Valar Guild

November 9, 2008 Meeting

5pm EST (GMT - 5); (GMT = 22:00?)
AIM: Valar Guild Meetingplace

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Transcript work by: 
Luthien-(TV) and Varda-(Valar)

Attending: (7)
    Aerandir V/mordacil, AriehnV, Bombur-(V)/MrMonkey2002Blah, fladrifv, luthienathariel, Menelvagor Valar, VardaValar1 (presiding)

    Michael Crichton
    Middle-earth: nature of evil

(Times are in CST. Please add one hour for EST.)
Menelvagor Valar (4:00:37 PM) has entered the room.
VardaValar1 (4:00:37 PM) has entered the room.
VardaValar1 (4:00:44 PM): Menel, aiya!
luthienathariel (4:02:37 PM) has entered the room.
VardaValar1 (4:03:11 PM): Suilad, Luthien :-)
VardaValar1 (4:03:45 PM): Worries me. I don't see anyone else's typing.
AriehnV (4:05:34 PM) has entered the room.
AriehnV (4:05:57 PM): aiya all :-)
VardaValar1 (4:06:14 PM): Aiya Arien!
luthienathariel (4:06:19 PM): hi
luthienathariel (4:06:20 PM): Test
luthienathariel (4:06:21 PM): test
luthienathariel (4:06:23 PM): Wascal
luthienathariel (4:06:25 PM): Woger
luthienathariel (4:06:29 PM): Wodewick
luthienathariel (4:06:33 PM): hey! It works!
VardaValar1 (4:06:45 PM): Yay, we're typing!
VardaValar1 (4:07:32 PM): So, Europe and the Americas are back in synch now, all off Daylight Savings Time?
luthienathariel (4:08:07 PM): yes
VardaValar1 (4:08:09 PM): Yay
VardaValar1 (4:08:23 PM): Ok then, 8 minutes past meeting time, so we'll start.

VardaValar1 (4:08:32 PM): Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo!
VardaValar1 (4:08:34 PM): Membership:
VardaValar1 (4:08:48 PM): Eonwe is away with family right now, for a movie.
VardaValar1 (4:09:10 PM): Fangorn and I will be leaving tomorrow, on Monday, to see family and return probably on Saturday.
VardaValar1 (4:09:34 PM): Any other membership news?
VardaValar1 (4:09:42 PM): Oh, and it's my birthday tomorrow.
AriehnV (4:09:59 PM): aah have a nice one :-)
VardaValar1 (4:10:19 PM): Thank you. I expect to see my brother, Meriadoc-(V) on that day. Always fun. :-)
VardaValar1 (4:10:42 PM): No other stuff you folks want to mention?
VardaValar1 (4:10:48 PM): Menelvagor is back, if afk. : )
AriehnV (4:10:57 PM): I am back to work :-(
luthienathariel (4:10:59 PM): Congrats in advance!
luthienathariel (4:11:05 PM): I am back to work too
VardaValar1 (4:11:17 PM): Work lets you pay for the computer and gaming. :-)
VardaValar1 (4:11:35 PM): Oh, and food, shelter, and clothing. Not bad either.
AriehnV (4:11:46 PM): hehe true :P)
luthienathariel (4:11:50 PM): Oh I never look at it that way
MrMonkey2002Blah (4:12:02 PM) has entered the room.
VardaValar1 (4:12:11 PM): Bombur! Welcome : )
MrMonkey2002Blah (4:12:11 PM): Hai
AriehnV (4:12:40 PM): /
VardaValar1 (4:12:41 PM): We're swapping membership news, if you'd like to mention anything. Birthdays, bar mitzvahs, moving, the like. : )
AriehnV (4:12:47 PM): Aiya Bombur
VardaValar1 (4:13:29 PM): Your character gets to be in the next movie, Bombur. Should be fun. Might be your new sig pic. : )
luthienathariel (4:13:37 PM): Oh is that what this part is about? In that case, I "really" started a new job.
mordacil (4:14:01 PM) has entered the room.
VardaValar1 (4:14:02 PM): I hope you like it!
