Valar Guild

April 8, 2007 Meeting

5pm EST (GMT - 5); (GMT = 22:00)
AIM: Valar Guild Meetingplace

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Transcript work by: 
Ar-Pharazon-(V) and Varda-(Valar)

Attending: (11)
    Members: Ancalagon-(V)/Sarujil, ArPharazonV, Arwen V1, Bombur-(V)/MrMonkey2002Blah, Eonwe Valar, FladrifV, GilraenV, GwaihirValar, Menelvagor Valar,  Pallando Valar/Orodreth V/Oessala, VardaValar1

Meeting begins
    Two new members this past week. (Two more after the meeting, see News.)
    New Art Cave
    New Art in another cave
    Topic by Ar-Pharazon-(V): the role of ships, fleets in Middle-earth.
After-meeting: short

You have just entered room "valarguildmeetingplace."
Sarujil: hey phar
ArPharazonV: hey!
ArPharazonV: thought I'd be early, but it seems I wasn't the first after all :-)
Sarujil: i was way too early :-)
VardaValar1 has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Aiya : )
Sarujil: hi varda
ArPharazonV: Aiya
VardaValar1: Tevildo was in LotRO this morning. Did you spot him? : )
Sarujil: i havent been on until just now
VardaValar1: No worries.
VardaValar1: He's at work now
Sarujil: niece and nephew were over for easter
VardaValar1: Happy Easter to you both!
ArPharazonV: happy Easter to the Guild!
VardaValar1: Happy Easter to your niece and nephew as well : )
VardaValar1: hehe - What Phar said!
VardaValar1: for your friend list on AIM: tristerfalm777
VardaValar1: He would like to join the guild and we have been having trouble getting together for a test.
VardaValar1: He is Eledhriel in LotRO
VardaValar1: What am I interrupting you in? : )
Sarujil: huh?
VardaValar1: I was busy writing, planning to start Easter dinner after the meeting. What are you guys up to?
Sarujil: gathering ore :-)
ArPharazonV: building ships and attacking the enemy!
VardaValar1: Hope you found a good spot for ore.
VardaValar1: Um, hope that's not people of Valinor you're going after...again.
Sarujil: he cant help it
ArPharazonV: hehe, no, it's the oppressive empire of the Core that tries to take everyone's freedom by planting consciousnesses into robot bodies
VardaValar1: Guess Eru will take drastic measures.
ArPharazonV: I'm leading the Arm rebellion
VardaValar1: So all the arms will now revolt against the robot bodies! Salutes will be difficult. j/k
ArPharazonV: considering Pharazon's history it's actually quite ironic that I don't do well in aquatic missions... I can't get into this fleet-building ;-)
VardaValar1: lol
VardaValar1: Maybe you prefer wood and water?
ArPharazonV: perhaps! this is all metal
VardaValar1: Does sound like a Morgothian plot though.
ArPharazonV: and submarines, and torpedy launchers, and sonar stations
ArPharazonV: Pharazon's not used to that, he just usually scares away enemy fleets and fights them when he lands on the coast@!
ArPharazonV: - @
VardaValar1: Problems, problems.
ArPharazonV: *torpedo launchers, not torpedy...
Arwen V1 has entered the room.
Menelvagor Valar has entered the room.
GilraenV has entered the room.
Arwen V1: yay!
GilraenV: Aiya folks
VardaValar1: *whew* Much better decorating scheme.
GilraenV: hehe
ArPharazonV: Aiya
Arwen V1: teehee
MrMonkey2002Blah has entered the room.
Menelvagor Valar: hihi
Menelvagor Valar: Well done Varda :-)
FladrifV has entered the room.
Eonwe Valar has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Hail : )
Eonwe Valar: Heya all. Afk for a secd
MrMonkey2002Blah: Hail
Eonwe Valar: sec even
VardaValar1: Tickled anyone at all could come. : )
GilraenV: I'm waiting for Gwaihir to wake up. We're doing family Easter stuff next weekend :-)
VardaValar1: Next weekend? Interesting. Easter is this weekend for us.
GilraenV: same here, but brother-in-law's girlfriend has stuff with her family this week, and mother-in-law's store is being renovated so she wants to keep an eye on the demo, which starts today
VardaValar1: I hope to make this not take too long, turn everyone loose as soon as is reasonable. : )
VardaValar1: That works : )

