Valar Guild

August 28, 2011 Sunday Meeting

5pm EDT (GMT - 5)
AIM: Valar Guild Meetingplace

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Transcript work by
Ar-Pharazon and Varda.

Attending: (6)
    AriehnV, ArPharazonV, Eonwe Valar, Galdor-(V)/galdorandwe, Indis-(V)/karakedi25, VardaValar1

Before-meeting:
Meeting begins
Membership:
    New member: Dagnir-(V)
    Indis-(V) headed to Jordan.
Web:
    Valar Guild's 14th Anniversary planning
    Games Site Mass Update upcoming
Gaming:
    Diablo 3
    StarCraft 2
    WoW
    LotRO  
Tolkien:
    Topic 1 from Galdor: Tolkien replaced Tevildo Prince of Cats in the Beren-Luthien story with Sauron. The feline/dog issue was skirted. Chris Tolkien wrote that he can see no reason for doing this substitution. I wanted to know what people thought about it.
    Topic 2 from Galdor: In the Silmarillion is mentioned that above all other Valar, Melkor fears and hates Varda the most. I want to know why.
After-meeting:
     WoW runs completed in Molten Core and Ahn Qiraj.
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Before-meeting:
You have just entered room "valarguildmeetingplace."
Eonwe Valar: Heya,
galdorandwe has entered the room.
Eonwe Valar: There, that should be everyone available.
galdorandwe: Aiya
Eonwe Valar: Heya Galdor.
ArPharazonV: Aiya
galdorandwe: Indis mentioned earlier that she's be along...She's doing a 12-man Raid right now.
AriehnV has entered the room.
Eonwe Valar: ok.
galdorandwe: Aiya Arien
AriehnV: aiya all :-)
ArPharazonV: Was about to go for a Tempest Keep when I got the invite, so it was just in time :-)
galdorandwe: Any word on Varda?
ArPharazonV: Aiya
Eonwe Valar: Far as I know she should be here, but we'll begin shortly anyway.
galdorandwe: So I'm ready when the time comes, what Chapter are we on in LoTR for the discussion?
ArPharazonV: 4
galdorandwe: I do have a side conversation I'd like to have at Tolkien Chat about something that interests me and I'd like everyone's opinion on it, if that's possible.
Eonwe Valar: We can fit it in, either before or after chapter 4 discussion. We'll see when we get there :}
galdorandwe: ok
ArPharazonV: Any thought on the black sails topic in the forum?
ArPharazonV: Had some fun replying, working through the Numenorean lore. My specialty after all!
Eonwe Valar: Didn't have much time to dig into more than the Sil, and you've covered that.
ArPharazonV: Well it was a quick glance. I didn't read every word. Was lucky to find the golden sails passage.
ArPharazonV: So you could've found something I didn't.
Eonwe Valar: I didn't :} I did look, rest assured :}
ArPharazonV: :-)
Eonwe Valar: Ok, let's begin the meeting.
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Eonwe Valar: Elen Sila Lumenn Omentielvo!
Eonwe Valar: Membership:
Eonwe Valar: Elwing says hi from WoW :}
karakedi25 has entered the room.
Eonwe Valar: We have a new member via LotRO named Dagnir.
AriehnV: hi Elwing :-)
karakedi25: aiya
AriehnV: aiya Indis
Eonwe Valar: Heya Indis.
galdorandwe: Aiya Indis.
ArPharazonV: Aiya
Eonwe Valar: Any other Membership news?
karakedi25: Will be going out of the country 9-19 Sept.
Eonwe Valar: Pardon, should add that Dagnir was scouted by Galdor.
galdorandwe: Have fun :-)
karakedi25: business trip to Jordan
VardaValar1 has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Deepest apologies for not noticing the time. Please continue.
ArPharazonV: Aiya!
Eonwe Valar: Take care in Jordan, Indis :}
karakedi25: Should be fun :-)
karakedi25: and interesting
Eonwe Valar: Heya Varda :} Any membership news to add?
AriehnV: aiya Varda
Eonwe Valar: Guess not :}
VardaValar1: Yes
VardaValar1: Did you already mention new member Dagnir?
AriehnV: aye be careful Indis
Eonwe Valar: I mentioned briefly that he was a new member and that Galdor scouted him. I figured it was obvious you tested him :}
VardaValar1: Thank you
Eonwe Valar: If you'd like to add anything to that, feel free :}
VardaValar1: One hopes others will also do testing, but you're right.
VardaValar1: More on the News page. :-)
VardaValar1: http://valarguild.org/varda/guild/news.html
Eonwe Valar: If anyone catches me on LotRO and can't find another tester, I can make the time.
Eonwe Valar: More than likely.
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Eonwe Valar: If there's no other Membership news, then on to Web:

