October 21, 2007 Meeting
5pm EST (GMT - 5);
(GMT = 22:00)
Back to News
AIM: Valar Guild Meetingplace
Transcript work by: Ar-Pharazon, Eonwe, and Varda
Aerandir V/mordacil, Ancalagon-(V)/Sarujil, AriehnV,
ArPharazonV, arwenv1, austeinM, Eonwe Valar, fladrifv,
Gil-galad-(V)/Xseanzee disco, GilraenV, Glorfindel VG, GwaihirValar,
Menelvagor Valar, VardaValar1 (presiding)
WoW Lothar Tourney Report
Rhythmic images and events in Tolkien.
Science-fiction convention that Menelvagor went to
Helping Eonwe test his new Tourney area on the Games page
Reviews for the Games page: what is acceptable
Info on the Internet
Wiki and Britannica
You have just entered room "valarguildmeetingplace."
VardaValar1: Aiya Ar-Pharazon!
ArPharazonV: Aiya Varda!
VardaValar1: Just uploaded a new story from Enerdhil :-)
VardaValar1: I"ll start inviting
Sarujil has entered the room.
fladrifv has entered the room.
GilraenV has entered the room.
fladrifv: Aiya all
GilraenV: AIya folks
arwenv1 has entered the room.
GilraenV: I'm having a typo day today, don't mind me
VardaValar1: Aiya! :-)
ArPharazonV: Aiya all!
VardaValar1: No worries. I have them frequently. : )
Xseanzee disco has entered the room.
Eonwe Valar has entered the room.
Xseanzee disco: heyy
VardaValar1: Aiya : )
Eonwe Valar: Hey
mordacil has entered the room.
Aerandir V has entered the room.
mordacil has left the room.
VardaValar1: Aiya Aerandir and doppelganger :-)
Aerandir V: aiya
arwenv1: ello =o
Eonwe Valar: Someone has black highlighting on their text, heh.
VardaValar1: Shall we dive in? :-)
Aerandir V: I was going for the star trek LCARS style
VardaValar1: What is LCARS?
AriehnV has entered the room.
Aerandir V: Library Computer Access and Retrieval System
VardaValar1: Ahh, the sun just came out : )
AriehnV: Aiya all !
AriehnV: sorry got delayed by a surprise invite to the spire
VardaValar1: Good news and good news coming up
VardaValar1: Congrats, Arien. Are you headed there now?
AriehnV: no just came back
VardaValar1: Mu = Atlantis to me. ;-)
VardaValar1: Very good then!
AriehnV: so give me five mins for dinner ;-)
VardaValar1: We will let you scroll : )
VardaValar1: Bon appetit, Arien!
VardaValar1: Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo!
VardaValar1: Membership Report:
VardaValar1: New member this week, joined in from LotRO.
VardaValar1: He's read the Hobbit several times and LotR twice
VardaValar1: Since we were chatting, he got a score of 6/5 if that is possible. ;-)
VardaValar1: Perfect score, however one looks at it.
VardaValar1: He says his favorite character (tough call) was Gandalf for all the usual reasons plus his "snarky personality".
VardaValar1: He is a writer and also does comics.
VardaValar1: He let us use a story he wrote set in Middle-earth, humor piece, and you can enjoy his site too.
VardaValar1: That will come under Web
VardaValar1: Any other Membership news?
VardaValar1: So many of you here, bound to be something going on. : )
VardaValar1: Birthday, wedding, tickle-fest?
VardaValar1: Guess not. : )
VardaValar1: The Tolkien Site was busy this week in Stories.
Aerandir V has left the room.
VardaValar1: One by Maedhros is from his Brigid and Greg series, but is purely Middle-earth, humor piece about a Noldo.
VardaValar1: Jay of Lasgalen has been responding to challenges for
drabble stories on what if various people made different decisions.
VardaValar1: Her latest one is a decision by Thranduil in "The Prisoner"
VardaValar1: A new story went up just a few minutes ago by Enerdhil-(TV)
VardaValar1: The Temptations of Eönwë
VardaValar1: So we have at least two stories that are must-reads for our friend, Eonwe-(Valar) ;-)
Eonwe Valar: hehe
VardaValar1: Does anyone else have any web news?
Aerandir V has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Welcome back, Aerandir : )
VardaValar1: You just missed the story list, but can catch it on the recently updated News page.
VardaValar1: We are now in Gaming
VardaValar1: Did anyone play any games besides WoW or LotRO?
