Valar Guild

January 3, 2010 Sunday Meeting

5pm EST (GMT - 5)
AIM: Valar Guild Meetingplace

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Transcript work by: 
Ar-Pharazon, Menelvagor, and Varda

Attending: (7)
   Ancalagon-(V)/Joldahks, ArPharazonV, AriehnV, Eonwe Valar, Indis-(V)/karakedi25, Menelvagor Valar, VardaValar1 (presiding)

Meeting begins
    New Full Member: Faramir-(V)
    Games Page
    News Page
    Membership 2010 Page
       BroodWar, Second Life, Tales of Monkey Island
    Today is J.R.R. Tolkien's birthday!
    In honor of this special day, we discussed Eonwe's topic: How do we see birthdays celebrated by the peoples of Arda?
    Forum Role-play discussion and posting.
    RP discussion and posting continues

You have just entered room "valarguildmeetingplace."
VardaValar1 has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: aIYA
VardaValar1: Aiya Phar :-)
ArPharazonV: ...caps
ArPharazonV: Aiya!
AriehnV has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Aiya Arien :-)
Joldahks has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Aiya Ancalagon!
Joldahks: hi
ArPharazonV: hi
VardaValar1: Eonwe should be here in a minute.
VardaValar1: Indis is in a boss fight, should be along in a litte while.
Eonwe Valar has entered the room.
AriehnV: sorry i am just in Wintergrasp atm but wow crashed
AriehnV: aiya btw ^^
Eonwe Valar: Heya all.
VardaValar1: Aiya :-)

VardaValar1: Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo! :-)
VardaValar1: Happy 2010 to all. :-)
Menelvagor Valar has entered the room.
Menelvagor Valar: Aiya!
VardaValar1: Aiya Menel!
VardaValar1: Membership:
VardaValar1: We have a new member this week, Faramir-(V)
VardaValar1: The old one hasn't shown since 2007 and dropped his LotRO character out of the kin, so I considered his name free.
VardaValar1: The new one is another Texan. :-)
VardaValar1: He's read the H, LotR, and Sil.
VardaValar1: He plays LotRO and hopes to be in Star Trek Online also later this month.
VardaValar1: Fangorn and Varda celebrated their 36th Wedding Anniversary Dec 22, forgot to mention it here.
VardaValar1: Any other membership news?
Menelvagor Valar: Hold on a sec there Varda :-)
Menelvagor Valar: I'd like to raise my glass of champagne to you and Fangorn!
VardaValar1: aww thanks :-)
Joldahks: aye, grats!
VardaValar1: Thanks from both of us.
ArPharazonV: indeed, congratulations to you both
VardaValar1: Anc is here in the meeting today and in LotRO. Great to see him back. : )
Eonwe Valar: Congratulations to you and Fangorn, Varda :}
VardaValar1: Thanky :-)
Menelvagor Valar: You're welcome. And that my favourite may have many many more years together *smile*
Menelvagor Valar: favourite couple*
VardaValar1: That sounds good!
VardaValar1: Any further membership news?
Menelvagor Valar: Well, one tiny bit.
VardaValar1: Fire away!
Menelvagor Valar: I figure it's already been done at the start of the meeting, and I've just missed it...
Menelvagor Valar: but...
Menelvagor Valar: Happy New Year everyone!
VardaValar1: Happy New Year, Menelvagor. : )
ArPharazonV: Happy 2010 to the Valarguild :-)
Eonwe Valar: Happy New Year all :}

VardaValar1: Web:
AriehnV: Happy new year everyone :-)
VardaValar1: Eonwe, would you like to tell about the Games page? : )
Eonwe Valar: Sure :}
VardaValar1: (Happy 2010 from Maedhros, Eomer, and Elwing in LotRO)
Eonwe Valar: I've made a little change to the Games Page that will automatically make it choose the newest gaming news page (i.e., the current year's) without me having to change the link, ever.
VardaValar1: Some cooool programming. : )
Eonwe Valar: It's got a small problem, in that it apparently uses the viewer's time zone rather than the official Valar time zone as I intended, but I can try to fix that as we go.
VardaValar1: Oh, but that is cool!
AriehnV: sweet
Menelvagor Valar: very sweet indeed.
Eonwe Valar: Either way, it's one more thing I don't have to step in to update myself :}
Eonwe Valar: That's all for now.
VardaValar1: Thanks Eonwe. That's a lot. : )
VardaValar1: The News and Membership pages are set up for 2010 as well.
VardaValar1: 2009 is in the Archives and should be easily reachable.
VardaValar1: We've had some answers to the Activity sweep email, but it hasn't gone out to all needing it yet.
VardaValar1: All here don't have to worry about that. : )
VardaValar1: Aragorn said hi and that he wants to stay with us. :-)
VardaValar1: He's part of the European group, so you may be glad to hear that. He's been very busy at work [Note: working on his Civil Engineering degree.]

VardaValar1: Gaming:
VardaValar1: Non-WoW and non-LotRO gaming:
VardaValar1: Eowyn and Fangorn were in BroodWar a few minutes ago. : )
VardaValar1: I keep meaning to go to Second Life. Arth-(T) is Arth over there, and Fladrif is SodoL
Menelvagor Valar: Oooh, say hi to beautiful Eowyn for me *grin*
VardaValar1: Arth would be happy to see any of us who pop in.
VardaValar1: hehe. Wonder if I should? : )
VardaValar1: Sure
VardaValar1: Anyone else have gaming news miscellany? : )
Menelvagor Valar: I might've.
ArPharazonV: hmmhm, same
Menelvagor Valar: I'll go after Pharzie then.
VardaValar1: WoW, Argent Dawn server. Phar, go ahead.
ArPharazonV: I've been spending a lot of my time on Tales of Monkey Island this week, finishing chapter 1, and going through all of chapters 2, 3 and 4, and am currently in 5... so almost done
ArPharazonV: so if I'm a bit afk, it's because I can't get myself to stop playing this final chapter :-)
VardaValar1: hehe
ArPharazonV: AD server? oh, hmm....