Eonwe Valar: As you all hopefully know, the Valar Guild's 14th Anniversary is coming October 4th.
Eonwe Valar: Since it's about a month away, we're putting out the call now for any acts of creativity any members want to submit for said 14th Anniversary.
Eonwe Valar: This can be articles, stories, art, music, poetry, Game Reviews for the Games Site, and probably a dozen or so other things not coming to mind.
Eonwe Valar: All submissions (except Game Reviews) should be sent to Varda. Game Reviews should be sent to me.
Eonwe Valar: Any questions should probably be divvied along the same lines.
VardaValar1: But send them anyway and we'll sort them out.
Eonwe Valar: Any quick questions/comments on this before I move on?
Eonwe Valar: OK.

Eonwe Valar: Speaking of the Games Site, it's about time for the annual Games Site Mass-Update as well.
Eonwe Valar: Every full member (if you took the Tolkien test, you're a full member) with an e-mail available will be receiving an e-mail from me about this.
AriehnV: oh well aye guess i d have some changes to make to my lot hehe, with all the name changes and new characters
Eonwe Valar: I intend to send them out this week. Deadline will be September 30th as usual.
Eonwe Valar: The Mass-Update is for the purpose of keeping gaming info at least relatively up-to-date so members can game with other members no matter the games they play in.
Eonwe Valar: And, as usual, starting the Sunday after I've sent the letters out, I'll be open to taking gaming info in a side window during the meeting, as a perk to those who come :}
ArPharazonV: always useful
Eonwe Valar: Any quick questions on this before we carry on?
Eonwe Valar: (Slow questions can be asked too, hehe)
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Eonwe Valar: Gaming:
Eonwe Valar: Diablo 3: The D3 Community Site is now open.
VardaValar1: Wondering about the forum gaming persons list
VardaValar1: Should it be eliminated and just a link to the Gaming Site?
Eonwe Valar: I don't generally use it to update the Gaming Site. I use the in-game roster with the guild notes.
VardaValar1: It's for ease of finding people in LotRO, who they are.
Eonwe Valar: I should also note that I do prefer a response to the GSMU than simply using the in-game rosters for various reason, among them being it counts as activity and it lets us know your e-mail is working.
Eonwe Valar: As I've said in the past, and do in the GSMU letter, a response of "I don't currently play any games" is better than no response, because if nothing else it lets us know you're still interested in being a member.
VardaValar1: Also, the person may play games in the future with a change in fortune.
Eonwe Valar: Aye.
ArPharazonV: I'll resort to sidechat as always :-)
VardaValar1: and they can contribute to the Tolkien Site and come to meetings.
ArPharazonV: Not that there's much to say. There's like a dozen games I'd play if someone's interested, but I don't play anything regularly but WoW.
Eonwe Valar: And there's always more ways to contribute to the Guild than gaming, if you do find yourself without gaming abilities :} Liek the aforementioned art, article,s stories, poetry, etc. :}
VardaValar1: Sending in news articles about the movies or other Tolkien-related activities.
Eonwe Valar: Or even helping me keep some gaming news on the Games Site News, i.e., games coming out guild members might be interested in.
Eonwe Valar: OK, back to the Gaming section now :}