Aerandir V: ok, lost ower
Aerandir V: *power
VardaValar1: My sympathy. Ours was out for about half a day recently.
VardaValar1: *blesses batteries*
Eonwe Valar: I played Solitaire, heh.
VardaValar1: Relaxing I hope! : )
VardaValar1: On to WoW then : )
VardaValar1: Arien, would you like to do the Argent Dawn report now?
AriehnV: On thursday night young Alcaria, Ar Pharazons Paladin, asked me for assistance clearing up in Razorfen Kraul
AriehnV: since she needed some lost gem or necklaceor somesuch
AriehnV: so , since nothing prevented me from doing so we undertook the task.
AriehnV: We faced pigs, gnoll things and orcs ... , it was a bit mmessy
in the beginning and we had to struggle more than anticipated but in
the end we conquered all the bosses we wanted although Alcaria didnt
find her necklace
AriehnV: but we did do the escort of the goblin so he could return safely to ratchet
AriehnV: Else on the report side with Valarites Valandile helped us out in Stratholme as second healer
fladrifv has left the room.
AriehnV: was messy too as usual
AriehnV: but we helped a friend level
AriehnV: thus endeth my report :-)
fladrifv has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Thank you,
VardaValar1: Aiyata Fladrif : )
AriehnV: On a sidenote Alcaria found her neckace the next day
VardaValar1: Yay : )
VardaValar1: Eonwe, would you like to give the report for WoW Lothar server?
Eonwe Valar: Sure.
Eonwe Valar: The real world thrust me into Azeroth rather late in the
evening, approximately 9pm. When I came in, there was Sauron, Fangorn,
austeinM has entered the room.
Eonwe Valar: Our intention was to fight the Headless Horseman, 3 70ish people and Elwing's 56 Hunter.
austeinM has left the room.
Eonwe Valar: We gave it two goes, got him in the second phase the first
time, the third phase the second, but we weren't able to seal the deal.
Eonwe Valar: Finding no suitable fifth, we broke it off there.
Eonwe Valar: That's my report.
Eonwe Valar: Except to say other than not getting him, it was a fun fight.
VardaValar1: Thank you Eonwe. :-) Fun is the main object, so you won!
VardaValar1: Does anyone have the Uldaman report?
austeinM has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Elwing was there, and I believe she and Fangorn gamed together as Horde.
VardaValar1: Lord of the Rings Online:
VardaValar1: We are chewing our fingernails for the upcoming patch Wednesday
VardaValar1: It will, among many exciting things, include our new Kinship house for which we have been saving.
ArPharazonV: saved enough?
VardaValar1: A number of us have been working on reputation in the
Sarnur instance and opened up the new crafting area, so close to our
VardaValar1: We have half already on the guild bank, Gilbrennil
VardaValar1: and more scattered amongst our various characters.
Eonwe Valar: Guess I'll be downloading that for the next couple of of weeks.
VardaValar1: Poor Eonwe
VardaValar1: We will be able to have guild storage and decorations of all sorts.
VardaValar1: Also, we will be going for personal housing.
VardaValar1: Also, Book 11 comes out
VardaValar1: We get a new 12-man instance
VardaValar1: with, I think, 8 bosses.
GilraenV has left the room.
VardaValar1: Ancalagon noticed that the kinhouse will have a stage and is working to get a Valar band together.
VardaValar1: He is currently posting on that subject in the Forum.
VardaValar1: All characters can play some instruments, and our woodworkers can make them.
VardaValar1: We may need help collecting critical items to make fancy
instruments, but already have a collection of instruments building up.
VardaValar1: Fanuilos, minstrel bank, is keeping some of those, and you can call on Fainan to help make yours.
VardaValar1: Ancalagon, do you have anything to add?
Sarujil: uh, not really. everything I know is in the post on forums :-)
VardaValar1: Do you need a list of musical instrument crit items?
Sarujil: for music playing, the quality of the instrument doesnt matter
VardaValar1: I've blown away a batch of them trying for a crit, and will keep trying.
VardaValar1: That's all for the LotRO report unless there are questions.
VardaValar1: If any of you have something special you want to discuss
for a story or article, feel free to speak up before I bring up my
topic. : )
VardaValar1: How many of you are here? Please say aye or other appropriate word.
VardaValar1: Arien is almost to 60, then will be rejoining us.
VardaValar1: Yay Phar!
ArPharazonV: but not for long, will go to bed soon
VardaValar1: Guess the two of us had better converse fast then. : )
VardaValar1: Elwing gave me a book, "Meditations on Middle-earth", and one topic really stood out as something we might enjoy, although we may try others later!