VardaValar1: addict
VardaValar1: Pardon, I misunderstood
ArPharazonV: you'd probably need to ask Arien for that, I don't know anything Valar-ish
VardaValar1: Go ahead with miscellany :-)
ArPharazonV: nah, I haven't done anything else much, really, spent a few days out of town for new year's so only had less days to play :-)
ArPharazonV: so Menel's turn!
VardaValar1: Menel, go ahead when you can.
VardaValar1: He's also with us in LotRO.
Menelvagor Valar: and alt-tabbing a lot.
Menelvagor Valar: when not carrying mail that is!
Menelvagor Valar: Anyways.
Menelvagor Valar: I've more or less quit WoW altogether, though there's always the usual off-chance that I might return there one day.
Menelvagor Valar: Instead, I've been playing a lot of LotRO recently, during my nightly hours.
Menelvagor Valar: I've done some grouping with various guildmembers, though mostly with Indis' Champion.
VardaValar1: and right now with Elwing, Eomer, and Varda.
Menelvagor Valar: On Christmas Eve was the greatest day though, with a full group questing in the North Downs and later, with a diminished fellowship of 4 trying to get the Great Barrows done.
Menelvagor Valar: Aye.
Menelvagor Valar: But what I loved most was to see all those people again that I've missed in meetings, games, or any other way.
Menelvagor Valar: that's it for gaming :-)
Menelvagor Valar: Got a quick membership thingy to throw out there btw :-)
VardaValar1: Thanks Menel
VardaValar1: ok
Menelvagor Valar: I've quit smoking as part of the cliché New Year's resolution stuff.
Menelvagor Valar: Of course, I have a really good reason to quit smoking, cuz it's not for naught I give up something so... good *wink*
VardaValar1: They say the first 72 hours are the hardest.
Menelvagor Valar: I am currently at 78'ish hours.
ArPharazonV: 72 hours? If he really started at new year's midnight, this'd be his 72nd hour
ArPharazonV: ah :-)
Menelvagor Valar: and I'd say it's the 72 hours after the first 24-48.
Menelvagor Valar: first 2 days are rather easy.
VardaValar1: So we've been corrected. I merely read about it.
Menelvagor Valar: after that, detoxying effects start to occur.
Menelvagor Valar: but I guess it's dependant on the perosn.
Menelvagor Valar: person.
VardaValar1: Do you have recommendations for others trying to quit?
Menelvagor Valar: have a really good reason to quit.
karakedi25 has entered the room.
karakedi25: Aiya!
Menelvagor Valar: preferrably multiple reasons.
Menelvagor Valar: One's own health is usually not enough, so having a spouse who doesn't smoke is a very good incentive to quit as well.
VardaValar1: Aiya Indis :-)
Menelvagor Valar: I usually prefer quitting cold turkey, but this time I've done a few dry runs.
Menelvagor Valar: but that's because I set myself a date at which to quit.
Menelvagor Valar: I wanted to quit no later than 23:59:59 dec. 31st 2009.
Menelvagor Valar: so setting a date and working towards that date might work as well.
Menelvagor Valar: but everything is dependant on person, circumstantial effects and personal willpower.
Menelvagor Valar: there are too many factors that affect such an endeavour, so basically picking a time and trying to stick with it for as long as possible is what I'd recommend.
VardaValar1: So a goal and multiple reasons outside of one's own health are best?
Menelvagor Valar: I'd say so.
VardaValar1: Ok, thanks and good luck to you!
Menelvagor Valar: I mean, one's own health is a mighty good reason, but even with the effects widely known, there's still over a billion smokers in the world, if not more.
Menelvagor Valar: Thanks!
Menelvagor Valar: and I guess that's the smoking part :-D
VardaValar1: Thanks :-)
VardaValar1: Any other non-WoW and non-LotRO gaming news?
VardaValar1: I would assume Fladrif would tell us some, but he's not present right now.
VardaValar1: I think Ancalagon has some if we can catch his attention.
VardaValar1: He's away.
VardaValar1: WoW news:
karakedi25: are we finished with lotro?
VardaValar1: We have not started it.
VardaValar1: If you have a time problem, we can do that now.
VardaValar1: Indis, go ahead.
karakedi25: I don't have a time problem. Came in late so wasn't certain of what had been done already
karakedi25: Go ahead with your usual routine.
VardaValar1: Arien, are you present?
AriehnV: sort of aye
AriehnV: hehe
VardaValar1: Can you give a quick WoW Argent Dawn server report?
AriehnV: aye , i havent seen Calaron much this last week , i think once monday or tuesday
ArPharazonV: aye, as said, I was away for a few days around new year's
AriehnV: my own Characters Ariehn and Finduilasse have joined a more active pvp guild to fit my own style of enjoying the game and had a bit of a dabble in raiding Orgrimmar on Friday , else bg grinding mostly
AriehnV: thats it really :-)]
VardaValar1: Phar, do you have any WoW AD news?
VardaValar1: Menel told his already.
AriehnV: caught in the acto of Monkey Island @:-)
VardaValar1: hehehe
VardaValar1: Eonwe, do you have a Lothar server report?
Eonwe Valar: Well, I have tried some gaming this week, and no ill effects for my shoulder,hehe.
ArPharazonV: hmm, right, as I said, I don't have much WoW news beyond some personal progress
ArPharazonV: so I'll leave it to Eonwe
VardaValar1: Did you take it easy?
Eonwe Valar: Aye.
Eonwe Valar: I got enough Emblems of Frost to upgrade my Libram from the one I'd been using since Shadowmoon Valley in Outland.
VardaValar1: Bilbo, Sauron, Fangorn, Eowyn, Elwing, and Varda played a lot of dungeons. Sauron as tank, Varda healing, and the rest dps.
VardaValar1: Uldaman server has been sadly neglected.
VardaValar1: On to LotRO:
VardaValar1: Indis, would you like to tell a bit about what's been happening on Landroval server? :-)
karakedi25: We've been very active since Mirkwood came out. Most days we have about 7-10 people on at least once a day, and often more...