Eonwe Valar: As I was saying, the D3 Community Site is available, and so it's now on the Games Site's list of D3 links.
Eonwe Valar: http://valarguild.org/eonwe/index.php for the Games Site if you've never been there :}
Eonwe Valar: I like to think finding your way around the site is pretty easy from there :}

Eonwe Valar: Starcraft 2: Patch 1.4 is on the PTR

Eonwe Valar: WoW:
Eonwe Valar: A preview of the new Darkmoon Faire coming in patch 4.3 has been released. It's about time for a revamp :}
Eonwe Valar: There's a link on the Games Site news, but here's another anyway: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/3390849
ArPharazonV: Wonder what it'll do to Darkmoon Faire reputation. I've still neglected to get the Insane feat.
Eonwe Valar: We'll find out soon enough I'm sure. They might not even know, since it's been asked and so far I haven't seen an answer.

Eonwe Valar: Lothar:
Eonwe Valar: Sunday Run:
Eonwe Valar: Attending:Guild Members: Eonwe, Varda, Bilbo, Elwing, Nob, Bofur. Guild Friends: Lumierre. This week, we got Yogg'Saron down in Hard Mode. Unfortunately we didn't have enough to get it for guild credit, but we got him.Then we took on Algalon, and got him down in a few goes.After this, we took a bit of a break, then came back to clear out Obsidian Sanctum on Hard mode. Elwing won the Black Drake mount.
Eonwe Valar: Achivements obtained:In His House He Waits Dreaming, Descent Into Madness, Secrets of Ulduar, Alone in the Darkness, He's Not Getting Any Older, Observed, Besting the Black Dragonflight, Gonna Go When the Volcano Blows, Twilight DuoTwilight Zone, Champion of the Frozen Wastes. Titles picked up: StarcallerOf the Nightfall, Champion of the Frozen Wastes
Eonwe Valar: Friday Run:
Eonwe Valar: Eonwe wasn't able to come in at run time. When he did come in, it seems Varda, Fangorn, and Elwing were having fun working on alt characters.
AriehnV: nice grats to all that
Eonwe Valar: This Sunday, we're going to clear some lvl 60 and 70 rep dungeons.
AriehnV: oh aye .. Annaarwen got 80 finally and is starting in Hyjal :-)
Eonwe Valar: Congrats :}
galdorandwe: Grats.
VardaValar1: Grats :-)

Eonwe Valar: LotRO:
Eonwe Valar: Rise of Isengard is coming September 27th, so if you're still sitting on the fence about whether or not you should shell out the money for the RoI pre-order, you need to decide soon :}
karakedi25: Lots of info about RoI coming out, now that the NDA has been lifted on beta.
galdorandwe: I already have it. The updates are significant to your toons, it stand to reason that you should go all the way and just preorder the thing.
karakedi25: I've also preordered it.
galdorandwe: Plus, isn't that what we do anyway? Play every part of the game :-)?
Eonwe Valar: I'm a founder and a lifetime members, so while the cosmetic stuff and mounts are nice, the list of quests packs isn't very tantalizing to me.
VardaValar1: We have a fair number of economically challenged members who play f2p.
galdorandwe: NOted
karakedi25: Lots of changes coming to many of the classes.
Eonwe Valar: Monday Run:
Eonwe Valar: Completed a bottleneck book quest for Gimli and Nimrodel: 1.7.8 "Gates of Carn Dum". Heroes: Gildor (guardian Marrella), Gimli (hunter Gloinson), Indis (lore-master Mereniel), Melkor (rune-keeper Passim), Nimrodel (warden Anthemis), and Varda (minstrel Tinwetari).
Eonwe Valar: Wednesday Run:
galdorandwe: I wish I was around for that...I was in Disney...melting in the heat, but my daughter loved it :-)
Eonwe Valar: We picked up Helegrod marks for two wings. Indis (minstrel Isaniel), Malbeth (hunter Etheron), Maedhros (54 rune-keeper Lachwen), Nimrodel (54 warden Anthemis), Pippin (champion Avengelina, Varda (minstrel Tinwetari). Afterwards was a run at Stoneheight by Gildor (minstrel Fairmaiden), Nimrodel (hunter Ardisian), and Pippin (guardian Faerus).
Eonwe Valar: Spending time with family is good too :}
galdorandwe: With the amount of wife aggro I get playing LoTRO, I'll take my trips with the family to Disney :-)
Eonwe Valar: :}
Eonwe Valar: Get her to play LotRO? :}
galdorandwe: Never...She sees it as a family distraction...If I didn't cook and do a few other things as well as I do, I bet I'd be living in the doghouse, LOL
Eonwe Valar: hehe, that's a shame.
galdorandwe: Well, it's not entirely true...she did actaully create a toon :-)
galdorandwe: I can't tell you how HUGE a step that is
Eonwe Valar: :}
galdorandwe: I have to remind her that it's partly her fault I play this game..it was aFather's Day gift to me from her :-)
Eonwe Valar: hehe :}
Eonwe Valar: Indis, did you want to give us a brief synopsis on some of the Rise of Isengard changes?
VardaValar1: I think she's still in a raid. She's healing.
AriehnV: my burglar dinged 40
Eonwe Valar: OK. Then we'll press on.
VardaValar1: Grats, Arien :-)
galdorandwe: Grats
ArPharazonV: grats!
Eonwe Valar: Any other games anyone played this week?
Eonwe Valar: Any other gaming news anyone has?