VardaValar1 (4:14:07 PM): Aerandir, welcome!
mordacil (4:14:08 PM) has left the room.
Aerandir V (4:14:11 PM) has entered the room.
Aerandir V (4:14:14 PM): aiya
VardaValar1 (4:14:17 PM): Welcome again. : )
VardaValar1 (4:14:25 PM): Nice name. : )
VardaValar1 (4:14:46 PM): We're in membership news if you'd like to tell anything like birthdays, new jobs, moving, etc.
Aerandir V (4:15:03 PM): nah, nothing significant here
VardaValar1 (4:15:27 PM): No intriguingly green belly button lint? Well ok.

VardaValar1 (4:15:50 PM): Web news:
VardaValar1 (4:16:09 PM): I am behind on putting up stories and getting behinder, but it will get done!
VardaValar1 (4:16:44 PM): Articles will always be put up ahead of stories, and we are calling for articles before the Hobbit movie comes out, to help them.
VardaValar1 (4:17:03 PM): If we didn't have an article up and they didn't get it right, we can't gripe. ;-)

VardaValar1 (4:17:17 PM): Gaming:
VardaValar1 (4:17:35 PM): Did anyone play a game that wasn't WoW or LotRO this past week?
VardaValar1 (4:18:01 PM): Our Dungeons & Dragons game finally broke up after over two years. A couple of members are now in the military.
VardaValar1 (4:18:55 PM): Meriadoc-(V) visited our house and we gamed some. StarCraft/BroodWar is always popular.
VardaValar1 (4:19:24 PM): Had a LAN BW game with Meriadoc, Eowyn, Sauron, Bilbo, and myself, various games to get us all in.
Aerandir V (4:19:54 PM): im trying to get together a DnD group in my town
VardaValar1 (4:20:09 PM): Good luck! 3.5 or 4.0?
Aerandir V (4:20:14 PM): 3.5
Aerandir V (4:20:21 PM): though I have not the DM skills
VardaValar1 (4:20:24 PM): Nice. We still have the books for that. : )
VardaValar1 (4:20:52 PM): You can pick them up. May take a few quick games to get the feel of it.
VardaValar1 (4:21:36 PM): Some members have tried out Warhammer Online and are now returning to LotRO.
VardaValar1 (4:21:48 PM): I assume the ones who really liked it didn't return. : )
VardaValar1 (4:22:30 PM): Aerandir, do you have a fair book collection for DM'ing?
VardaValar1 (4:23:24 PM): If not, you may be able to get your players to help by bringing theirs. We said any book not present could not have its information used, including characters.
VardaValar1 (4:23:48 PM): and spells. Great incentive.
VardaValar1 (4:24:07 PM): Place looked even more like a library than usual.
VardaValar1 (4:24:16 PM): Ok, on to WoW.
VardaValar1 (4:24:23 PM): The Burning Legion is back.
VardaValar1 (4:24:32 PM): Arien, do you have a report for Europe for this week?
VardaValar1 (4:25:23 PM): *wonders if Arien is currently in a WoW battle*
VardaValar1 (4:25:58 PM): Eonwe left us a WoW report for the Lothar server Friday game. :-)
VardaValar1 (4:26:04 PM): Here it is:
VardaValar1 (4:26:17 PM): " This week Sauron, Eowyn, and Eonwë got together and ran two instances in Auchindoun: Auchenai Crypts and Sethekk Halls.
VardaValar1 (4:26:28 PM): The trip through Auchenai Crypts went well and quickly with Sauron's Priest, Eonwë's Paladin and Eowyn's Warrior.
VardaValar1 (4:26:38 PM): The only rough spot came fighting Exarch Maladaar, but he only took two tries.
VardaValar1 (4:26:49 PM): Sauron then switched to his Warlock and we ran Sethekk Halls, with Eonwë's Ret Paladin in the fray dealing damage and also working to keep everyone alive.
VardaValar1 (4:27:00 PM): It wasn't always a smooth fight, but we got through to the end.
VardaValar1 (4:27:12 PM): The biggest challenge was the final boss, and after seeing we could not yet take him 3-man, we called in a friend of Eonwë's to bring him down.
