recall.
ArPharazonV: In my mind, if it's not something I think "Wow, I gotta share this with someone" about a game, it's not really worth mentioning here ;-)
Eonwe Valar: ok :}
Eonwe Valar: Any other gaming at all? This is the time to whisper me Tolkien Topics as well.

Eonwe Valar: Tolkien:

Eonwe Valar: I think those three of us contributing to the RP here have already added something to it?
AriehnV: yeah and i just thought about a question
ArPharazonV: Oh, no, I haven't.
AriehnV: in my post Frali asks after a way description to Gimli and Gloin and wants to go for himself
ArPharazonV: Was planning to, but it just slipped my mind for the last half week.
Eonwe Valar: No worries, it happens, hehe.
AriehnV: but i guess the elves wouldnt allow that or guide him out of friendlyness anyway, but i need an answer from an npc
ArPharazonV: All this time preparing, and I'm not even sure what Calion is supposed to do in Rivendell. I suppose it's best to go with Fainan, but when we reach Legolas, I'm drawing a blank.
AriehnV: so i am just wondering whether i should do that myself or you want to do that Eonwe? you ve got the elven courtesy and experience :-) , but if you feel that i can do it myself i would be honored
ArPharazonV: Not even sure if I'm supposed to bow, or greet him with a handshake like an old friend.
AriehnV: you also can decide to go to your quarters
AriehnV: or be a nosy in the hall of fire
AriehnV: or decide to wander in thought around the valley
ArPharazonV: I"m supposed to know him from way back, since I basically grew up around Thranduil's court. So it would be odd not to go and see him, at least. Possibly discuss some things from home.
AriehnV: :-)
Eonwe Valar: Generally speaking (and by this, I mean that I see no reason not to do it this way), I think it's fine to leave interactions with random NPCs to be dealt with by the person writing the interacting character. I think you could do so fine, Arien :}
ArPharazonV: "So yeah, Legolas, when I saw my brother last, he was wearing this strange ring... you wouldn't happen to know anything about Rings of Power, would you?"
AriehnV: hehe
ArPharazonV: "Ehrr, yeah, Rings of Power, you say? I'm.. not sure I can talk about it. If you excuse me, I have things to do!" *Legolas hurries out*
Eonwe Valar: In the cases of Elrond, Dain, Thranduil, where we may meet them in a group, generally letting one person write that is for consistency in style, character, and also because it's easier, hehe.
AriehnV: well Legolas might be pleased to see you and recognise Calion but notice that he seems distracted
ArPharazonV: Possibly :-) Though if Fainan and Meren and Calion are there together, might be best to let one person handle all interactions.
AriehnV: so if he asks for the reason Calion probably might explain and get some interest and maybe questions
Eonwe Valar: I'm not sure there's a whole lot of "restricted areas" in Rivendell except perhaps personal quarters, but I would say an Elf would be willing to guide you where you needed to go, especially if this is your first time, to keep you from stumbling into personal quarters.
ArPharazonV: I could go the old cliche way of "Hey, Legolas, long time no see. I just wish it was under different circumstances." That should throw up some concern.
AriehnV: thats what i would think Eonwe , i was thinking like in the direction"Elf steps forward, smiles and bows , but it Rivendell is a very confusing place for those who are there the first time. Please, if you dont question my knowledge of the place , I am more than happy to be your guide"
Eonwe Valar: Calion and Legolas: I'm not sure it would be quite buddy-buddy. I assume there were still be a level of formality in the interaction, even if Calion is a noble.
AriehnV: without but and in question marks of course
AriehnV: but in that direction
ArPharazonV: Yes, that's true. A bow at least would be appropriate :-)
ArPharazonV: I'll think of something. Let me just write my first reply to Fainan first.
ArPharazonV: Referring to him as "Prince Legolas" seems a bit odd, now that I look at my post. Would Lord Legolas be better?
Eonwe Valar: Legolas is a prince, so the first is fine.
Eonwe Valar: Although I don't recall many interactions where addressing the royal heir was exemplified.
ArPharazonV: Not an address, but a way to call him in his mind. "Calion decided it was a good idea to meet with Prince Legolas"
Eonwe Valar: Same general idea.
ArPharazonV: I could just call him "the Prince" but so shortly after Meren did the same seems so repetitive. And just calling him Legolas seems a bit too forward.
Eonwe Valar: Assuming you'd think about a person in the same way you'd address them.
ArPharazonV: Well, to think of him as just Legolas, even if it's just a thought, does imply a certain familiarity which might not be appropriate, even though, as you said, Calion's a noble.
ArPharazonV: It just sounds odd.