VardaValar1: Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo!
VardaValar1: Membership:
Eonwe Valar: back and Happy Easter all :}
Eonwe Valar: (sorry) :}
VardaValar1: Happy Easter to all!
Orodreth V has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Good spot to say it, Eonwe : )
Pallando Valar has entered the room.
Oessala has entered the room.
VardaValar1: and Happy Easter to Pallando of the many names. : )
VardaValar1: Thanks to Eonwe's checking of the WoW lists, Maglor-(V) has been reinstated as a Full Member, as he has gamed.
VardaValar1: We have new members.
Orodreth V has left the room.
VardaValar1: DeepGroover-(TV) joined us this week with artwork, models he built, painted, and has shown at conventions.
VardaValar1: He is Elwing-(V)'s brother.
VardaValar1: We have a new Full Member as well:
VardaValar1: Borin-(V), who plays LotRO with us.
VardaValar1: His wife has been a guild-friend for a while, named Piewyn, and introduced us. He's quite a Tolkien fan and they are both fun people.
VardaValar1: She is still working on finishing RotK and hopes to be with us as well.
VardaValar1: Fangorn says hi : )
VardaValar1: Any other membership news?
Menelvagor Valar: hi Fangorn.
VardaValar1: We need testers to keep an eye out for tristerfalm777 who would like to join us. That's his AIM name.

VardaValar1: Web News:
VardaValar1: Art site:
VardaValar1: Elwing sent a new picture, illustrating her story "Midnight Musings".
VardaValar1: The picture is called "Braiding Session", where Elladan and Elrohir get a bit carried away braiding young Aragorn's hair.
VardaValar1: story:
VardaValar1: DeepGroover's new art site is:
VardaValar1: He will be sending more photos, and continues entering modeling contests.
VardaValar1: Any further Web news?
VardaValar1: So you must all be concentrating on the next business : )

