Valar Guild

April 25, 2010 Sunday Meeting

5pm EST (GMT - 5)
AIM: Valar Guild Meetingplace

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Transcript work by:
Ar-Pharazon, Eonwe, and Varda.

Attending: (5)
    AriehnV, ArPharazonV, Eonwe Valar (presiding), Indis-(V)/karakedi25, VardaValar1
    Fladrif is unable to enter the chat room again, but now only his alwin0 name works at all now. Please make sure that name is on your friend list.

Meeting begins
    Forum role-play discussion
    Above discussion continued a little longer.

You have just entered room "valarguildmeetingplace."
Eonwe Valar has entered the room.
Eonwe Valar: Heya Phar.
ArPharazonV: Aiya
VardaValar1 has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Aiya! I'm only about halfway here.
Eonwe Valar: Heya.,
Eonwe Valar: That's ok, there's only 3 of us, hehe.
Eonwe Valar: Gwaihir, Gilraen, Mene, Lungorthin, and Tulkas have outstanding invites.
VardaValar1: People tend to keep coming in - don't be too worried about the starting number.
Eonwe Valar: *mene=Menel
ArPharazonV: Outstanding!
Eonwe Valar: I'll go ahead and chair the meeting. Beginning in 2 minutes.
VardaValar1: Inviting Flad and Bombur
VardaValar1: and Austein
VardaValar1: Thanks Eonwe :-)
VardaValar1: I'll be back and forth, making supper for this mob including guest.
Eonwe Valar: MP :}
Eonwe Valar: OK, Let's begin.

Eonwe Valar: Elen Sila Lumenn Omentielvo!
Eonwe Valar: Membership:
Eonwe Valar: We're here :}
VardaValar1: Yay!
Eonwe Valar: Any other member news?
VardaValar1: A little
Eonwe Valar: Go ahead.
VardaValar1: DeepGroover-T was the Head Figure Judge for a modeling contest yesterday.
VardaValar1: Elwing-V, Fangor-Valar, and myself attended.
VardaValar1: DeepGroover had a display table including some of the figures on our site and that will be added to our site.
VardaValar1: Fun was had by all. : )
VardaValar1: Elwing is currently at our house.
Eonwe Valar: Cool :}
VardaValar1: End report here. : )
Eonwe Valar: Thanks :}

Eonwe Valar: I guess it's safe to move to Web News :}
Eonwe Valar: Web:
Eonwe Valar: Much work going on in background on Games Page, as usual :} I hope to have it done sooner than "Blizzard soon" :}
Eonwe Valar: Any other web news?
ArPharazonV: eh, what's another year or 2
Eonwe Valar: Another year or two and I would have to account for a new set of web technologies :}
Eonwe Valar: HTML 5 and CSS 3 perhaps :}
Eonwe Valar: Althogh that might make the task easier too :}
ArPharazonV: :-)
Eonwe Valar: *Although