VardaValar1 (4:27:23 PM): He did go down, and both Eowyn and Eonwë completed Terrok's Legacy and got the Shadow Labyrinth key.
VardaValar1 (4:27:34 PM): We had considered going into Shadow Labyrinth, but as most wanted to get some rest, we called it there.
VardaValar1 (4:27:38 PM): End report.
AriehnV (4:28:02 PM): No specific report for Europe this week Varda :-(
VardaValar1 (4:28:22 PM): Menel is in the meeting. Did you see him or other Valarites? : )
AriehnV (4:28:45 PM): just a short mention that my lock passed 60 and Helm is getting darn close to it
VardaValar1 (4:28:54 PM): Congratulations to you both!
AriehnV (4:29:32 PM): meh getting attacked  by basilisk lol never mind
AriehnV (4:29:37 PM): thanks :-)
VardaValar1 (4:29:38 PM): ok : )
AriehnV (4:30:02 PM): thats with the paali i like the powe4rversion still good dps as holy
VardaValar1 (4:30:16 PM): Good to hear.
VardaValar1 (4:30:42 PM): The game had a lot of work done to it recently, lot of adjustments to go through for the new talents.
AriehnV (4:31:16 PM): aye i like what they done so far after they fixed their major bugs on europe servers
VardaValar1 (4:31:25 PM): Excellent
VardaValar1 (4:31:41 PM): How are you liking the inscriptions, glyphs?
AriehnV (4:32:12 PM): I havent got an inscriber of my own so far but they are quite handy, we have a few in the guild
VardaValar1 (4:32:28 PM): Eonwe is the main inscriber for our group in Lothar.
VardaValar1 (4:32:39 PM): We also try to send him piles of weeds. : )
VardaValar1 (4:33:03 PM): The stuff mainly passes back and forth at the bank, but we do some mailing also.
AriehnV (4:33:41 PM): good good, first raid is planned for thursday , but we dont know whether we get enough
AriehnV (4:33:54 PM): always fun to run to BRM on pvp server ;-)
VardaValar1 (4:34:09 PM): Good luck to you all!
AriehnV (4:34:20 PM): :-D thanks
AriehnV (4:34:54 PM): thats it for wow really , and i levelled the burglar on Lotro to 18 ;-) so she is growing up
VardaValar1 (4:35:10 PM): I don't have a report for us Horde folk on the Uldaman server, but Eonwe, myself, and Elwing have been on, working on collecting for the bank. Hard with lowbies.
VardaValar1 (4:35:27 PM): ok, on to LotRO. Arien got in the first word there!
VardaValar1 (4:35:34 PM): Grats on the burglar!
VardaValar1 (4:35:52 PM): This weekend we all get extra experience, good time to play your lowbies.
VardaValar1 (4:36:04 PM): Also returning players can play free this weekend.
VardaValar1 (4:36:19 PM): People are gettting set up for the big expansion coming out Nov. 18
VardaValar1 (4:36:33 PM): Nov 11 for the WoW expansion, right?
AriehnV (4:36:45 PM): Nov 13 th in Europe
VardaValar1 (4:36:58 PM): Our family has sent off for both sets of expansions.
VardaValar1 (4:37:04 PM): Thanks, Arien!
VardaValar1 (4:37:38 PM): We seem to be doing our LotRO runs on the same day as the WoW Lothar group, kind of tough on those with double lives.
AriehnV (4:38:16 PM): i ll run tomorrow after work into the village to order it  :-)
VardaValar1 (4:38:44 PM): WoW you mean? You can upgrade digitally on LotRO for the expansion.
VardaValar1 (4:38:59 PM): Unless you go nuts like Ancalagon and I and order the Collector's Edition.
AriehnV (4:39:30 PM): how does it work with the subscription? If u are now life time do u have to pay again for expansion monthly?
VardaValar1 (4:39:39 PM): Not at all.
VardaValar1 (4:39:47 PM): The expansion is a one shot charge.
VardaValar1 (4:40:03 PM): Just under $30
AriehnV (4:40:13 PM): nice :-)
VardaValar1 (4:41:05 PM): In LotRO, Landroval server, we ran Carn Dum trying to finish up deeds and quests before the expansion.