VardaValar1: "Rhythmic Pattern"
VardaValar1: In The Hobbit, a pattern of actions suggested a pronounced walking theme.
VardaValar1: A feeling or beat of walking.
VardaValar1: In the Lord of the Rings, it is there too, since it is a traveling tale, but much more complex.
VardaValar1: It's a beat that is subtle, and takes some thinking to catch how he pulls it off.
GwaihirValar has entered the room.
VardaValar1: It's almost a yin/yang system
VardaValar1: Aiya Eagle : )
VardaValar1: One beat comes from the other, and may be a complete reversal
ArPharazonV: ehrm... not good with the yin/yang stuff, not sure I really grasp this concept...
Eonwe Valar: yin/yang, action/reaction, balance..
VardaValar1: Certain elements are repeated, but from almost opposite views.
Eonwe Valar: dps/healing :}
VardaValar1: aye : )
ArPharazonV: and... can you explain this walking theme a little better?
VardaValar1: Oh, and a newly level 60 Arien is now back with us!
Eonwe Valar: Congrats Arien :}
ArPharazonV: oh, grats
VardaValar1: Aye, just getting started, will show some examples.
VardaValar1: Certain images or directions are repeated. Let's look at the Barrow-downs.
Eonwe Valar: Small web news just got mostly ready, if I may announce.
VardaValar1: Go ahead, Eonwe : )
Eonwe Valar: The WoW Lothar Tourney report is now up on the Games Page under Guild Branches, Lothar, Events. Some tweaks still to be made , but it can be read.
Eonwe Valar: That's it.
VardaValar1: Using your new programming technique? : )
VardaValar1: I look forward to checking it out!
Eonwe Valar: No, it's standard to the current iteration of the Games
Page :} I'll more than likely end up rewriting the netire Games Page
yet again for the next GPMU, just because I can and to try and make it
yet better, heh.
Eonwe Valar: netire = entire
VardaValar1: In the Barrow-downs, a single figure is silhoutted against
the sky. But the figure gives a different feeling according to where we
are in the story.
VardaValar1: Go go Eonwe : )
VardaValar1: We have the figure of Goldberry, the standing stone, the Barrow-wight, , and Tom.
VardaValar1: Tom and Goldberry are bright figures in sunlight.
VardaValar1: The others are dark in mist.
VardaValar1: They alternate.
VardaValar1: Compass directions are mentioned frequently, with malign or benign overtones.
Glorfindel VG has entered the room.
VardaValar1: West is good, the direction of Valinor. East is fearsome, the direction of Mordor.
VardaValar1: Again, they alternate.
VardaValar1: "Where are you" keeps being asked.
VardaValar1: Frodo asks it, no answer
VardaValar1: The barrow-wight answers him finally,
VardaValar1: Merry asks it of Frodo
VardaValar1: Frodo and
VardaValar1: Tom give answers, one somewhat cheerful, the other showing how much in danger they were.
VardaValar1: I thought I was lost
VardaValar1: You've found yourself again, out of deep water.
VardaValar1: Descriptions of the country keep switching:
VardaValar1: It has something to do with direction's being benign or malign fairly often.
VardaValar1: It includes descriptions of light or shadow to add to the switches.
VardaValar1: Fog, confusion, silence.
VardaValar1: Sun, clarity, action
VardaValar1: Mood, image, emotion, action keep going back and forth, many times in a chapter.
VardaValar1: But it is a beat, in a sort of walking rhythm.
VardaValar1: The words have a beat too.
Menelvagor Valar has entered the room.
Menelvagor Valar: Aiya!
VardaValar1: Aiya Menelvagor!
ArPharazonV: I ehrm... have a feeling this is getting a little bit too
abstract for me at this time of day, and I need to be off...
ArPharazonV: Aiya Menel! Long time
ArPharazonV: well, I'll be saving then
VardaValar1: I'm probably not telling it clearly enough, trying to cover too much too quickly.
Menelvagor Valar: Too long have I gone astray amongst the stars. I
figured it was time for me to return and shine a little light on Arda.
Eonwe Valar: Heya Menel.
VardaValar1: We could use some light shining through this murk. : )
Menelvagor Valar: Oh... my light is kinda out at the moment. I had a very long and extremely great weekend.
VardaValar1: You can do a counting of syllable stresses, as they do in poetry.
VardaValar1: Normal poetry has about 50%, that is one syllable out of two has a beat on it. A stress.
Menelvagor Valar: I would say so, yes.