Eonwe Valar: Gaming:
Eonwe Valar: WoW:
Eonwe Valar: Don't know if it's been mentioned at a meeting yet, but class previews for Cataclysm have been available since last week.
Eonwe Valar: Among other things.
Eonwe Valar: Lothar:
Eonwe Valar: The usual suspects on during the week. Varda mentioned Fangorn, Sauron, BIlbo, and Elwing have been running dungeons.
Eonwe Valar: I've updated the Lothar player table to reflect all the current character info.
Eonwe Valar: Also, I'd like to make a run through the old school raids before Cataclysm hits, in case one or more of them are changed or lost. I'll post this on the forum as well, and hopefully we on Lothar can get together for them.
Eonwe Valar: Uldaman: I popped in very briefly during the week, but that's about it.
Eonwe Valar: LotRO:
Eonwe Valar: Turbine was acquired by Warner Bros Home Entertainment. Make of that what you will.
Eonwe Valar: Press release is here:
Eonwe Valar: Landroval:
Eonwe Valar: Usual suspects on during the week.
Eonwe Valar: I've also updated the LotRO player table.
Eonwe Valar: Patch and Third Anniversary for LotRo coming tomorrow.
Eonwe Valar: Good time to start LotRO if you ever wanted to, with getting the low price of $9.99 per month for the subscription.
Eonwe Valar: Any other gaming?
AriehnV has entered the room.
AriehnV: Aiya :-)
Eonwe Valar: Heya Arien. We're at the tail end of the gaming section :}
Eonwe Valar: If there's no other gaming, then we can move to Tolkien.
ArPharazonV: oh
ArPharazonV: I've seen Menelvagor in WoW
ArPharazonV: well, we chatted a bit, discussing feral tanking for a few minutes
ArPharazonV: otherwise, not much to report here
Eonwe Valar: Thanks.
AriehnV: i ve had a bit of a Tolkien moment a while back on our server
AriehnV: which or in an instance with the random tool which was quite amusing
AriehnV: I met a character named Annatar
AriehnV: so i asked him for the translation or Atanatar sorry i think
AriehnV: so i asked for confirmaltion of translation and he started to quote the ring poem on me
AriehnV: which was quite nice :-)
Eonwe Valar: :}
Eonwe Valar: It probably was Annatar then, a name for Sauron meaning "Lord of Gifts" :}
AriehnV: yes i t was
Eonwe Valar: Atanatar would be "Father of Men"
AriehnV: i see
AriehnV: bah me and names
Eonwe Valar: :}
Eonwe Valar: OK, shall we move to Tolkien?
Eonwe Valar: Since this makes a nice transition point :}