VardaValar1 (4:41:16 PM): We made a lot of progress. : )
VardaValar1 (4:41:35 PM): Friday, we  took down Urro, a group of Morrovail, Helchgam, and Salvakh.
VardaValar1 (4:41:46 PM): We intended a re-match with Azgoth after the masses of adds got us, but were all too sleepy.
VardaValar1 (4:41:58 PM): Participants were Aeronwy (replaced Belegur when he went to bed), Ancbeard, Belegur, Fainan, Galadhalion, and Lhee.
VardaValar1 (4:42:28 PM): Pardon, the guild names for those characters are Gorlim, Ancalagon, Melkor, Varda, Maedhros, and Amroth.
VardaValar1 (4:42:45 PM): The next day we ran Carn Dum again, some of the same people and some friends. At first it was Fainan and Lhee with friends led by Wulfhen.
VardaValar1 (4:42:59 PM): (Fainan/Varda, Lhee/Amroth)
VardaValar1 (4:43:11 PM): Then as the group started to break up, we added members Ancbeard, Fainan, Kalimacoin, and Lhee, helped by friends Lycius and Yula.
VardaValar1 (4:43:24 PM): (Ancalagon, Varda, Meriadoc, and Amroth)
VardaValar1 (4:43:35 PM): We wiped out a lot of bosses including Azgoth and Avalgaith, and took home the Mirror of Mordirith, now in the Valar kinhouse.
VardaValar1 (4:43:55 PM): A nice trophy, set up near the fireplace. Goes well with the colors there.
VardaValar1 (4:44:42 PM): On the way, we did a lot of titles and deeds for everyone, for orcs, trolls, slugs, and Angmarim.
VardaValar1 (4:44:50 PM): End report.
VardaValar1 (4:45:29 PM): Arien, you might want to try to grab some of that phat experience before the time is up today. : )
VardaValar1 (4:46:01 PM): Any other gaming comments?

VardaValar1 (4:46:18 PM): On to Tolkien
VardaValar1 (4:46:41 PM): First, I must mention author Michael Crichton.
VardaValar1 (4:47:10 PM): He died Nov 4 at the age of 66, having fought a long time with cancer.
VardaValar1 (4:47:26 PM): He  wrote dozens of bestsellers, some becoming movies such as The Andromeda Strain and  Jurassic Park
VardaValar1 (4:47:38 PM): Here is his official site:
VardaValar1 (4:47:48 PM):
VardaValar1 (4:48:08 PM): Here is a Wiki article on him:
VardaValar1 (4:48:10 PM):
VardaValar1 (4:49:31 PM): Is anyone available for Tolkien discussion? You all seem to be rather busy elsewhere.
AriehnV (4:49:53 PM) has left the room.
VardaValar1 (4:50:08 PM): Ok, calling it a night then. Take care, all.
(Switch to Netherlands time)
11:50:10 PM VardaValar: Ok, calling it a night then. Take care, all.
11:51:19 PM Lúthien: oh gosh, that's quick ...
11:51:27 PM Lúthien: never noticed the game talk was over
11:55:16 PM AriehnV: bleh wrong window again
11:55:20 PM fladrifv: Aiya!
11:55:23 PM AriehnV: aiya ent
11:55:47 PM fladrifv: sorry for beeing so late
11:56:19 PM AriehnV: ooh it looks like Varda got dcd as well
11:56:32 PM Lúthien: yes
11:56:38 PM Lúthien: she was a tad impatient
11:56:55 PM AriehnV: what did she say before i got out
11:57:19 PM AriehnV: i know she mentioned Michal Crichtons death
11:57:26 PM AriehnV: that was the last i saw
11:58:04 PM Lúthien: He died Nov 4 at the age of 66, having fought a long time with cancer.
11:47He  wrote dozens of bestsellers, some becoming movies such as The Andromeda Strain and  Jurassic Park
11:47Here is his official site:
11:48Here is a Wiki article on him:
11:49Is anyone available for Tolkien discussion? You all seem to be rather busy elsewhere.