VardaValar1: Tum ta Tum ta ta Tum Tum
Menelvagor Valar: But not all, and definitely not contemporary poetry.
VardaValar1: In narrative, it is about one beat in two to four.
Menelvagor Valar: meaning contemporary poetry has a diminished chance of stressing syllables in rythmic beat.
VardaValar1: ta Tum tatty Tum ta Tum tatatty
VardaValar1: It is lower in discursive and technical papers
VardaValar1: with every 4th or 5th syllable getting a beat.
VardaValar1: Worst tends to be in textbooks
Menelvagor Valar: where it's just on every 9.999th syllable generally.
Menelvagor Valar: ;-)
VardaValar1: It has masses of understressed and unnecessary syllables.
VardaValar1: as in "a superfluity of egregriously unnecessary and understressed polysyllables".
Eonwe Valar: Slightly worse than textbooks are instructors with unstressed syllables. Monotone does not make for easy listening.
Menelvagor Valar: yeah, but that's just to get a point across, instructive in meaning so to speak.
VardaValar1: Tolkien's prose is generally the normal narrative ratio of one stress for every two to four syllables, but
VardaValar1: during intense action and feeling the ratio approaches poetry's 50%.
VardaValar1: I am taking this counting from the essay mentioned. : )
VardaValar1: But it feels right.
VardaValar1: But Tolkien is subtle.
VardaValar1: Only in Tom's "talk" which is really song/poetry is it scannable like poetry.
VardaValar1: Rhythm is repetition.
VardaValar1: So he uses images, directions, and many other things to make rhythms.
VardaValar1: He is amazingly imaginative, so it is very subtle.
VardaValar1: They can be in huge sections and in tiny sections, even within a sentence.
VardaValar1: I suggest taking a look at a chapter and seeing if you spot them.
VardaValar1: The author of the essay found huge numbers within 14 pages in the Barrow-downs. : )
VardaValar1: I am done now, unless you guys want to take a look into a
chapter and pick up repetitive imagery switching back and forth. : )
VardaValar1: Images, actions, moods, themes.
VardaValar1: Have fun!
Menelvagor Valar: Hmmm... at any other time I would... but as I said, I am kinda close to "lights out"
ArPharazonV: same, I've been holding for a while, but I really need to
go now... Varda, you were here just after me, so I don't think I'll send
VardaValar1: This is mentioned for your reading enjoyment next time you are in LotR. : )
VardaValar1: Good night, folks.
ArPharazonV: I'll save though, in case a problem with your transcript occurs
VardaValar1: Thanks. Always welcome!
Menelvagor Valar: I was just checking in to show you that I am still
alive and hopefully to tell you a bit about the great weekend I had :-)
AriehnV: good night and have a look at this *grins*
VardaValar1: We're glad to see you alive.
ArPharazonV: Namarie all!
Menelvagor Valar: Namarie Arphie.
Menelvagor Valar: yay!
Eonwe Valar: Take care Menel, hope to see you in the RP :}
AriehnV: night tnight
VardaValar1: Namarie, Phar : )
Eonwe Valar: Take care Phar :}
Menelvagor Valar: Sci-Fi convention talk! :-D
ArPharazonV has left the room.
AriehnV: very interesting this with the rhythm and poetry .. thanks Varda :-) have a fun night all of you
Eonwe Valar: Sleep well Arien :}
Menelvagor Valar: Anyone seen Battlestar Galactica (new series), Star Trek III, ST:TNG or Stargate Atlantis? :-)
arwenv1 has left the room.
Eonwe Valar: Don't like either Battlestar:Gallactica series, seen the otehr options and genreally like them.
Eonwe Valar: *other
AriehnV: Nope am afraid ot
Eonwe Valar: *generally
Menelvagor Valar: Ok, for Eonwe then, I suppose you would know who Q is, Dr. Zalenka and Lt. Saavik?
Menelvagor Valar: (and might know lt. "kat")
AriehnV: good night all :-)
AriehnV has left the room.
VardaValar1: I saw last three, avoided new Battlestar Galactica with
the female Starbuck. I liked the guy in the original and this was my
protest. : )
Eonwe Valar: Lt. Saavik was the Vulcan with Kirk's son when he died,
and was played by two different people. One of them was Kirstey
Menelvagor Valar: The other Robin Curtis.
VardaValar1: Q, yes. He was in ST a lot.
VardaValar1: Lt. Saavik from the movies
Menelvagor Valar: just 9 episodes in the ST:TNG series.