Eonwe Valar: Tolkien:
Eonwe Valar: Does anyone have anything in particular, or shall we discuss the RP?
Eonwe Valar: None and none? :}
ArPharazonV: Ehh, nothing in particular, no.
Eonwe Valar: I assume Phar is raiding; Varda is afk. Arien, are you also otherwise occupied?
ArPharazonV: I'm not raiding. But I don't have much to say and I'm poking a few forums online in the meantime.
AriehnV: not really
Eonwe Valar: Ok, then perhaps you can remind me of the details of this barricade we have going across the road.
ArPharazonV: I'm not sure if I discussed it here, or with Varda, or just with Menelvagor. But I believe the point was that an enchantment wasn't going to stop a few orcs throwing some treetrunks on the path in a pile a few hours before our arrival.
ArPharazonV: They could easily obstruct our going, even if we can jump somewhat high on our horses, and at least show us down considerably.
Eonwe Valar: I recall that being mentioned in meeting.
ArPharazonV: I know we've discussed webs and all that, but this is a bit different.
Eonwe Valar: Ok, so it's not so high that a horse could not jump it. A pony would be a different matter.
ArPharazonV: That too.
Eonwe Valar: I'm about ready to post Auros' next part, so I'm trying to visualize the scene.
AriehnV: a barricade of trees maybe or branches
ArPharazonV: Trees, most likely. We've got orcs here, a good number of them (also something I discussed with someone: the numbers I mentioned needs not include any Orcs at the barricade, only at the ambush spot)
Eonwe Valar: I really only see one course for Auros at this point.
ArPharazonV: they've got axes, they've got a few hours before we arrive
AriehnV: if it would be of a hight a horse could jump , Fralis pony would probably refuse or run smash inot it
AriehnV: or try to run around it ... just thinking a horse grin
ArPharazonV: They could probably haul down a few trees.
AriehnV: not a war trained horse .. a sturdy pony, good willed and endurable .. so no match for the elven war steeds
VardaValar1: run around is possible, especially in a hurry, but watch out for orcs and spiders.
Eonwe Valar: Well, that depends on the size of the trees we're dropping across the path, really.
AriehnV: hang on who is errecting the barricade? we or the orcs?
Eonwe Valar: A hastily/built barricade is probably not going to have time to drop trees and chop them up, unless they came prepared with the wood.
Eonwe Valar: *hastily built, no slash.
ArPharazonV: the orcs are
Eonwe Valar: By "we" I meant we the authors at that point.
AriehnV: ah
ArPharazonV: well, by hastily built, I don't mean in the last 5 minutes, but they've got a few hours at least
Eonwe Valar: Aye, but the trees of Mirkwood were rather tall, we they not?
ArPharazonV: but it's not like they've been piling up a wall for the last 3 months
AriehnV: how far ahead from the point of our crossing are we now?
AriehnV: or even from the elven camp
ArPharazonV: a few hours from the camp, I'd guess.
ArPharazonV: Maybe more. Early afternoon?
Eonwe Valar: So if they did not bring their own materials from further south to build the barricade, just dropping a tree across the path might not help, and the easier way to get around would be towards the roots of the tree, not the crown.
Eonwe Valar: To clarify, just dropping a tree across the path would make it hard for us to "just go around."
ArPharazonV: would, or wouldn't?
Eonwe Valar: In addition, wouldn't the Elves become aware of falling trees ringing through the forests? If too far ahead of the ambush, the enemy could end up with more than just our group (which might not be bad, from we the writers' perspective)
Eonwe Valar: I'm sorry, Phar. Would or wouldn't what?
ArPharazonV: It's a thick forest, as shown in the Hobbit. How far would sound reach?
VardaValar1: Quite far.
ArPharazonV: would dropping a tree across the path make it hard for us to "just go around", or wouldn't it?
VardaValar1: Our hooves at a gallop make noise too, covering some sound.
ArPharazonV: seemed a bit contradictory since you're implying that it wouldn't be any use as a barricade
VardaValar1: Dump underbrush on the path?
ArPharazonV: or maybe I'm not reading you right
Eonwe Valar: It would make it hard for us to "just go around." Depending on the size of the tree, which as I recall were quite large. But it would take perfect aim in a thicker forest too, to do it properly and not end up with it just leaning against another tree.
AriehnV: or actually a famous strategy of King Arthur was .. who remembers?
Eonwe Valar: Pulling a swrod from a stone? Sorry :}
ArPharazonV: hehe
Eonwe Valar: *sword
AriehnV: its what i would do actually if i wanted to stop riders
ArPharazonV: which is?
AriehnV: .. dig a hole in the path and fill it spiky branches
ArPharazonV: ..Huh.
AriehnV: or several small holes a bit set apart
AriehnV: to make the horses stumble and fall
AriehnV: (Legend has it that King Arthur used this indeed several times )
VardaValar1: We are really assuming this path is not enchanted vs baddies, it seems.
Eonwe Valar: If the path *was* enchanted, I don't think the orcs would be digging on it, and if it were that easy, why didn't the trap-door spiders from earlier in the story just dig right under us and suck our group into their domain?
ArPharazonV: Well it depends on the strength of the enchantment. What can it do against a few trees knocked down on it a few hours prior?
ArPharazonV: What can it do against a hole recently dug?
AriehnV: trees could actually just not fall in the right direction to block it completely
Eonwe Valar: I'm sure we've quoted the at one point the nature of the enchantment of the road before. Does anyone have it handy? I don't have my Hobbit easily accessible.
AriehnV: got it here
ArPharazonV: if I remember the quote well, it wasn't even conclusive about the enchantment, just that there was a protection going on which might as well just have been a regular elf patrol
ArPharazonV: and all it really commented on was the cobwebs, as far as I recall