11:58:16 PM Lúthien: "s anyone available for Tolkien discussion? You all seem to be rather busy elsewhere."
11:58:40 PM AriehnV: i am always here even though i might do something else
11:59:09 PM AriehnV: ;(
11:59:49 PM AriehnV: ah well do u have a tolken topic then, Luthien or Fladrif?
12:00:14 AM AriehnV: Tolkien?
12:00:15 AM Lúthien: not on top f my head
12:03:05 AM AriehnV: hmm i was thinking .. one hears much about the " good side" in Tolkiens books , the fights of elves , hobbits and humans against the forces of Sauron or Morgoth
12:03:26 AM Lúthien: yes
12:03:58 AM AriehnV: but not much about the  *dark side* .. even though its not that its they are not mentioned at all
12:04:28 AM Lúthien: what do you mean?
12:04:33 AM Lúthien: like Sauron?
12:04:33 AM AriehnV: can anyone remember where there passages that describe any of those "baddies"?
12:05:06 AM AriehnV: Aye , where are things described that tell about them, their lifestyle and the way they behave?
12:05:09 AM Lúthien: you mean maybe .. Feanor?
12:05:34 AM AriehnV: no i mean , Sauron, Morgoth , the orcs ..
12:05:57 AM AriehnV: or even Ungolianth
12:06:10 AM Lúthien: I find it interesting how Feanor "fell"
12:06:11 AM Lúthien: ah ok
12:06:38 AM Lúthien: there is not really that much about the "lifestyle" of the baddies
12:06:48 AM Lúthien: except maybe the last chapter of LOTR
12:06:57 AM Lúthien: where they mop up the Shire
12:08:05 AM AriehnV: you can see actually a bit from the second part where the orcs take Merry and Pippin prisoner
12:08:25 AM Lúthien: ah yes, indeed ...
12:08:39 AM Lúthien: "looks like meat's back on the menu, boys"
12:08:40 AM Lúthien: that part
12:09:29 AM AriehnV: then of course at the beginning of part six in the return of the king
12:10:09 AM Lúthien: yes?
12:10:14 AM AriehnV: where they carry off Frodo into the Orc tower at Cirith Ungol or what its name is
12:10:18 AM Lúthien: ah yes.
12:10:42 AM AriehnV: aye u learn that the orcs patrol between Minas Morgul and Cirith Ungol
12:11:03 AM Lúthien: yes
12:11:10 AM AriehnV: and they were not very friendly towards each other oh no not at all
12:11:17 AM Lúthien: when they had their little disagreement
12:11:19 AM Lúthien: yes
12:11:27 AM AriehnV: there seemed to be a rivalry between the two camps
12:12:37 AM AriehnV: of course their nature was not exactly peace ful
12:13:04 AM Lúthien: also - that part where Frodo and Sam join the company marching in Mordow ...
12:14:07 AM AriehnV: yup thats the main source of information on orcs in LotR
12:14:31 AM Lúthien: there's not a lot about them in the Silmarillion
12:14:31 AM AriehnV: I get the impression that they served as Saurons military main pool even though they were not the only one
12:14:40 AM Lúthien: yes
12:14:58 AM Lúthien: Sauron also recruited men ..
12:15:11 AM AriehnV: where do you get things about orcs in the Silmarillion?
12:16:18 AM Lúthien: just a tiny bit in the beginning, where they are mentioned as swarming over Beleriand
12:16:36 AM Lúthien: and the discussion about whether they were actually "made from
12:16:50 AM Lúthien: from elves that Morgoth captured in the beginning
12:17:07 AM Lúthien: but that's not in the Silmarillion
12:17:52 AM AriehnV: ah right true
12:18:49 AM AriehnV: other servants of Darkness are mentioned .. starting with Sauron who originally was a maiar . a  fire spirit not unlike Arien
12:19:14 AM Lúthien: lots of fire spirits .. the Balrogs ...
12:20:01 AM Lúthien: there are also the petty-Dwarves
12:20:05 AM AriehnV: there is even a hint that Sauron actually wanted her ... , as partner, but whether it was her personality, her power or her closeness to the  Trees of the Valar i dont know
12:20:08 AM Lúthien: like Mîm
12:20:23 AM Lúthien: yes, I just read that !