Menelvagor Valar: 7 seasons that is.
Eonwe Valar: I don't remember the name of the guy who play Q, but I
know him in other stuff when I see him, so yes, I know who Q is :} And
Zelenka is the guy with the Scottish(?) accent.
VardaValar1: Seemed like a lot. ;-)
Menelvagor Valar: John de Lancie.
Eonwe Valar: John de Lancie, yeah.
Menelvagor Valar: Zelenka, David Nykl, Chech Republic background, but the scottish guy is the other :-)
VardaValar1: First Battlestar started ok, then went downhill on Earth when they seemed incapable of learning.
Menelvagor Valar: and Kat was played by Luciana Carro :-)
Menelvagor Valar: Oh, of course, normally I wouldn't know all the names
behind the characters... too much of a series fan to get into the
Menelvagor Valar: the only one I seem to remember on occasion is Patrick Steward as Jean Luc Picard :-)
Menelvagor Valar: Anyways, those I mentioned, accept from Patrick Steward I met this weekend.
VardaValar1: Stewart ; )
Menelvagor Valar: I knew I had something wrong :-)
Menelvagor Valar: oh well.
VardaValar1: That had to be a rush, meeting them. : )
Menelvagor Valar: Nope.
Menelvagor Valar: not really.
Menelvagor Valar: Rather small convention.
VardaValar1: I met James Doohan, who played Scotty, and thought that was a rush. Before he died, obviously.
Menelvagor Valar: just 5 guest stars, mostly B actors, those with side roles so to speak.
Eonwe Valar: Ok, I'm lost as to why this tourney
thing isn't showing right. I'm going to have to stare at it some other
time, or it'll end up waiting until I rewrite the Games Page.
VardaValar1: You may need to restart your comp.
VardaValar1: I've had that happen.
Menelvagor Valar: What tourney thing?
Eonwe Valar: restart my computer to get a web page to show up right?
VardaValar1: I had some not show, or show wrong until after a restart.
VardaValar1: No clue why. : )
Menelvagor Valar: and Varda, you'll have to think outside the huge 2k+ attendance cons.
Eonwe Valar: Ok, if I could borrow someone to check out the page real quick so I know whether or not it's me, I'd appreciate it.
VardaValar1: I can do that, but you seemed excited.
Menelvagor Valar: more like 200 or so people a day for 2 days.
Menelvagor Valar: So that is like the actors strolling about the hotel,
striking up casual conversation with random people, eating breakfast
like 2 tables away, that kind of thing :-)
VardaValar1: Gaming, then where?
Eonwe Valar: Games Page, Guild Branches, Lothar, Events
Eonwe Valar: There should be spaces in between paragraphs, I am seeing no spaces between paragraphs.
VardaValar1: Page does not come up
VardaValar1: Menu is cool
Eonwe Valar: page does not come up??
Sarujil: i see the tourney report
Eonwe Valar: How far are you able to get, Varda?
Eonwe Valar: Are there empty lines between paragraphs, Ancalagon?
VardaValar1: I get to the menu on the right side
Eonwe Valar: so the news doesn't show up in the middle?
Sarujil: no i dont see any empty lines
Menelvagor Valar: page shows up fine for me.
Menelvagor Valar: but no empty lines for me either.
Eonwe Valar: Ok, then it's not showing right for Ancalagon or Menel, and thus it's not me.
VardaValar1: Fangorn says hi : )
Eonwe Valar: Heya to Fangorn.
Eonwe Valar: When you click on Lothar under Guild Branches, a smaller submenu should appear to the right of Lothar.
Eonwe Valar: Did you get that, Varda?
VardaValar1: Yes, it did that.
Eonwe Valar: You cliked on Events?
Eonwe Valar: *clicked
Eonwe Valar: and nothing came up?
VardaValar1: It turns yellow in the background and the letters turn red.
Eonwe Valar: What about in the body of the page?
VardaValar1: I'm on a very old comp
VardaValar1: Stays on the news
Eonwe Valar: hmmm
VardaValar1: I can switch to Explorer
VardaValar1: You set it for that, I think?
Eonwe Valar: Please do :}
Eonwe Valar: I don't know why it would be limited to Explorer, but let's try that.
VardaValar1: If I crash, it's because too much is up. :-)
Eonwe Valar: Hehe, ok :}
Eonwe Valar: I'll have a copy of the meeting for you :}
VardaValar1: Thanks : )
VardaValar1: To give you an idea of the power of my computer, the picture on Google search is not showing.