VardaValar1: Gaming:
VardaValar1: Who played anything besides WoW and LotRO this past week?
Menelvagor Valar: Final Fantasy XII? :P
VardaValar1: Pharazon, I know you're building ships over there.
ArPharazonV: oh, right
VardaValar1: There's one! Thanks Menel
GilraenV: Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess ;-)
ArPharazonV: still more Total Annihilation, finished the Core campaign, now on the Arm campaign
Menelvagor Valar: oh, and I have been playing a game called homework for a change >P
ArPharazonV: and getting quite annoyed with the naval missions ;-)
VardaValar1: Keep it up, Menel : )
VardaValar1: Thanks Gilraen and Pharazon : )
Eonwe Valar: I played the ME mod for a few minutes this week :}
Menelvagor Valar: oh, and EVE of course :-)
VardaValar1: A few minutes? : )
VardaValar1: You and Pallando, Menelvagor?
GilraenV: (afk)
Menelvagor Valar: haven't seen him online much this week truth be told.
Eonwe Valar: I was trying to play my Summoner in Valar diff on Players 8, decided I didn't really want to play that bad that night after that :}
VardaValar1: Pallando just messaged that he's been really busy this past week. Way it goes. Ol' real life.
VardaValar1: Yipe! Fast death there.
VardaValar1: On to LotRO Landroval server news:
VardaValar1: We've been active there, a lot of members showing
VardaValar1: and a lot saying they are coming, or who have not been able to make contact.
VardaValar1: More folks saying they would like to join.
VardaValar1: Naming is really tricky there, but we are managing.
VardaValar1: Monday is supposed to be "LotRO night" for helping even more than usual if that is possible. : )
VardaValar1: Any further LotRO news?
Menelvagor Valar: Aye.
Menelvagor Valar: I've tried the beta (euro version) and suffice it to say, lag was worse than the WoW beta.
Menelvagor Valar: which says a whole lot.
Eonwe Valar: I wouldn't advise playing during peak hours unless you have cable.
Eonwe Valar: This game is not for modem users.
Menelvagor Valar: would hardly call 5 AM peak hour, Eonwe :-D
Eonwe Valar: *dial-up modem users.
Eonwe Valar: Well, I didn't have much lag during off-hours in closed beta.
Eonwe Valar: It was playable
Menelvagor Valar: dial-up is still extremely expensive here, so there is hardly anyone who ever uses that.
Menelvagor Valar: it's either cable or ADSL in the Netherlands.
Eonwe Valar: So how do you connect to the internet? Can't imagine anything more primitive that dial-up is still available?
Eonwe Valar: I see...
Eonwe Valar: I'm curious how fast your cable/ADSL is compared to what we use in the US then, becaus ehere Cable/DSL is the more expensive and the better option.
Menelvagor Valar: game was just massively slow.
Menelvagor Valar: whether that's my comp's fault or the game's fault, I leave in the center.
Eonwe Valar: Well, you want a minimum of 1 gig of RAM and a 128 MB graphics card, but I would certainly suggest 2 and 256.
VardaValar1 has left the room. [Varda suggests 2 GB RAM, 7900 GEForce or better graphics card.]
Eonwe Valar: Varda's having some problems with AIM.
VardaValar1 has entered the room.
Eonwe Valar: Apparently AIM can't keep up with her WPM :}
VardaValar1 has left the room.
Eonwe Valar: WPM = Words Per Minute for those who don't know :}
Menelvagor Valar: my comp's prob then.
Menelvagor Valar: 756 and 128 I think.
Menelvagor Valar: which is plenty for WoW.
Menelvagor Valar: most of the time anyways :-)
Eonwe Valar: Aye, WoW is definitely easier on computers :}
Eonwe Valar: Ok, let's go to WoW now.
Menelvagor Valar: praise Blizz for keeping system reqs low.
Eonwe Valar: Aye :}
Eonwe Valar: WoW Lothar Report:
Eonwe Valar: This week Eowyn, Fangorn, and Eonwë worked on the final quests in the Talbuk and Clefthoof Mastery lines, as well as the quest to defeat the Elekk Queen.
VardaValar1 has entered the room.
Eonwe Valar: The first two we were able to take with three of us, despite our targets being even level elites with Eonwë's Paladin, Fangorn's Hunter being 64, and Eowyn's Warrior being 61.
Eonwe Valar: (My Paladin was 68 at the time)
Eonwe Valar: For the Elekk Queen, another two players were after her so we invited them to our group.
Menelvagor Valar: aren't you supposed to be able to solo those with your Pally, Eonwe? :-)
Eonwe Valar: Hehe, the elites now I can get down to 1/4-1/2 their HP before they finish me off :}
VardaValar1: Eowyn could not, and it was our day for getting together, aka Friday.
Menelvagor Valar: I know :-)
Menelvagor Valar: just inquiring :-)
Eonwe Valar: We then completed the Sunspring post quests, and afterwards went to kill the 30 beats Fangorn needed for the first step in each mastery quest.
Eonwe Valar: Eowyn made it to level 62, and we called it a night. Later on in the night, Eonwë's Paladin made it to 69.
Eonwe Valar: That concludes the WoW Lothar report.
VardaValar1: yay!
VardaValar1: yay 69 ;-)
Eonwe Valar: :} Not long before I hit 70 :}
Eonwe Valar: Varda, do you have an Uldaman report? :}
Eonwe Valar: Assuming AIM lets you share it? :}
VardaValar1: I showed up in Uldaman on the Blood Elf, nearly cleared Ghostlands quests, chatted with guild-friend Kragen who is 70
VardaValar1: for our Wednesday night
VardaValar1: This was like Karma, as I had not showed up for Elwing last Wednesday. : )
VardaValar1: We hope to do better and have a bunch of us next Wednesday.
VardaValar1: That's it. : )
VardaValar1: (Gavel passed to Eonwe since AIM is being odd.)
Eonwe Valar: Thanks :}
Eonwe Valar: It doesn't seem Arien is here to give a report on our Argent Dawn group.
VardaValar1: Menelvagor said he needed to get ready for bed.
Eonwe Valar: Sleep well then Menel :}
Menelvagor Valar: haven't been on Argent Dawn this week anyways.
Eonwe Valar: Any final gaming news before we go to Tolkien?
ArPharazonV: revered with Scryers!
VardaValar1: Congrats : )
Oessala: Still offering that 30 days of eve free. :-)
ArPharazonV: also delivered all the arcane tomes I had saved up when I got revered, 24 of em
ArPharazonV: and spent the day after collecting some signets and tomes too
ArPharazonV: ended up getting over 14000 rep in the span of one day :-)
VardaValar1: That's a really good offer, Oessala/Pallando/Orodreth : )
ArPharazonV: just 10500 rep to go to exalted
Oessala: You're the one who invites all of them in here, Varda. :p
VardaValar1: *just* What a word that is. : )
ArPharazonV: hehe
ArPharazonV: at this rate, I'll get there in half a week
GwaihirValar has entered the room.
VardaValar1: The eagle has landed! What country are you in today? : )
GwaihirValar: Good morning, folks(well... morning from my perspective anyways ;-))
Eonwe Valar: Good morning Gwaihir :}
Eonwe Valar: Happy Easter :}
GwaihirValar: I'm still in Canada, just... have to sleep abnormal hours due to working nights :-)
VardaValar1: Good morrow : ) and Happy Easter!
GwaihirValar: Happy Easter to you as well
Oessala has left the room.
Pallando Valar: Okay, am I on the right account now? Testing..
Pallando Valar: Yay.
VardaValar1: Bilbo is a night worker too
VardaValar1: Yes. : )