VardaValar1: Scroll! :-)
karakedi25: Most of the active players now have at least one maxxed alt
karakedi25: I came in late--nothing to scroll to.
VardaValar1: I just mean we holler Scroll now and then in LotRO, meaning we have more people than the screen holds.
karakedi25: ah
Menelvagor Valar: haha :-)
karakedi25: yes, it's been great
Menelvagor Valar: good to know I am contributing to something in LotRO :-D
karakedi25: and Varda probably already mentioned our new member
VardaValar1: Aye, Faramir : )
karakedi25: Menel is not alone in contributing at the lower levels; there are quite a few alts leveling up in Eriador.
karakedi25: What else can the rest of you mention?
VardaValar1: We've been doing instances, skirmishes, quests, crafting and keeping very busy.
karakedi25: I've been doing a number of the instances, mostly on my lore-master, but also building up my minstrel (healer).
VardaValar1: The Melkorrim continue to run a group Sat and Sun morning, to which other members are welcome when a slot is available.
karakedi25: There's no lack of things to do :-)
karakedi25: that's about it for now, other than to say Mirkwood has been a great expansion
VardaValar1: Thank you, Indis. : )
Menelvagor Valar: Ah, I have one minor achievement I'd like to share :-)
VardaValar1: Fire away.
Menelvagor Valar: A few days ago, I got into a non-descript fellowship to the Great Barrows, and we managed to complete it with my hunter beign the general guide as well as meat shield *grin*
VardaValar1: ouch - not a great role for a hunter.
Menelvagor Valar: Strength Stance pure damage output aggroage for the win :-)
Menelvagor Valar: We had 2 healers and 2 off-healers, we were cool :-)
VardaValar1: ah good
VardaValar1: I have to be afk. Elwing is about to leave my house and I want to see her off. Eonwe has the chair and Tolkien topic. :-)
Menelvagor Valar: the other was a 33 sorc... whatever the name was :-D
karakedi25: sorc? RK? LM?
Menelvagor Valar: LM.
Menelvagor Valar: And my hunter was already 33 at that point, so could take a fair beating.
karakedi25: LMs rule :-)
Menelvagor Valar: mah.
karakedi25: but congratulations, Menel :-)
Menelvagor Valar: <- more damage, more aggro, better tankage :-D
Menelvagor Valar: for now anyways :-D
Menelvagor Valar: anyways, that's it :-)
Eonwe Valar: THanks :}
Eonwe Valar: Any other gaming news ?
karakedi25: btw, for those that don't know, GB is Great Barrows
karakedi25: LM is Lore-master, and RK is rune-keeper
Menelvagor Valar: I didn't say GB though :-D
karakedi25: both what LotRO calls 'tactical' classes (=magic)
karakedi25: so you didn't
Eonwe Valar: OK, if we're ready to move on to Tolkien, let's do so.

Eonwe Valar: Tolkien:
VardaValar1: back just right :-)
Eonwe Valar: A certain event occurred on this day that has not yet been mentioned.
VardaValar1: Because it awaited this moment. :-)
Eonwe Valar: Today is J.R.R. Tolkien's birthday :}
karakedi25: Would this have been either Tolkien's birth or drath?
karakedi25: *death
Eonwe Valar: In honor of this, how do we see birthdays celebrated by the peoples of Arda?
VardaValar1: The birthday party for Bilbo and Frodo starts the LotR. :-)
karakedi25: the hobbit birthday customs are distinctive
ArPharazonV: Bilbo celebrated his 51st birthday in Lake-town with a feast though he did not know it at the time :-)
karakedi25: with presents given by the one whose birthday it is
VardaValar1: A side note. Sam and Faramir's birthday is the same day, although different years.
karakedi25: I don't know anything about the customs of other folk, other than that I believe that elves celebrate in terms of the much longer elven years, not the solar year
ArPharazonV: I think elves' years go in 3s or 6s or something?
karakedi25: isn't a yen 100 years?
ArPharazonV: am I still here? silences scare me
Menelvagor Valar: *grin*
ArPharazonV: good, I'll take that as a yes
VardaValar1: No, we just think we are here.
karakedi25: *wonders what happened to everyone*
VardaValar1: In LotRO, Menel is commenting that this is JRRT's 118th
Menelvagor Valar: we all fell into the enchanted river and now we dream that we are typing when we actually aren't.
Menelvagor Valar: or mostly aren't rather.
karakedi25: *ducks in case Menel wakes up and attacks her*
Menelvagor Valar: *grin*
Menelvagor Valar: I had better not fall in the river to begin with.
Menelvagor Valar: I'd scorch the entirety of the Greenwood into cinders.
Menelvagor Valar: and that's just a small place.
karakedi25: From Wikipedia: Elves are born about one year from their conception. The day of their conception is celebrated, not the actual birthday itself.
VardaValar1: From Complete Guide to Middle-earth, a yen is 144 solar years, the long year of the Eldar in Middle-earth.
Eonwe Valar: Aye, from "Laws and Customs of the Eldar"
ArPharazonV: "about" one year would mean that they do not actually know the day of their conception
Eonwe Valar: What Indis said is, that is.
VardaValar1: Aye, on Conception Day.
Eonwe Valar: Varda's is from the Appendices at the end of RotK.
VardaValar1: Thanks Eonwe. It's the actual book references that we need.
ArPharazonV: 144, eh?
ArPharazonV: well, at least it's based on 6
Menelvagor Valar: so the Eldar bear their children for the "long year" or the "somewhat not so long year"?
karakedi25: I suspect it's a solar year
karakedi25: 144 years of pregnancy seems a bit much even for an elf
ArPharazonV: 144 solar years would be a bit odd, considering half-elven children in the First Age
karakedi25: though Tolkien was a man and probably wouldn't have thought of that
ArPharazonV: their fathers would die before the children were born
VardaValar1: Not pregnancy
Eonwe Valar: Just because he was a man?