Eonwe Valar: ouch
VardaValar1: Pics on http://valarguild.org in IE not showing. They show in Netscape
VardaValar1: So does the Google pic
VardaValar1: But IE, no
VardaValar1: Can you see the firework pic on the http://valarguild.org?
Eonwe Valar: I can.
VardaValar1: good : )
VardaValar1: On the Games page, I can click Lothar and see the background turn red with white text. No side menu as on Netscape
VardaValar1: IE version 5.00.2614
VardaValar1: Definitely check with someone whose comp is not made of flint and bearskin. : )
Eonwe Valar: Hmm. I guess I'm going to have to add version checking
with the next update. Guess I better put this mental list on paper...
VardaValar1: Really, this is not a surfing comp
VardaValar1: Just something for text and AIM : )
VardaValar1: and where I do my webwork. *cough*
Eonwe Valar: I'm curious how many other members have problems viewing the Games Page.
VardaValar1: I doubt most are using a desperation comp. : )
Eonwe Valar: hehe
fladrifv: *waves* hello all, sorry some relatives called
Eonwe Valar: np Fladrif. Hope they're doing well.
fladrifv: bought a new car grin had to hear all the details....
Eonwe Valar: hehe
fladrifv: oh I can confirm that the valar site works fine her on both ie and firefox...as far as this is relevant news
Xseanzee disco has left the room.
Eonwe Valar: What about the Games Page?
Menelvagor Valar: Good night everyone, I am off to sleep.
fladrifv: namarie menel
VardaValar1: Glad your relatives had such good news. : )
VardaValar1: Namarie, Menel
fladrifv: eonwe works both fine
Menelvagor Valar: Haha, thanks.
VardaValar1: Thanks Fladrif
Menelvagor Valar: Namarie
Menelvagor Valar has left the room.
fladrifv: on ie the pages shows up a little bigger then in firefox
Eonwe Valar: Sleep well Menel.
fladrifv: are reviews of dosgames also welcome?
Eonwe Valar: The two LotR PC games listed there are DOS games.
Eonwe Valar: I can't even get them to run on this computer.
fladrifv: sorry refinement non lotro dos games :-)
fladrifv: yes you can...
fladrifv: dosbox is the key
Eonwe Valar: With Dosbox, yes. I meant by themselves.
Eonwe Valar: Point being that's how old they are :}
fladrifv: oh Im so into old games now that I almost rate it normal :-)
Eonwe Valar: But yes, Reviews of any games are welcome.
fladrifv: would like to do one on the best racing game ever...fatal racing
Eonwe Valar: Surprised no one has sent one of LotRO or WoW yet :}
Eonwe Valar: Actually, I take that back, I would rule out AO rated games since we are a family guild.
Eonwe Valar: Adults Only.
fladrifv: hehe ok, this one is rated 3+ is that allowed?
Eonwe Valar: I think that's ok :}
Eonwe Valar: I assume the 3 means 3 years?
Eonwe Valar: Ok
Eonwe Valar: I'm not sure how ratings systems work for games in your
country, but in the use, we have (roughly) E=Everyone, T=Teen,
M=Mature, AO=Adults Only.
Eonwe Valar: *use=US
fladrifv: ok we have age assignments
fladrifv: roughly 3+ 6+(I think) 12+ 16+ 18+ 21+
VardaValar1: May say on the box?
VardaValar1: Does it only say for one country?
Eonwe Valar: Ok, well I'd say this as far as reviews go, and I think
it's a fairly safe way to do it: if it has anything in it that would
violate our Rules or CoC, I'll quite likely reject it.
Eonwe Valar: I think US games might include age ranges as well, one sec.
Eonwe Valar: Yeah, they do. "Mature" would be 17+, and I would accept
those Reviews on a case-by-case basis. I have many Mature rated games
that really aren't much if at all worse than D2.
fladrifv: I think the whole age system is a little strange
VardaValar1: Plenty of parents seemed to object to Diablo 1, if only because of the name.
Eonwe Valar: If a parent would let their kid play D2 what with the
violence and Andariel and all, then there shouldn't be too much gripe
over Ninja Gaiden, for example.
VardaValar1: To me, the way the game leads your mind can matter, as whether it makes you want to fight or to do evil.
fladrifv: my mother was not that fond of the rotting bodys in warcraft 2 :-)
Eonwe Valar: Of course as parent should always be aware of what their
children are playing. Assuming all video games for children is not an
excuse to let your 5 year old play GTA.
VardaValar1: D1 had impaled bodies and torture machines around.