12:20:39 AM AriehnV: and she rejected him ..
12:21:09 AM AriehnV: i think there is a phrase that me the reason why sauron and his servants hated sunlight so much#
12:21:25 AM AriehnV: sorry *might be*
12:21:54 AM Lúthien: I can look it up pretty quick .. have it as a pdf file
12:22:28 AM AriehnV: sure feel free
12:22:32 AM Lúthien: Arien
the maiden was mightier than he,
12:22:39 AM Lúthien: and she was chosen because she had not feared
the heats of Laurelin,
12:22:46 AM Lúthien: and was unhurt by them, being from the beginning a
spirit of fire,
12:22:53 AM Lúthien: whom Melkor had not deceived nor drawn to his service.
12:23:00 AM Lúthien: Too bright
were the eyes of Arien for even the Eldar to look on,
12:23:08 AM Lúthien: and leaving Valinor she
forsook the form and raiment which like the Valar she had worn there,
12:23:14 AM Lúthien: and she
was as a naked flame, terrible in the fullness of her splendour.
12:23:33 AM Lúthien: wonderful 't is
12:23:52 AM AriehnV:
12:24:14 AM Lúthien: oh there is more, before that
12:24:21 AM Lúthien: The maiden whom the Valar chose from among the Maiar to guide the vessel
of the Sun was named Arien,
12:24:27 AM Lúthien: and he that steered the island of the Moon was
12:24:33 AM Lúthien: In the days of the Trees Arien had tended the golden flowers in the
gardens of Vána,
12:24:38 AM Lúthien: and watered them with the bright dews of Laurelin; but Tilion
was a hunter of the company of Oromë,
12:24:46 AM Lúthien: and he had a silver bow. He was a lover
of silver, and when he would rest he forsook the woods of Oromë,
12:24:52 AM Lúthien: and going into
Lórien he lay hi dream by the pools of Estë,
12:24:58 AM Lúthien:  in Telperion’s flickering beams; and
he begged to be given the task of tending for ever the last Flower of Silver.
12:25:05 AM Lúthien:  in Telperion’s flickering beams; and
he begged to be given the task
12:25:12 AM Lúthien:  of tending for ever the last Flower of Silver.
12:26:08 AM Lúthien: I never grow weary of reading those lines
12:26:38 AM AriehnV:
 wonderful indeed and a fitting end to our little "Tolkien moment*
12:26:53 AM Lúthien:
12:27:03 AM AriehnV: can u save the file and send it to Varda?
12:27:10 AM Lúthien: there is more that sort of bubbles up now though ..
12:27:17 AM Lúthien: the more I think about it
12:27:21 AM Lúthien: sure, will do.
12:27:27 AM AriehnV: go on then
12:27:37 AM Lúthien: I always need some time to get going
12:28:05 AM Lúthien: well ... it's more the nature of evil that is interesting imo ...
12:28:10 AM Lúthien: why the baddies are baddies.
12:28:14 AM Lúthien: or become baddies
12:28:34 AM Lúthien: but that's a rather large subject I'm afraid ..
12:30:44 AM AriehnV: then lets take it to next week
12:30:55 AM Lúthien: we know that Melkor / Morgoth became a baddie b/c he wanted to ever "get more"
12:30:58 AM Lúthien: sure, ok/
12:31:00 AM AriehnV: and bang the gavel now
12:31:12 AM AriehnV: *bangs gavel*
12:31:36 AM Lúthien: ok, I'll send it to VV
12:31:45 AM AriehnV: keep the topic in mind Luthien and suggest to Varda
12:31:58 AM Lúthien: yes, will do. I like it that this is a topic that gets me going ...
12:32:02 AM AriehnV: i am sure it will get minds going
12:32:05 AM Lúthien: yes!
12:32:09 AM Lúthien: have a good one ...
12:32:30 AM AriehnV: you too
 and thanks for joining in the discussion
12:32:46 AM Lúthien: sure!
12:32:46 AM AriehnV: Namarie for now!
12:32:52 AM Lúthien: Novaer!