VardaValar1: VardaValar1: From Complete Guide to Middle-earth, a yen is 144 solar years, the long year of the Eldar in Middle-earth.
Menelvagor Valar: I guess this system of "yens" was implemented before the arrival of the sun and moon?
VardaValar1: Pallando says hi. His client can't seem to do chats.
Menelvagor Valar: and that after the rising of the sun it was calculated that a yen approximated about 144 solar years?
VardaValar1: I am not sure why Indis brought up the yen, but I answered. : )
ArPharazonV: if it was, it would be an odd coincidence that solar years happened to be 1/144th of a yen
ArPharazonV: 144 is not exactly a random number, even if the pattern could have been invented after the result
Menelvagor Valar: 144 is a dozen dozens.
Menelvagor Valar: or a gross.
ArPharazonV: Quite.
karakedi25: because I thought that elven birthdays were celebrated once a yen, not once a solar year
karakedi25: just a guess
Eonwe Valar: ok, "yen" while translated as "year" is really 144 of our years.
Menelvagor Valar: which, coincidentally, and not entirely unoffensively was the number of guests to Bilbo's private party on his 111th.
VardaValar1: Jan 3, 1892 was JRRT's birthday
Eonwe Valar: The Eldar preferred to reckon in 6s and 12s.
karakedi25: some of whom took offense at being referred to as a 'gross' :-)
VardaValar1: oessala: back in san angelo after two weeks at home
Eonwe Valar: Hence they have 6 seasons of what would be a Year of the Sun.
Menelvagor Valar: pre-winter and pre-summer? :-D
ArPharazonV: the fact that there was a "gross" invited wasn't the coincidence, it was planned on their birthdays... what was a nice coincidence was that Frodo's coming of age correlated with Bilbo's "odd-numbered" birthday to make an exact gross
Menelvagor Valar: or is yule and midsummer an entire season?
VardaValar1: The guests suspected they were invited to fill out the number, one gross, and were annoyed by that, aye.
Menelvagor Valar: Bilbo did hint at that as well!
VardaValar1: It was meant to be for each year between them.
karakedi25: yes, Bilbo did more than hint at it. He stated it in his speech, as I remember.
Eonwe Valar: A "day" of the Sun was reckoned from sunset to sunset by the Eldar.
Menelvagor Valar: which is a big and mighty hint I'd say *grin*
karakedi25: And by the Valar, based on the schedule of the Two Trees, I believe
Menelvagor Valar: well, the waxing and waning of the trees lasted more than a few solar years, same goes for the lamps if I remember correctly.
Eonwe Valar: A week of six days is reckoned, for ritualistic rather than practical purposes.
Menelvagor Valar: well, isn't it the same in RL?
Menelvagor Valar: At least, I don't see the immediate practicality about having 7 days in a week.
Menelvagor Valar: 6 days seems much more practical.
karakedi25: it's easier to multiply and divide, I suppose
Menelvagor Valar: aye.
Menelvagor Valar: although I must admit, in English, they made a fancy little thing to counteract that particular multiplier and division :-)
Eonwe Valar: I'm going by the wording of Appendix D here, not making a commentary on the system of weeks.
Menelvagor Valar: They called it a fortnight :-)
Menelvagor Valar: sorry Eonwe, you know I like to make links to RL stuff :-D
ArPharazonV: could the week be related to the phase of the moon?
ArPharazonV: does not one moon-cycle take up 4 weeks?
ArPharazonV: in rl, that is
Menelvagor Valar: a bit over actually.
ArPharazonV: Ah.
Menelvagor Valar: around 4.3 weeks.
Menelvagor Valar: hence there's 52 weeks in a year, but only 12 months.
Menelvagor Valar: months are mooncycles.
ArPharazonV: I thought I'd read mooncycles were actually a bit shorter than our month, hence my comment
Menelvagor Valar: through a quick calculation, with 6 days a week, and the same 12 months a year, it would be approximately 5 weeks per month, a bit of an odd number, all things considered.
ArPharazonV: but sure
Menelvagor Valar: You could be right, I'm just going by general knowledge.
Menelvagor Valar: And yes, you're still here Pharzie, it just went a bit quiet again.
Eonwe Valar: Anyway, back to the topic at hand, birthdays.
Eonwe Valar: I don't believe anyone has mentioned that Hobbits tend to give presents to others on their birthdays.
karakedi25: I did, right away
karakedi25: read up :-)
Eonwe Valar: My apologies then, missed it.
VardaValar1: karakedi25: with presents given by the one whose birthday it is
VardaValar1: But a good thing to mention
VardaValar1: They are called mathoms.
Eonwe Valar: Was it mentioned that on the 33rd birthday among Hobbits and Men, one is considered to be adult?
VardaValar1: We can pass around mathoms too. They tend to be nice things one does not use. Called white elephants, in English. : )
VardaValar1: Just now by you. :-)
Eonwe Valar: ok :}
Menelvagor Valar: Did anyone mention that some gifts actually were a hundred or so years old and tended to be given to just about everyone at one point or another?
karakedi25: I didn't
Eonwe Valar: To quote Varda...
Eonwe Valar: VardaValar1: Just now by you. :-)
VardaValar1: hehe
Menelvagor Valar: *grin*
VardaValar1: At some time, they might become valuable antiques and be actually worth something.
ArPharazonV: actually, mathoms were simply items people didn't have an immediate use for
Menelvagor Valar: Do we have any knowledge on Dwarven Birthdays?
ArPharazonV: there was even a museum for them
VardaValar1: In LotRO, you can visit that Mathom House. :-)
ArPharazonV: I don't think you can directly equate the term "mathom" with presents
Menelvagor Valar: in Michel Delving, aye.
AriehnV: the most famous held by the Mayor of Micheld delving
VardaValar1: More like white elephants, Phar.