Eonwe Valar: *all video games are for children
VardaValar1: Not much seems to be for youngsters.
Eonwe Valar: Mario :}
fladrifv: ducktales :-)
Eonwe Valar: The Lord of the Rings games I'd say are relatively good for the 10ish+ crowd., my opinion.
Eonwe Valar: But again, that's the Parent's job to decide, and the parents need to do their job :}
fladrifv: the problem is that the children know more then the parents
fladrifv: 12 year olds playing phantasmogoria (or how you spell it)
Eonwe Valar: Well, I'd say that those who have grown up with video
games are savvier than that, and they know to pay attention to what
their kids are playing.
fladrifv: and yet I think its person dependant
Eonwe Valar: It's essentially (no offense, Varda, and I'd say you are
one of the exceptions :}) the generations who didn't have readily
accessible computers in the home, or video games, that don't seem the
realize not all games are for kids.
fladrifv: I would state that even internet is not a thing for kids
fladrifv: I think I will give my kids only a console :-)
Eonwe Valar: Several of the people around my age (let's say the 20-30
crowd) I've talked to at my unuiversity always say how they're
paying/going to be paying close attention to what their kids play, and
being smart of what their kids are playin
Eonwe Valar: hehe
Eonwe Valar: Well, the Valar Guild has always put itself forward as
family friendly, a place safe from the profanity, obscenity, and
general rudeness and bad behavior of the rest of the internet.
fladrifv: and that is something I really like :-)
VardaValar1: Aye : )
VardaValar1: Perhaps keeping children to consoles is the best way.
Eonwe Valar: Honestly, I would bring my children here if I had any.
Eonwe Valar: And if there were any games we play I would let them play :}
VardaValar1: People do : )
Eonwe Valar: They'd have to gain a few levels, er years, before I let them on WoW :}
VardaValar1: The problem with these MMO's is that we can't restrict to Valar as we did in Diablo series.
Eonwe Valar: Aye
fladrifv: what age would you rate mmorpgs?
Eonwe Valar: Me personally?
Eonwe Valar: I'd say no earlier than 10, maybe as long as 13, minimum range.
VardaValar1: rp servers tend to be more mature. A pvp server can get pretty ugly.
VardaValar1: I have to agree with 10 as being borderline. 11 would be better, and 13 better yet.
fladrifv: I would say 14 as border line
VardaValar1: We have Melkor's grandchildren on our rp LotRO server.
Eonwe Valar: I wouldn't want my children playing around the sesspool of
players before 13, when I've hopefully taught them well enough to know
how they should behave and that the world doesn't always do what it
Eonwe Valar: And that not being an excuse for them to not do what they should :}
VardaValar1: Sadly, there are people who act nastily just because they feel anonymous online.
Eonwe Valar: Aye. I've come to decide the phrase: "When you can do what
you want, you will be who you are." is a better description than the
famous "Power corrupts etc."
VardaValar1: It will be harder and harder to keep children from being online young.
VardaValar1: I agree, Eonwe.
fladrifv: the internet is becoming more voilent I think since its not a place for geeks anymore ;-)
VardaValar1: What one does when one thinks he can get away with anything tells one his actual moral fiber.
VardaValar1: Once upon a time, the internet was for scientists to share info.
Eonwe Valar: Aye
VardaValar1: Now it is a marketing tool and gaming place.
Sarujil has left the room.
VardaValar1: Much of the info is now locked up behind subscriptions for money.
fladrifv: that will be more and more
Eonwe Valar: Aye
VardaValar1: It's not as good a place as one might hope for research.
VardaValar1: People citing wiki make me wince.
Eonwe Valar: Not unless you're accessing it from a library or school who has the necessary subscriptions.
VardaValar1: It's fine as a starting place, maybe, but not as a real reference
fladrifv: wiki is better on technical matters
VardaValar1: Aye. And the number of subscriptions needed is high, and the price for each high.
VardaValar1: Wiki has its place and can be quite good.
VardaValar1: Blind belief in it is what bothers me.
fladrifv: just as bad as britanica is lately proven
fladrifv: Ill try to find the article
fladrifv: http://www.news.com/2100-1038_3-59973 32.html
fladrifv: ....2005 ...last...
fladrifv: seems that my memory works fine
VardaValar1: Yay for working memories!
VardaValar1: Just read the article
VardaValar1: That is very interesting
VardaValar1: Maybe I should reconsider my opinion. : )
fladrifv: I asume its better now for wiki
fladrifv: they have lately implemented some quality checks
Glorfindel VG has left the room.