AriehnV: bit Eve
ArPharazonV: Flashgames ;-) but I'd also like to say something about WoW
AriehnV: aye .. twas teamwork anyway :-)
ArPharazonV: Yep :-)
Eonwe Valar: Go ahead Phar.
ArPharazonV: The High Guard, the Europe guild I'm based in which also contains some of Arien's characters, dinged lvl 12 yesterday :-)
ArPharazonV: Just 140k experience was left last night, and I'd already done my dailies, so I convinced Arien to do some as well, and there it was!
VardaValar1: :-)
AriehnV: :-)
ArPharazonV: So I suppose we're caught up with you again, though probably not for long :-)
Eonwe Valar: hehe
Eonwe Valar: We're alomst within a no-cap reach of lvl 13 :}
Eonwe Valar: *almost
ArPharazonV: Very nice!
Eonwe Valar: If there's no other gaming news, then we can move to Tolkien.

AriehnV: ah a quick mention that i had some trouble with broadband this week
AriehnV: we are not sure what causes it but we hear that others in the area are affected as well
AriehnV: bit annoying when your about to start a raid or a quest event i can tell you ^^
AriehnV: ./
AriehnV: but at least the interruptions were relatively short so far
AriehnV: carry on :-)
Eonwe Valar: Sorry to hear that.
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Eonwe Valar: Tolkien:
Eonwe Valar: For this portion, I give Varda the floor. She's got a gavel if she needs it :}
VardaValar1: Ohh, shiny gavel! Thanks!
VardaValar1: Galdor, you had two topics. Let's start with
VardaValar1: your topic on Tevildo, Prince of Cats.
VardaValar1: Go ahead, Galdor.
galdorandwe: Tolkien replaced Tevildo Prince of Cats in the Beren-Luthien story with Sauron. The feline/dog issue was skirted. Chris Tolkien wrote that he can see no reason for doing this substitution. I wanted to know what people thought about it.
galdorandwe: Book of Lost Tales 2 Tale of Tenuvial
ArPharazonV: Well it did seem a bit... juvenile. Some of the Lost Tales read like they weren't written very seriously.
VardaValar1: /invite thiefgalear
karakedi25: I've always been a bit bothered by Tolkien's dislike of cats.
VardaValar1: hehe - you would
karakedi25: indeed I would
VardaValar1: I think it had to do with his strong feelings about loyalty and an impression that dogs were more loyal than cats.
karakedi25: Tevildo might have been changed out because Sauron made a more integrated story
ArPharazonV: Yes, Indis, I agree. In the larger frame Sauron did fit more.
VardaValar1: BoLT was a collection of early writing, not matured work.
ArPharazonV: While animals do play a role in the history of Middle-Earth, and Huan was kept in, they were made the exception rather than the rule, and expanded on for being special. Having an army of big talking cats just doesn't seem to fit these days.
VardaValar1: I agee with the idea that using Sauron made the whole story more cohesive.
galdorandwe: Tolkien mentioned in some manuscript about this feline/canine thing as being important in some way. The substitution sees to make no sense even to Chris Tolkien. I'm taking in all your comments :-)
galdorandwe: Sauron would certainly make more sense in the later story, however, it is unecessary to substitute him here..Plus there's the whole bit where the dog (name eludes me now), cold speak at will, but later was oly allowed 3 times ot speak...
ThiefGalear has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Which kinda fits with what I said there.
Eonwe Valar: Well for whatever reason, cats and dogs tend to be pitted as mortal enemies. Since this has bene going on alot longer than BoLT has been out, I'm willing to say it predates Tolkien.
VardaValar1: Huan was not just any dog, but appeared to be a Maia that took dog form.
galdorandwe: Aiya Dagnir
VardaValar1: Aiya Dagnir
ThiefGalear: Aiya Everyone
Eonwe Valar: Hail and Welcome to the Valar Guild, Dagnir :}
AriehnV: Aiya Dagnir :-) , welcome
karakedi25: Aiya
VardaValar1: Galdor has just been called away to dinner.
Eonwe Valar: I think the Huan/Tevildo matchup was a way of giving roots to that ancient rivalry in Tolkien's mythology.
AriehnV: cats and dogs eh?
VardaValar1: It does fit with the idea of mythology explaining what we see.
VardaValar1: And apparently it was changed to work in with the concept of Sauron as the main villain.
ArPharazonV: Aiya Dagnir
ArPharazonV: The Eye in the Lotr movies does look a bit like a cat's eye...
ThiefGalear: Aiya ArPharazonV, I'm not familiar with everyone's names so hopefully it's ok to use aim names
VardaValar1: hah, interesting observation
VardaValar1: All here but karakedi and yourself are using their guild names.
karakedi25: karakedi is Indis
VardaValar1: We have a time problem, so I'll mention the second topic Galdor requested.