Eonwe Valar: Bilbo didn't give out anything old to his birthday guests as I recall. It was all brand new stuff. The stuff from his party will likely be passed on with the note "It originally came from mad old Bilbo Baggins, who vanished in a flash of light on his own birthday of all days!" :}
ArPharazonV: so Bilbo's presents were not actual mathoms, most likely :-)
Eonwe Valar: -"But at least he fed the guests well first" :}
AriehnV: and he actually gave useful things that would be very welcome to poorer folks
karakedi25: or perhaps things that might have a value one day, or had sentimental value. Bilbo's dwarf mail was kept in the Mathom House until he left the Shire
Menelvagor Valar: that he did!
VardaValar1: Bilbo's birthday was unusual that way, and that was part of the excitement. Maybe the spoons were spares.
ArPharazonV: Sam's father got 3 sacks of potatoes if I remember right :-)
ArPharazonV: and some other stuff
AriehnV: correct :-)
VardaValar1: Bilbo had a special set of presents, mostly jokes with points, some because they were very needed.
AriehnV: ah yes i like his notes
ArPharazonV: those were the presents given on the day after his birthday though, more goodbye-presents than birthday-presents
Menelvagor Valar: such as the gift that held a bunch of letter paper, for someone who never answered any letter whatsoever.
ArPharazonV: and not all the guests got one of those ;-) only a select few were invited in for their present
Menelvagor Valar: Lobelia for one.
Menelvagor Valar: who was literally fuming over her present.
Eonwe Valar: Then somehow everyone got the word that the whole of Bag End was being given away.
Menelvagor Valar: which, and I do quote: "didn't keep her from taking the spoons anyway."
VardaValar1: She took the point, but she also took the spoons.
Eonwe Valar: Hehe
Menelvagor Valar: or something like that, aye :-)
Eonwe Valar: Wonderful wording.
Eonwe Valar: Exactly what it says, as I recall :}
VardaValar1: Tolkien's love of poetry informed his prose. It can be seen everywhere.
Menelvagor Valar: been a while since I read LotR, so I defer :-)
ArPharazonV: within a short time, people were running off with anything that wasn't nailed down, and labels got all mixed up....
VardaValar1: And a rumor went around that everything was being given away.
VardaValar1: Shovels used, hunting treasure.
ArPharazonV: and of course people checking the rooms for treasure, aye
ArPharazonV: Frodo had to evict a few
VardaValar1: Merry and Pippin helped with running them off and getting things straightened. A spot where we see them as true friends early on.
Menelvagor Valar: aye.
AriehnV: aiya :-)
ArPharazonV: actually, Pippin wasn't in the story in that point (well, in my edition) but Merry helped with the gifts and Lobelia ;-)
Menelvagor Valar: I doubt any edition would have such a thing edited out.
ArPharazonV: that's something I noticed about those early scenes
VardaValar1: I make errors of memory too. When did Merry show up? [Note: Varda meant to say Pippin. Pippin is first mentioned in the second chapter, as one of Frodo's two closest friends after Bilbo left.]
ArPharazonV: after 17 years had gone by, Frodo had seemingly not aged, but Sam, Merry and Pippin had grown older, which means they were quite young at Bilbo's party
ArPharazonV: Merry, for example, yes
AriehnV: Hmm after Frodo decides to close the shop
AriehnV: on the birthday itself wasnt it?
ArPharazonV: he was the only one to be mentioned in those days after the party, helping Frodo clean up/close up from the party and with the gift-giving the next day
Menelvagor Valar: I think Pippin was the one who drove the wagon towards Crickhollow with Fredegar Bolger.
ArPharazonV: at the age of 19, quite impressive
ArPharazonV: no, Merry drove the car with Fredegar, Pippin and Folco stayed behind :-)
Menelvagor Valar: and Frodo, Merry and Sam started the walk across the shire.
Menelvagor Valar: ah.
Menelvagor Valar: well, at least I got something right :-D
ArPharazonV: but Folco went home after lunch, and Frodo/Sam/Pippin left that evening
VardaValar1: Aye, I remember Merry leaving to set up Crickhollow with Freddy.
ArPharazonV: Merry met them again at the Bucklebury Ferry when farmer Maggot came riding with his 3 passengers
VardaValar1: Aye, they thought he was a black rider at first. :-)
ArPharazonV: indeed!
AriehnV: LObelia came very late on the day after the birthday , and Merry tried to stop her going to him
ArPharazonV: but it was just Merry on a pony, hidden underneath a scarf :-)
AriehnV: "He is indisposed*#
VardaValar1: Now that's a friend. To stop the lady dragon on her way. :-)
ArPharazonV: Indeed! And when she left she tried to insult Frodo by calling him a Brandybuck, and Merry replied that it was a compliment, and, as such, not true ;-)
VardaValar1: hehe aye
VardaValar1: But Frodo's mom was Primula Brandybuck.
ArPharazonV: it's all freshly read for me, so I remember some details still *grin*
Menelvagor Valar: Lobelia more resembled an entire slew of dragons in her early pre-jail years.
AriehnV: oh one got to love those scenes , they always make me chuckle
VardaValar1: Yay for short term memory!
ArPharazonV: quite, Varda!
ArPharazonV: Merry was interestingly independent in those early chapters
ArPharazonV: he was a serious help to Frodo at the young age of 19, long before his coming to age, and in their later days in the Shire he took up a bit of a leading role too
ArPharazonV: driving the cart instead of joining their walk, meeting up with them at the ferry, and leading their journey into the Old Forest
VardaValar1: He takes Pippin under his wing on the journey too.
Menelvagor Valar: The one thing I remember quite fondly is Lobelia's sudden popularity after she is freed from prison in the scouring of the shire.
VardaValar1: That was a wonderful bit. :-)
ArPharazonV: she had never been popular before ;-)
karakedi25: Yes, she resisted the bullies and ruffians when others were afraid
VardaValar1: She gave Bag End back to Frodo too.
Menelvagor Valar: brought a tear to my eyes every time I read that part.
ArPharazonV: went back to her family at Bracegirdle, I think?
Menelvagor Valar: I think so, yes.