VardaValar1: Well, for Tolkien, we work very hard on quality checks.
VardaValar1: If Wiki does just as well, congrats to them, and it is much less work for me. : )
Eonwe Valar: Aye, 'tis why we require references on all articles and papers.
fladrifv: wiki will never touch to our quality
VardaValar1: I have been told otherwise. heh
Eonwe Valar: Well, now you've been told both :}
Eonwe Valar: I know which one I'm going to go with :}
VardaValar1: Encyclopedias, including Brittanica, should also not be used as more than a starting point for research. : )
VardaValar1: We are getting a lot more stories than articles. Bothers me sometimes.
fladrifv: real research is lacking starting points in encyclopedia's :-)
VardaValar1: I have found many articles from Encyclopedias too low in
depth or even misleading or wrong. It was a painful discovery.
Eonwe Valar: I don't know why, but my processor is running at 100% right now. I think a computer restart might be in order.
fladrifv: the problem is that over time it will be the truth
VardaValar1: I mean big encycs, not just Tolkien : )
VardaValar1: Good idea, Eonwe
VardaValar1: AIM might be leaking?
Eonwe Valar: Possibly. I might have to keep track of if I'm using AIM when this happens.
VardaValar1: Truth is truth, matters not what people claim. : )
fladrifv: truth over time is a vague border
VardaValar1: We just have to keep trying to find the truth.
Eonwe Valar: I'll be right back.
VardaValar1: Good luck, Eonwe :-)
Eonwe Valar: Thanks.
Eonwe Valar has left the room.
VardaValar1: Sometimes truth in ideas may be easier to do with fiction.
VardaValar1: Even fantastic fiction.
VardaValar1: People don't hit the idea with the same prejudice.
fladrifv: big remark here is ofcourse is the oldest refference the most correct one :-)
VardaValar1: The most correct reference may have nothing to do with age, depending on the subject.
VardaValar1: In science, though, it helps to know the latest research!
fladrifv: working on some papers atm and its quite hard to findout what the latest developemnts are
Eonwe Valar has entered the room.
Eonwe Valar: Processing back to normal.
Eonwe Valar: Well, now I'm guessing aim, because it's shooting up again, and AIM is the only think I have running.
austeinM: what version of AIM?
Eonwe Valar: probably a couple of versions ago.]
Eonwe Valar: minus the ]
austeinM: try this one - it's pretty light on CPU and memory
fladrifv: *promotional teaser* go pidgin
VardaValar1: I know mine is old, because I don't like the newer versions.
austeinM: yeah, the newer ones originally sucked a lot of resources
austeinM: now they're still heavier, but not the 10x they used to be
fladrifv: oho...2 am...thought 1 am...got to sleep
fladrifv: namarie all
VardaValar1: looks interesting
VardaValar1: Namarie, Fladrif!
Eonwe Valar: take cae Fladrif.
Eonwe Valar: *care
fladrifv: *log saved*
VardaValar1: The transcripts also suffered, as they showed every invitation and time out in the log.
Eonwe Valar: pretty sure you can turn that off.
VardaValar1: I had better keep your suggestion in the transcript. It will show a long after-meeting. : )
VardaValar1: I hope so.
VardaValar1: I also preferred having windows of side chat scattered around
VardaValar1: Forced to look at only one at a time, and sometimes thinking a side chat was the main. Funny mistakes there. : )
Eonwe Valar: hehe
Eonwe Valar: Agreed on being able to have the PM windows where I want.
fladrifv has left the room.
Eonwe Valar: Test
Eonwe Valar: Just playing around a bit with settings, taking off the background color now.
VardaValar1: Enjoy : )
Eonwe Valar: Is this too hard to read?
VardaValar1: Try a few if you like
VardaValar1: I can read it ok.
Eonwe Valar: Actuall,y is this..
Eonwe Valar: This ought to be a bit easier :}
VardaValar1: Easier with the dark green background
VardaValar1: much easier, aye : )
Eonwe Valar: To help you spot sections when you go back through for
arranging for the news page, you could always set the font to a bold
and some color you'll easier spot :}
Eonwe Valar: Like this :}
VardaValar1: that really shows up, aye
Eonwe Valar: So like:
Eonwe Valar: Membership:
VardaValar1: When I do the transcript, I kill all formatting first. Any you see was added back in.
Eonwe Valar: Really sticks out if no one else uses bold blue :}
Eonwe Valar: Ah, ok
VardaValar1: Or bold period : )