Eonwe Valar: What about the Elf party-grounds?
ArPharazonV: ah, what was said about that I don't remember
ArPharazonV: except that the spiders avoided these places like the plague
VardaValar1: Gandalf was adamant that the dwarf-party stay on the road, as if there were dire consequences for straying off of it.
VardaValar1: The feast areas were definitely said to be places that the darkness lightened up and the spiders avoided.
AriehnV: i didnt find any detalils about the enchantment apart that both Beorn and Gandalf were adamant about staying on it
VardaValar1: It may be something like an avoidance enchantment, perhaps discomfort for the ones it's against.
AriehnV: and that they called it *safe*
VardaValar1: And why in the world would it be safe? We can see that it looks like a great trap as we know where people are going and it's narrow with thick dark woods around it.
ArPharazonV: Well, this was 60 years prior. Orc and spider activity might have been lower near the path. And there might be regular elf patrols, though why they never caught the dwarves would then be odd.
VardaValar1: Thanks for mentioning Beorn. That's two magic types. : )
VardaValar1: The dwarves promptly got off the path. : )
ArPharazonV: Yes, I meant, if there were regular elf patrols keeping the path safe, why didn't they see the Dwarves before the Dwarves strayed?
ArPharazonV: what prevents a troop of spiders walking the same way the Dwarves did and also go undetected?
AriehnV: the more we discuss the less i think a true ambush likely .. a skirmish yes , maybe a patrol could just come from the other side just as they want to erect it
Eonwe Valar: The badguys tend to not like anything Elvish, and avoid it when possible.
AriehnV: unless you insist on an ambush and us being captured ?
ArPharazonV: not being captured, but definitely a confrontation instead of "forget this, let's run" and escape
VardaValar1: I am against the trite and constant bit of having the party captured.
ArPharazonV: I would also think that if there was an ambush, they wouldn't take any chances of just letting the Elves run for it before the Orcs could catch up.
Eonwe Valar: Good luck capturing Auros at least. If it comes down to it, he'll,... he'll....
AriehnV: just thhinking whether an ambush really would be possible if it is guarded and enchanted
Eonwe Valar: um, throw a Dwarf at you! :}
VardaValar1: It still seems like a determined group of orcs and spiders knowing we were coming could shoot and maybe throw webs, something going quickly across the path, maybe?
VardaValar1: Not much help in the books really, on the mechanics.
ArPharazonV: Yes. That was my point, Varda.
ArPharazonV: But what could it be?
VardaValar1: But it would be difficult to put stakes up for instance.
VardaValar1: Throw spears, shoot arrows, shoot web strings.
ArPharazonV: web strings?
VardaValar1: But then why is the path *safe*? I don't get it.
VardaValar1: A spider sends out one string at a time, not a whole net.
ArPharazonV: yes, true
ArPharazonV: but would that have any effect on a group of horses racing through?
VardaValar1: The string can be sticky or not.
VardaValar1: Horses shy at paper in the road. Spears and arrows etc would be upsetting.
VardaValar1: might even graze someone.
ArPharazonV: could it force us into a confrontation? a fight? is there anything they can do to actually *stop* us from just running through?
AriehnV: it could
AriehnV: Fralis Pony]
ArPharazonV: that's why I came up with the barricade, but otherwise it could work
AriehnV: the elven horses might shy burt might be able to avoid thrown things
AriehnV: the pony .. probably Dale bred , would have rather less chance
AriehnV: and is not used to anything more exciting than falling apples from a tree or leaves
Eonwe Valar: You know, given that we're in flight, if we're too far from the Forest Gate, why not simply flee through the woods to one of the Elf-clearings? We have 2 Mirkwood Elves who could guide us to one with ease.
ArPharazonV: I now have a weird mental image of an apple falling from a tree and a scared pony bolting away from it.
AriehnV: hehe :-D
AriehnV: But Eonwe is right yes
Eonwe Valar: Put simply, I think Auros is about through with running at this point, and is at the "Come face me, if you dare" point :}
VardaValar1: In any case, the orcs can scare the horses and pony off the path, like a sudden mass of loud screaming and drumming their weapons together.
VardaValar1: Then we would want to make a run for one of those feasting areas, aye. :-)
VardaValar1: Then we can turn and bare our teeth in one of those areas.
ArPharazonV: That could work. And of course there's the isolated Estarion-thing now.
ArPharazonV: Are you that ready to give him up?
Eonwe Valar: The enemy picked the ambush spot, but Auros will pick the ground upon which to fight :}
VardaValar1: Is Calion also out there?
VardaValar1: We aren't giving up on Estarion.
ArPharazonV: Calion's with you. Calaron's after Estarion.
VardaValar1: Ok, so Calion saw the arrow, recognized it, but stuck with us.
Eonwe Valar: I haven't posted since Estarion pulled his disappearing act.
ArPharazonV: Calion has his own reasons for seeking the confrontation (he wants to know the source of the arrow), but he wouldn't abandon the group.
VardaValar1: One, another patrol may be along and help Estarion.
VardaValar1: Two, Estarion is very good at stealthing through woods and may be just fine, wondering why we were worried. (Fainan's thought)
ArPharazonV: Calaron's not letting him slip so easily though. Trained eye for scouting and all that.
VardaValar1: Three: Getting Auros in one piece to Rivendell with his information is the mission.
Eonwe Valar: Auros has fought Estarion. He has a reason to be concerned, hehe :}
VardaValar1: Fainan doesn't know that Estarion could be so easily unstealthed. He might have info for the group.
VardaValar1: Auros' info could save the Fellowship from walking into a trap, but we don't know that's the mission.