ArPharazonV: or her family, the Bracegirdles, at some town or other
ArPharazonV: don't remember what was that
ArPharazonV: *what
VardaValar1: and didn't live long after.
ArPharazonV: well she was already 102 at the time
Menelvagor Valar: Lotho's death hit her hard.
VardaValar1: Aye and aye
Menelvagor Valar: but she did die a hero to the shire.
VardaValar1: Remembered well. A parallel to Theoden in hobbit terms.
Menelvagor Valar: which is something none of us would have been able to contemplate the first time we read LotR.
Menelvagor Valar: aye, exactly :-)
ArPharazonV: I think that after she was taken, Farmer Cotton commented something like "Some have been taken that are more missed than her, but she put up more of a fight than most"
Menelvagor Valar: aye.
Menelvagor Valar: she was the first who really stood up to the bounders gone bad.
Eonwe Valar: Everything has gone quiet, so I'm guessing it's time to bang the gavel.

Eonwe Valar: Or, if we have the inclination, we can talk about the RP.
Eonwe Valar: Assuming everyone hasn't just vanished into other tasks :}
VardaValar1: boo
ArPharazonV: I should sleep soon. Alarmclock going off in some 8 hours and all that.
VardaValar1: We do need to do the rp
VardaValar1: I had last post.
Menelvagor Valar: I think there's not much I can add at this point.
VardaValar1: Estarion might wake up.
VardaValar1: A horse hoof could do it.
Menelvagor Valar: I'd prefer to wait a few more posts before I do any such thing :-)
Menelvagor Valar: and besides, I am already awake :-)
VardaValar1: ok
karakedi25: not really
karakedi25: you're still delusional
VardaValar1: So who is able to post next, or should I have made a much longer post. I thought he was still delusional too.
Menelvagor Valar: delusional, but awake :-D
karakedi25: I think Meren would appreciate someone coming to help her with Estarion.
Menelvagor Valar: I'd not be flying at Meren if I was asleep really :-)
VardaValar1: We need you to snap out of the delusional state.
Menelvagor Valar: clobber me with the club Meren has :-)
ArPharazonV: I could try to interfere, my daggers wouldn't be much use... I'm thinking this might be a job for Eonwe, as he's already shown to best Estarion in swordsmanship
ArPharazonV: *Auros
Menelvagor Valar: I was really expecting to be clobbered :-D
karakedi25: Meren wants to restrain him until he's fully recovered.
VardaValar1: Is anyone able to do a ranged attack on the spiders?
ArPharazonV: for my part, I could help Fainan by targetting a few spiders
ArPharazonV: hehe
Eonwe Valar: I thought Estarion was already dealt with, a horse's hoof pinning him down and all.
karakedi25: She and the horse could probably hold him, but that takes both of them out of action.
ArPharazonV: you know, accidentally break the rope, send Fainan flying to shore Tarzan-style...
karakedi25: (Meren and the horse, that is)
VardaValar1: o goody
VardaValar1: Not sure I want help now. ;-)
karakedi25: Maybe Frali could come sit on Estarion :-)
VardaValar1: Does Meren have a ranged attack?
ArPharazonV: I'll make a post attacking the spiders with a few daggers. Won't be tonight though.
ArPharazonV: I was kidding about the rope, I can aim better than that.
VardaValar1: That could lose your daggers in the river, might not be a good plan.
karakedi25: she can shoot a bow, but not as well as the professional scouts
ArPharazonV: I have large stashes of them all over the forest, and I've got a couple of daggers that return to my hand now ;-)
VardaValar1: Do we have any other ranged attacks? If not, I'll go on as is.
ArPharazonV: made in Dale!
VardaValar1: Boomawhatsis? :-)
karakedi25: Meren has had basic warfare training
VardaValar1: Does Meren even have a bow?
ArPharazonV: Yeah, I know the boomerang-dagger or boomagger for short isn't really a fitting name. Thinking of retconning it.
VardaValar1: Feel free :-)
ArPharazonV: You know... if I ever come up with something.
karakedi25: she has a bow, not a great one, but a usable one
karakedi25: and a moderate stock of average arrows
ArPharazonV: but yeah, I'll toss a few daggers, I've got plenty and can always pick some up elsewhere as we go.
VardaValar1: Ahh, didn't remember that. Thought of her as a staff wielder.
ArPharazonV: But I'll see.
VardaValar1: What about Eonwe?
ArPharazonV: Will make a post next week.
VardaValar1: I was trying to get other people to post a bit, as Estarion and Meren and Frali had the recent posts.
Eonwe Valar: I have nothing to post at the moment.
VardaValar1: but whatever works
VardaValar1: Does Auros have a ranged attack?
Menelvagor Valar: Estarion is a scout, so he might have a bow somewhere.
Eonwe Valar: Auros did not bring a bow with him, no.
VardaValar1: Thanks.
Menelvagor Valar: but I don't think he has one, being specialized in swordsmanship.
VardaValar1: Maybe Fainan will just continue her post.
Menelvagor Valar: and never having shown to use a bow either.
Menelvagor Valar: doesn't necessarily mean he doesn't have one though.
VardaValar1: What about Cal? Is he going to enter in somewhere?
VardaValar1: sorry, that is Phar :-)
ArPharazonV: Yes. Yes. I'm throwing daggers at spiders. I'm posting soonishly but not tonight.
VardaValar1: okies
karakedi25: Meren actually has a sword, but no Wood Elf would be unable to use a bow, I'd think.
VardaValar1: No staff?
VardaValar1: I am thinking of Elatan's old character, probably. :-)
karakedi25: I suppose she could use a staff, but more likely a blade.
VardaValar1: You folks may have spiders incoming. :-)
karakedi25: I can have her use a staff if it would be better.
VardaValar1: Not a lot, I'll fix that.
AriehnV: Frali could come to Merens help i guess
VardaValar1: I am thinking of you as Alasse, probably. Will reread and get straight. ;-)
karakedi25: She'd appreciate that. Get Estarion out of action until he recovers his wits.