VardaValar1: galdorandwe: 2. In the Silmarillion is mentions that above all other vala, Melkor fears and hates Varda the most. I want to know why.
VardaValar1: galdorandwe: Topic 2...with in the first 15 pages of the Silmarillion
Eonwe Valar: She's the Valie of Light, and she rejected him in favor of Manwë. Good reasons for both :}
VardaValar1: Aye, and Melkor was of the darkness.
AriehnV: hmm the most obvious is that she puts the stars in the sky which appears to be black in the night
AriehnV: Melkor being the Lord of Darkness as Varda said
VardaValar1: She's interested in all forms of light. She put the stars up to give light to the elves in what had become a very dark Middle-earth.
ArPharazonV: Putting the first lights in the dark skies... a bit of opposition :-)
VardaValar1: Aye
VardaValar1: Galdor had one other comment that I'll post now:
VardaValar1: galdorandwe: Please pose my second question if time permits. Personally, my opinion is that Malkor had this facination with the Void. Varda, being the Vala of the stars, had the power to iluminate the night. That freaked Melkor out. He was ever fearful of her for that. She could somehow effect a vast area beyond the scope of Arda
VardaValar1: Melkor had been outside Arda for a long time while the other Valar were building up Arda. He came back and decided he wanted the wonder that had been build, only for himself.
VardaValar1: The Valar when they came to build up Arda became bound to Arda.
Eonwe Valar: Of Melkor: "He began with the desire of Light, but when he could not possess it for himself alone, he descended through fire and wrath into a great burning, dow into Darkness."
Eonwe Valar: *down
AriehnV: i wonder whether Melkor became bound to it when he destroyed the works of the other Valar
AriehnV: or rather tried to destroy
VardaValar1: Aye, Eonwe. Anything Melkor could not possess completely, and that included building it, he wanted to destroy. This would eventually include himself.
VardaValar1: Another comment from Galdor:
VardaValar1: galdorandwe: plus she lit up the night, which woke the elves...he hates them...it all fit :-)...afk...dinner is served...wind is picking back up...light flickered...if I go offline it's Irene's fault :-)
ArPharazonV: He was bound to Arda because he poured his own strength and power into corrupting Arda. That's the principle behind book 10 of The History, "Morgoth's Ring". His Ring was in fact the world
Eonwe Valar: '"In the powers and knowledge of all the other Valar he had a part..." it would seem that Light was among the first he lost.
ArPharazonV: drained himself until being bound to a specific (and later scarred) physical form
VardaValar1: All the Valar were bound to Arda. Melkor weakened himself pouring so much of himself into his "ring", the earth itself, aye.
VardaValar1: This weakening is the reason he was the only Vala to know fear. He could no longer change form.
VardaValar1: If his form was marred, he was still stuck with it.
ArPharazonV: Which is why his being thrown out of the world at the end of the First Age was so final to him, and yet left so many traces of his evil back on Arda.
VardaValar1: Aye, Phar
AriehnV: hmm so he was actually thrown out of arda into the void?
Eonwe Valar: Not quite so final. Unlike Sauron, he retained enough of himself to eventually regain his power.
VardaValar1: He was pushed through the Doors of Night.
ArPharazonV: I believe so. Though if that was the final version, I can't confirm.