ArPharazonV: I have no lack of faith in the ability of Calaron to capture Estarion or prevent his reunion with the group. He has the body of an elf that's versed into scouting, agility, speed etc about as well as Estarion, but also a troop of Orcs backing him up, and some limited sorcerous powers.
VardaValar1: 'Important intel for the war" is enough to know.
VardaValar1: Aye, but Estarion is not our current main focus. Auros must survive, to use a StarCraft way of putting it. : )
ArPharazonV: It might take some time, but I will get a confrontation out of Estarion, if Menelvagor's in any way willing.
Eonwe Valar: hehe
VardaValar1: Estarion separated from the party willingly without coordinating with anyone, so there's not much we can do. "Don't split the party" as they say in D&D.
ArPharazonV: So even if you run, or fight to one of the clearings, Calaron could still leave a message with Estarion, and if at some point before Rivendell Estarion joins up with us again, message is delivered, though ambush was a complete failure.
ArPharazonV: And Calion will have his reason to go to Angmar, and more information about his brother.
VardaValar1: Right. Calaron will do what he set out to do.
ArPharazonV: As I see it, Calaron at this point has 2 plans.
VardaValar1: And the orcs may dump Estarion into the clearing with us, with a message, and just leave. That would be spooky.
ArPharazonV: Plan A would be to capture one of us with information about Auros' mission, at best Auros himself. This will fail because he'd fail to capture Auros, and Estarion has little information.
ArPharazonV: Plan B, if plan A fails, would be to lure at least Calion and maybe some others to Angmar, where they will fight more on his turf, and perhaps be able to extract said information anyway.
karakedi25 has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Calaron passing the message would be consistent with plan B, but it would still mean plan A, and therefore the original premise behind the ambush, would be a failure.
karakedi25: Aiya, and apologies for lateness
ArPharazonV: Aiya!
AriehnV: aiya indis :-)
ArPharazonV: Dumping Estarion with the message would be interesting. Estarion would first need to be captured though.
Eonwe Valar: NP. You're in the middle of RP discussion now :}
karakedi25: so I see
ArPharazonV: If he *is* captured, what would prevent Calaron/Orcs from just killing him, attaching a note to his body, and *then* throwing him on the clearing?
ArPharazonV: The way I see it, the message has to be passed on a time where Estarion is willing to listen, but cannot simply be killed. This was the confrontation I'm trying to set up between Calaron and Estarion, but I'm at a loss at how to do so.
VardaValar1: If Menel decides he doesn't want to do the rp anymore, we could do the body thing.
VardaValar1: Aiya Indis :-)
ArPharazonV: Aiya
ArPharazonV: I don't think we need to count on that scenario, I have seen no reason from him why he'd want to quit?
VardaValar1: Calaron can just tell his message to Estarion, either making Est think he's picking up intel or making it sound like a threat/warning.
ArPharazonV: Anyway. We've got 2 lines of thought here. We either need to get our party to the clearing or something, and we need to pass the message to Estarion and have him meet up with the party.
ArPharazonV: Do you think Estarion would listen?
VardaValar1: We need to get the party to the clearing, as one story arc.
ArPharazonV: I think we can only really set up the second part with Estarion. Have him decide if he wants to stay, and plan with him how the message gets delivered.
VardaValar1: Then Est can meet up with us there.
Eonwe Valar: Writing... :}
AriehnV: i d suggest the clearing nearer to the other of the forest
ArPharazonV: The first part, getting to the clearing, is something for us to decide.
VardaValar1: We're moving fast so we may be near the edge of the forest near an outer clearing. Est needs a way to get some speed.
AriehnV: Tarzan .. wahahaha ..
ArPharazonV: If we're stuck fighting in a clearing, it'd give him time to reach.
AriehnV: .. ooops lol
ArPharazonV: Anyway, I should be going. 5 hours until the alarm clock goes and all that.
AriehnV: sorry just hinking of a way how to move faster in a farost and somehow these long shoots came to my mental eye and Estarion swinging between them
AriehnV: but thats something he must decide how he does it
ArPharazonV: I can remove the barricade from my post, set up something else, and see how we're chased into the forest. The scenario of orcs making noise could be something.
ArPharazonV: But I'll do that after reading Eonwe's post, which he appears to be making right now.
ArPharazonV: Won't be tonight though, I'm gonna save and send.
ArPharazonV: Me being gone 3 weeks in about a month will make posting slow anyway, we (or you, you know what to do) should have plenty of time to discuss it with Menelvagor.
AriehnV: i wontbe here next sunday .. i ll go a round headbanging with Hammerfall in Glasgow :-)
ArPharazonV: :-) have fun!
ArPharazonV: saved transcript
AriehnV: thankies Phara ),  ll follow soonish getting a wee bit sleepy
ArPharazonV: transcript sent
ArPharazonV: Namarie all!
AriehnV: Namarie Phara :-)
VardaValar1: Thanks and namarie!
VardaValar1: Est could get the horse that's following Fainan
ArPharazonV has left the room.
AriehnV: yeah if Estarion left it behind it must be following the group , he didnt mention it would run back home on its own
VardaValar1: Est told the horse to follow Fainan.
VardaValar1: The orcs and what-not could get it separated from Fainan and Est could reach it then. The orcs are after the people, not a riderless horse.
karakedi25: unless they want it to eat....
VardaValar1: Aye, but they're a bit busy for hunting at the moment.
Eonwe Valar: There, I think Auros should've thoroughly overdone it now :}
VardaValar1: Namarie folks :-)
VardaValar1: ok, I'll go look at that, not exactly leave
Eonwe Valar: If we're leaving I suppose I should bang the gavel :}
Eonwe Valar: *Bangs Gavel*