AriehnV: he is closest to them both i think
VardaValar1: Estarion is pinned very well. I'd like to see him come out of his delusional state.
karakedi25: Actually Meren is something of a combination of LM and minstrel.
VardaValar1: A.....lutist? :-)
karakedi25: hehe
karakedi25: essentially a herbalist and scholar who knows healing songs
AriehnV: unfortunately throwing a bucket full of water over Estarions head is not an option :-(
VardaValar1: hmmm :-)
karakedi25: not river water, anyway :-)
VardaValar1: hehehe
VardaValar1: So Fainan has the post after Fainan? : )
ArPharazonV: if you want to make one now, yes... or you can wait until I do something, but for now, I'm going to save and send and go to bed
Menelvagor Valar: well, thing is, there is something nagging at the back of Estarion's head, saying that something is wrong.
Menelvagor Valar: so the more things that seem "wrong" to him, the faster he'd snap out of it I guess.
VardaValar1: I'd rather do this dance in LotRO right now. No hurry. :-)
Menelvagor Valar: Though I suppose Meren is a bit lucky Estarion completely forgot about his own sword :-)
VardaValar1: Tied for the crossing.
AriehnV: hmmm Frali can grab some mud and throw it at Estarion
karakedi25: Meren knocked his sword away from him with the branch
Menelvagor Valar: a really fat goblin throwing mud... now that is reaaaaaaally wrong!
AriehnV: looool
Menelvagor Valar: that was the Orc Sword he picked up from the scout.
Menelvagor Valar: He hasn't touched his own, hanging at his belt, sheathed.
karakedi25: Have Frali help put some rope around Estarion until he recovers.
ArPharazonV: ok, saving and sending transcript, will read up on this later
VardaValar1: Thanks Phar :-)
ArPharazonV (1:39:59): saved
VardaValar1 (1:40:01): I doubt we'll do much more tonight.
Menelvagor Valar (1:40:13): Yeah.
Menelvagor Valar (1:40:21): I am reluctant to post just yet.
Menelvagor Valar (1:40:32): I'd like to see how others deal with Estarion's sudden madness.
Menelvagor Valar (1:40:48): Meren's previous post just warranted an immediate response.
karakedi25 (1:40:49): yes, you really need to recover now
VardaValar1 (1:40:51): We just figure it's the water and he'll be over it shortly.
VardaValar1 (1:41:04): Aye, good scene. :-)
Menelvagor Valar (1:41:24): yeah, I figured the water would have some unforeseen effect on an Avari.
Menelvagor Valar (1:41:34): not much, but enough to be bothersome :-D
VardaValar1 (1:41:45): He's not that different from a Silvan.
ArPharazonV (1:41:50): sent
VardaValar1 (1:41:55): They are probably pretty well merged.
Menelvagor Valar (1:42:02): true, but the effects on silvans were never fully explained.
Menelvagor Valar (1:42:15): not to my knowledge anyways.
ArPharazonV (1:42:29): namarie all, I'm sure you'll catch this in a transcript of your own
VardaValar1 (1:42:31): okies, we'll check out the potential posting later on.
VardaValar1 (1:42:39): With time stamps. :-)
VardaValar1 (1:42:43): Namarie!
ArPharazonV (1:42:43): I'll see you next week!
ArPharazonV (1:42:44): hehe
AriehnV (1:42:45): ah you just wanted some action , admit it :-) i didnt mind that myself
VardaValar1 (1:42:57): We wanted the action. Thanks. :-)
Menelvagor Valar (1:43:01): well, of course!
Menelvagor Valar (1:43:23): and admit it was a really good way of getting action that did not involve direct combat!
AriehnV (1:43:35): i do indeed :-)]
ArPharazonV (1:44:16) has left the room.
VardaValar1 (1:44:26): It was a form of combat.
karakedi25 (1:44:43): Indeed it was, with Meren hampered by the need to do no harm.
Menelvagor Valar (1:44:45): and it instills in everyone the need to combat me, but without harming me if possible, making people need to be more ingenious, rather than the usual hack 'n slash options for regular combat.
VardaValar1 (1:45:10): or pointy sticks. :-)
AriehnV (1:45:13): ok  Frali will pin estarions legs with his weight , i dont think he ll have some rope ready but with the horse having you pinned on the chest , the legs might need restrianing#
AriehnV (1:45:29): pointy sticks only for orc heads .. muhaha
karakedi25 (1:45:31): that would do it until he recovers, which should be soon
VardaValar1 (1:45:48): Plate armored dwarf for leg anchors.
Menelvagor Valar (1:45:54): I think having a horse and a dwarf pin me down would be too weird to ignore that nagging voice in the back of my head anymore :-D
karakedi25 (1:46:06): we'll need all hands available for spiders and possible orcs, and we'll need to leave soon
VardaValar1 (1:46:08): There you go
karakedi25 (1:46:12): good, go that way Menel :)
Menelvagor Valar (1:47:10): Would have loved to see how Auros had reacted though!
Menelvagor Valar (1:47:41): would have reacted*
Eonwe Valar (1:47:56): Smacked Estarion upside the head with the hilt of his sword until Estarion regained his senses? :}
VardaValar1 (1:47:57): He may think it's normal for you. ;-)
VardaValar1 (1:48:03): There you go.
Menelvagor Valar (1:48:26): I really did expect such a response from one of you :-)
Eonwe Valar (1:48:38): Put the crazy Avar back out and hope when he wakes up this time he's thinking clearly.. Sounds like Auros to me :}
Menelvagor Valar (1:48:43): I am, however, quite pleased with Meren's ingenuity :-)
VardaValar1 (1:49:22): Fainan will ignore Estarion for now. ;-)
Menelvagor Valar (1:49:42): not entirely unexpected that ;-)
karakedi25 (1:49:59): *smiles on Meren's behalf*
karakedi25 (1:50:05): it was an interesting challenge
Menelvagor Valar (1:51:15): Now it's an interesting challenge for me to twist all that into the waking nightmare again :-)
Menelvagor Valar (1:51:32): after Arien posts Frali's thing that is :-)
karakedi25 (1:51:44): we need you functional again, Menel
Menelvagor Valar (1:51:48): I will.