galdorandwe: Logging off to eat. Have fun chatting about the RP :-)
ArPharazonV: Enjoy!
Eonwe Valar: Eat well :}
AriehnV: ok added that bit on
AriehnV: in my last post
galdorandwe: Broiled wild sockeye salmon with quinoa and veggies :-)
AriehnV: enjoy , yum
Eonwe Valar: Yum :}
AriehnV: *steals from Galdors plate"
galdorandwe has left the room.
ArPharazonV: What's quinoa?
Eonwe Valar: - a species of goosefoot (Chenopodium), is a grain-like crop grown primarily for its edible seeds.
Eonwe Valar: Swiped from Wikipedia, hehe.
ArPharazonV: Hm, interesting. Would have to find a Dutch name for it, perhaps.
Eonwe Valar: It is a pseudocereal rather than a true cereal, or grain, as it is not a member of the grass family. As a chenopod, quinoa is closely related to species such as beets, spinach, and tumbleweeds.
AriehnV: yeah .. its a pseudocereal and a grass specias
AriehnV: Eonwe beat me in typing as usual ^^
Eonwe Valar: I copy/pasted :}
ArPharazonV: Hmm, looks like we just call it "goosefoot", but in Dutch. Can't say I've heard of it.
AriehnV: that doesnt seem to work for me /
AriehnV: i only can select the whole article it seems and would probably have to cut it down then
Eonwe Valar: Looks like it's a South American plant, if Wikipedia can be trusted :}

ArPharazonV: is it "who" or "whom" he knew personally?
Eonwe Valar: Singular should be "whom" if I recall correctly.

AriehnV: Derived from the Spanish spelling of the Quechua name kinwa or occasionally "Qin-wah", Quinoa originated in the Andean region of Ecuador, Bolivia, Colombia and Peru before they were colonized and became nation-states, where it was successfully domesticated 3,000 to 4,000 years ago for human consumption, though archeological evidence shows a non-domesticated association with pastoral herding some 5,200 to 7,000 years ago.[1]Similar Chenopodium species, such as pitseed goosefoot (Chenopodium berlandieri) and fat hen (Chenopodium album), were grown and domesticated in North America
ArPharazonV: Allright. Quick search tells me it's subject vs object. So it would be "whom he knew personally" and "who knew him personally", for example
AriehnV: as part of the Eastern Agricultural Complex before maize agriculture became popular.[2] Fat hen, which has a widespread distribution in the Northern Hemisphere, produces edible seeds and greens much like quinoa, but in smaller quantities.The nutrient composition is very good compared with common cereals. Quinoa grains contain essential amino acids like lysine and good quantities of calcium, phosphorus, and iron.[3
Eonwe Valar: Yeah, that sounds right.
Eonwe Valar: Don't worry about copy/pasting the article, Arien.
AriehnV: The nutrient composition is very good compared with common cereals. Quinoa grains contain essential amino acids like lysine and good quantities of calcium, phosphorus, and iron.[3]After harvest, the grains need to be processed to remove the coating containing the bitter-tasting saponins. Quinoa grains are in general cooked the same way as rice and can be used in a wide range of dishes. Quinoa leaves are also eaten as a leaf vegetable, much like amaranth, but the commercial availability of quinoa greens is limited
Eonwe Valar: It's too much info and Phar can just look it up if he wants to read it :}
AriehnV: there you go :-)
AriehnV: thats it
ArPharazonV: Allright, thanks :-) but I don't think I'm familiar with it

Eonwe Valar: Whom vs. Who - yeah, something I can use better than I can explain, hehe. I don't think you'll find too many people outside of English majors/professors who will recognize when "whom" should've been used though, hehe.
ArPharazonV: was quite helpful in the matter

Eonwe Valar: Anything else to add on the RP, or shall we bang the gavel here for now?
ArPharazonV: Checking my post before hitting the post button.
ArPharazonV: Posted.
ArPharazonV: am I disconnected again, or are you all busy reading? :-)
Eonwe Valar: I was looking it over :}
Eonwe Valar: Looks fine to me, both Arien's addition and your post.

Eonwe Valar: It's about 10 minutes till WoW run time, and the conversation has died down, so I'll bang the gavel here.
Eonwe Valar: *bangs gavel*

Eonwe Valar: Aftermeeting :}
AriehnV: enjoy and good luck
AriehnV has left the room.
ArPharazonV: saving and sending transcript