ArPharazonV: Took him a looong time to get back, though, Eonwe :-)
Eonwe Valar: Yep, the Sil says he was thrust into the Timeless Void.
ThiefGalear: I gotta run all, just wanted to say hello to everyone and hopefully another time I can stay longer :0
VardaValar1: Thanks for coming! May you be able to come another day as well. :-)
AriehnV: nice to meet you Dagnir :-)
ThiefGalear: you as well, all of you for that matter :-)
ThiefGalear has left the room.
Eonwe Valar: Also says "through the Door of Night beyond the Walls of the World." since "world" usually means Arda, and "World" Ea, it's safe to say even without the direct quote he was thrust into the Void.
VardaValar1: Aye, have to watch those capitals. :-)
VardaValar1: For us, the Sil is final canon.
VardaValar1: sorry, LotR first.
AriehnV: `woouldnt that really suit him? i mean he liked the darkness .. so wasnt that really his domain?
VardaValar1: LotR, H, Sil.
VardaValar1: He wanted to take over things. All of a sudden he couldn't reach anything.
AriehnV: (talking about black cats"" mine keeps harassing me and walking over me when i want to type hehe)
ArPharazonV: And being weakened as he was....
VardaValar1: The other books can be like canon if they don't contradict those three
ArPharazonV: UT first, then the History, I guess?
VardaValar1: Losing freedom to act was a huge thing.
VardaValar1: We haven't really ever stated whether UT took precedence over HoMe.
Eonwe Valar: I figured the two would be on par.
Eonwe Valar: More or less.
AriehnV: UT seem to be very early versions and HoME had huge differences
VardaValar1: We have been treating UT much as if it were along with HoMe although it is not numbered with them.
karakedi25: they probably don't contradict much
ArPharazonV: I always considered UT to be the most canon of the two, containing a few final versions of stories over the Sil, even, while HoME is largely made up of really really old versions.
VardaValar1: Even the Sil contradicts itself in places.
VardaValar1: UT is a good one, aye.
Eonwe Valar: Don't suppose you have some examples of the Sil contradicting itself? :}
VardaValar1: I'd have to dig them up. Ran across Christopher saying that and that he just had to go with it sometimes.
AriehnV: *pfft timeline in Tolkiens writing is really terrible and i am glad that its not me who had to do it :-) i leave that to the specialists :-)
VardaValar1: In the latter part of the story of Turin are some of the bigger disconnects according to the Sil intro
karakedi25: the story of Turin is something of an insert. It was really an adaptation of a Finnish legend
ArPharazonV: Turin was also the main story that contained a more final version in UT than in the Sil.
VardaValar1: "A complete consistency ...is not to be looked for, and could only be achieved, if at all, at heavy and needless cost." C. Tolkien.
ArPharazonV: In fact, when it comes to that particular story, I tend to canonize UT over the Sil when I can.
karakedi25: only peripherally part of the history of the elves of the First Age
VardaValar1: The above ellipsis says (either within the compass of the Silmarillion itself or between the Silmarillion and other published writings of my father's.)
ArPharazonV: I believe Chris even said he'd missed the version in UT when publishing the Sil, or he'd have chosen it instead.
ArPharazonV: Or something to that regard. Not sure.