VardaValar1 (1:51:48): An elf should have some concept of waking dreams, as that is a fairly normal thing to do.
karakedi25 (1:52:11): (lotro client just crashed :( )
VardaValar1 (1:52:16): ugh
Menelvagor Valar (1:52:32): It's just that I can't really say "And suddenly he felt normal again, and all was well, yada yada, and he lived happily ever after...".
VardaValar1 (1:52:48): The waking dreaming of elves should make them less vulnerable to the river, at least slightly. Plus it is diluted.
karakedi25 (1:53:03): so let your suspicion that you aren't getting orcish treatment grow
Menelvagor Valar (1:53:11): exactly.
karakedi25 (1:54:23): then Meren will sent pointy things at spiders if needed
Menelvagor Valar (1:54:41): "As Estarion hurled himself towards the Elvish looking Orc, it fled. It fled! Of all things possible, this was the least he would have expected. Even in the thralls of fury, this sudden upheaval of everything he knew about Orcish behavior made him hesitate." etc.
VardaValar1 (1:54:42): You may have some up close by then. :-)
karakedi25 (1:54:43): and encourage Estarion to do the same
Menelvagor Valar (1:54:46): something like that :-)
karakedi25 (1:55:26): Plus shouting to the horse in Sindarin.
VardaValar1 (1:55:51): A clue
Menelvagor Valar (1:55:52): aye.
VardaValar1 (1:55:58): Shall we call it here for the night?
Menelvagor Valar (1:56:10): but that sentence was just a small unveiling of what I have in mind for my next post :-)
Menelvagor Valar (1:56:26): just to show you how I intend to twist stuff into the nightmare :-)
karakedi25 (1:56:27): I look forward to it :)
VardaValar1 (1:56:50): *raises a translucent hammer*
VardaValar1 (1:57:09): It makes a surprisingly loud and resonant *bang*!
karakedi25 (1:57:09): good discussion

VardaValar1 (1:57:15): After-meeting or, rp continued
karakedi25 (1:57:22): *holds her ears*
AriehnV (1:57:27): Post
Menelvagor Valar (1:58:20): nice.
VardaValar1 (1:58:24): Good post, Arien. :-)
Menelvagor Valar (1:58:26): one slight thing though :-)
VardaValar1 (1:58:37): *hix
Menelvagor Valar (1:58:39): "hix axe"
VardaValar1 (1:59:07): Thinking about the word axe while writing his.
VardaValar1 (1:59:16): We could come up with new words that way.
AriehnV (1:59:21): hehe
Menelvagor Valar (1:59:46): Hmmm... wonder what would happen if we combined the hiccups with an axe?
Menelvagor Valar (1:59:51): a hopping axe?
Menelvagor Valar (2:00:04): hiccoughs*
VardaValar1 (2:00:07): heheh
AriehnV (2:00:18): ok corrected
Menelvagor Valar (2:00:19): or hiccaxes?
karakedi25 (2:00:30): good post!  that should hold the mad Avar  for a while
Menelvagor Valar (2:00:38): the newest and latest in deadly dwarven weaponry.
Menelvagor Valar (2:00:47): hiccoughs with large serrated edges.
karakedi25 (2:00:57): I think Meren's post should wait until after Menel's, so she can respond to his recovery
AriehnV (2:01:04): haha that would be something for the humour page lol
Menelvagor Valar (2:01:21): aye.
AriehnV (2:01:24): advertisement for Hiccaxes eh/
Menelvagor Valar (2:01:40): I'll need a reminder for that one later though, as I am about to fall asleep here.
Menelvagor Valar (2:01:52): so I'll just write my rp quickly and then head to bed.
AriehnV (2:02:13): same here .. i am ready for bed was working today
AriehnV (2:02:30): good night all :-) Namarie for now
VardaValar1 (2:02:38): Namarie :-)
AriehnV (2:02:43) has left the room.
karakedi25 (2:05:06): nice discussion :)
Menelvagor Valar (2:05:25): almost done with the post :-)
karakedi25 (2:05:29): yay
karakedi25 (2:05:49): Menel, Mirminuial misses your hunter :)
Joldahks (2:06:18) has left the room.
Menelvagor Valar (2:07:08): really? :-)
Menelvagor Valar (2:07:44): I've recently regained a normal sleeping rhythm, actually sleeping at night, making it a bit harder to group up.
Menelvagor Valar (2:12:36): done.
karakedi25 (2:13:22): will look when alasse is in a safe place
Menelvagor Valar (2:13:31): okay :-)
Menelvagor Valar (2:14:05): I made Arien the drop that spilled the bucket of weird stuff into a cleansing dousing of Estarion :-D
VardaValar1 (2:14:36): Sleeping at night is good. We should group up earlier when we can.
VardaValar1 (2:15:01): I need to get better sleeping too. The phone rings no matter when we knocked off. :-)
Menelvagor Valar (2:15:11): hehe :-)
karakedi25 (2:15:18): well done, Menel--I'll answer in a short while :)
Menelvagor Valar (2:15:28): I'll read it somewhere this week :-)
Menelvagor Valar (2:15:43): Namarie, and thanks for an awesome new year's meeting :-)
karakedi25 (2:15:58): and the same to you :)
VardaValar1 (2:16:44): Read your post
VardaValar1 (2:16:56): Grats on an interesting awakening. : )
VardaValar1 (2:16:58): Namarie
Menelvagor Valar (2:17:08): hehe, thanks :-)
karakedi25 (2:20:13): Namarie
VardaValar1 (2:26:58): I'm off of AIM now. Namarie
Eonwe Valar (2:27:11): Take care and have fun.
VardaValar1 (2:27:11) has left the room.
karakedi25 (2:27:35): and namarie to you all :)
karakedi25 (2:27:37) has left the room.
Eonwe Valar (3:42:28) has left the room.