Eonwe Valar: Aftermeeting :}
AriehnV: aye .. getting yawning fits and a black terror puss who wants her chair
AriehnV: (Shadow loves to sleep on the chair i use to sit on when i am at the comp)
VardaValar1: Auros already knows about the enchanted clearings?
Eonwe Valar: I don't see why he wouldn't?
VardaValar1: and no MW elf is going to show the way?
Eonwe Valar: I glazed over who was leading to the clearing.
VardaValar1: okies. Just left our some potential posts by the group, but it moves us along.
Eonwe Valar: I wanted to get that entire post out while it was still fresh in my mind.
VardaValar1: Flad says: cant get into the meetings anymore :-(
Eonwe Valar: Has he upgraded to the newest AIM?
VardaValar1: He says: and cant log in with my other acount anymore
Eonwe Valar: yikes.
AriehnV: not good :-( ( ,we need our ent
VardaValar1: Flad says:     both the latest and pidgen do not work
Eonwe Valar: That's odd.
AriehnV: bleh forgot that program 's name that i had used for a while
Eonwe Valar: About Auros knowing of the clearings: he has probably been to Mirkwood before, and I doubt the feasts of Mirkwood are as closed to Elves of Rivendell as they are to Dwarves who are suspected of attacking said feasts.
AriehnV: i would think Auros or any Elf of Rivendell would have been an honoured guest
Eonwe Valar: Although, his last vist may have been before Fainana and Calion's lifetimes, hehe :}
AriehnV: nice dramatic post btw hehe
Eonwe Valar: vist = visit
Eonwe Valar: *Fainan's
AriehnV: i ll answer nxt week at some point oki do? time for me to westering home .. er upstairs
Eonwe Valar: Sleep well Arien :}
AriehnV: thanks you :-) Namarie all
VardaValar1: Flad's name is alwin0
VardaValar1: He can talk to you guys one on one. Feel free to try to help him.
Eonwe Valar: Unfortunately, I have no suggestions for his dilemma.
Eonwe Valar: Also unfortunately, I must go afk for a moment.
AriehnV: Namarie :-)
AriehnV has left the room.