VardaValar1: Anyway, the whole thing is meant to be like real histories, which have their differing sources and story versions. This merely adds to the overall impression of reality that he sought, even if not entirely intentionally.
ArPharazonV: Aye, that's true.
VardaValar1: It still works as a mythology quite well. And any mythology is loaded with even more inconsistencies. Is this or that character a male or female, relationship changes drastically, good or bad.
ArPharazonV: No mythology or larger history is without its own contradictions.
VardaValar1: Exactly
AriehnV: too many different influences and people reporting with their own interpretations of what they saw and heard :-)
galdorandwe has left the room.
VardaValar1: And yet, the overall impressions of what happened and what is to be seen as good or bad, remain for us in Tolkien's stories.
AriehnV: to someone a cloud looks like a dog , to one like a bird , to another like a harpye .. or the warchief .. err .. i mean an angel and bird , *grin* , you know what i mean#
VardaValar1: The overall story remains.
ArPharazonV: Lok'tar Ogar!
AriehnV: and just because the one cloud changes all the time ..
VardaValar1: Aye, and the blind men describing the parts of the element that they could touch were all correct, even if they thought the others were wrong.
VardaValar1: *elephant
VardaValar1: not element, sorry.
VardaValar1: Elements of the elephant. :-)
AriehnV: *giggles*
VardaValar1: We seem to have covered what we are going to cover tonight. We can take up the Fellowship next Sunday. :-)
VardaValar1: Does anyone have any further comments, suggestions, jokes?
ArPharazonV: This was no shortcut to the mushrooms ;-)
VardaValar1: We went the long way, avoiding the wolfhounds.
ArPharazonV: Wolf, Fang and Grip, I believe?
VardaValar1: Right!
VardaValar1: We used to have that as one of our questions, but it was dropped as considered too hard. :-)
AriehnV: i love the scene in the film , alas
AriehnV: sam bumping in merry and pippin who pinched vegetables from farmer maggot and racing away and stumbled downhil into mushrooms hehe
AriehnV: slightly different from the book of course#
ArPharazonV: And those bags of potatoes we lifted last week!
VardaValar1: Fast and cute. Made them more into scamps.
VardaValar1: Another version like we were talking about above. : )
VardaValar1: This gavel is starting to swing on its own, Eonwe!
Eonwe Valar: :}
VardaValar1: *wham!*
VardaValar1: hmm
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VardaValar1: After-meeting!
VardaValar1: Right on the hour. Boy that's a good hammer.
ArPharazonV: Good, because Tol Barad is starting in 20 seconds :-)
Eonwe Valar: :}
VardaValar1: *returns Eonwe's hammer"
VardaValar1: Go for it!
AriehnV: good luck with that ^^
VardaValar1: WoW group can start forming now.
VardaValar1: See some of you there!
VardaValar1: And LotRO can form groups too. Don't need me there to do it! We have lot of folks.
VardaValar1: Namarie for now.
VardaValar1 has left the room.
karakedi25: namarie also
karakedi25: good luck to the wow people
karakedi25 has left the room.
galdorandwe has entered the room.
galdorandwe: back online after the power outage
ArPharazonV: Aiyata
galdorandwe: geez...horibble time to lose power
galdorandwe: Did you discuss ch. 4?
galdorandwe: I apologize, btw if my side questions hijacked the Tolkien chat
ArPharazonV: Nope, doing that next week
galdorandwe: ok.
galdorandwe: I'll have to hit up the site for the dialogue
ArPharazonV: saving and sending transcript
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