Eonwe Valar: Ok, let's get to Tolkien :}
VardaValar1: Huzzah!
VardaValar1: Pharazon was asking about the role of ships, fleets in Middle-earth.
VardaValar1: Didn't seem to be sea battles, mainly transport of armies.
Eonwe Valar: Manwë mentioned during the week on the Forum that he would like to explore fate and destiny. he is not here, however. Perhaps he would not want to miss the discussion? :}
VardaValar1: He's not on right now. Might be at Easter doings.
VardaValar1: What other uses of ships and fleets can you folks think of? And can you remember them used in battle?
Eonwe Valar: The corsairs of Umbar come to mind.
VardaValar1: Aw come on. Any of you can jump on that one. : )
ArPharazonV: some were used for exploration, like many of the Numenorean activities in the first millenia, and the journeys of Earendil
Eonwe Valar: The Numenoreans had sailed even into the far east.
Pallando Valar: Cirdan had ships, though I don't recall there ever being a battle with them.
VardaValar1: The Teleri Elves made swanships. I wonder where they went?
Eonwe Valar: *Raises hand* Ooh! I know! I know! :}
VardaValar1: The elves of Tol Eressea visited Numenor before it was unwelcoming.
VardaValar1: Go Eonwe!
Eonwe Valar: The ships were burned at Losgar by Fëanor :}
VardaValar1: So they made one short trip? : )
Pallando Valar: The swanships got used to ferry some ungrateful noldor to Bereland and then were burned.
Pallando Valar: Never made again, if I recall.
VardaValar1: Suppose any of the ships were not taken?
Eonwe Valar: The swanships were to the Teleri what the Silmarilli were to the Noldor.
VardaValar1: Right
VardaValar1: Where do you suppose they went with the swanships before they were burned?
ArPharazonV: well, the army from Valinor in the war of wrath would have had need of boats to get to Beleriand
Pallando Valar: Cirdan used ships to send Elves to Valinor when they got tried of middle-earth.
ArPharazonV: suppose they took any remaining swanships?
ArPharazonV: or were given, in any case :-)
VardaValar1: We know they took their ships to Middle-earth to transport the armies of Eonwe, refusing to fight and help those who had harmed them.
VardaValar1: Right, the grey ships of the Havens.
Eonwe Valar: With as long as those Vanyar sat at Manwë's feet, they still haven't learned to fly across the water like a Maia. How sad :}
Eonwe Valar: Or Vala even :}
VardaValar1: Flight kept being more and more restricted. Only Manwe, Varda, and Eonwe and apparently a number of their Maiar eventually.
ArPharazonV: and the birds, of course.. eagles
VardaValar1: At first, they all flew in.
VardaValar1: Birds being of Manwe, that makes sense. : )
GwaihirValar: I apologize for the brief near-afkness, I was watching an incredibly entertaining youtube video...
ArPharazonV: the sun, the moon, Earendil's ship
ArPharazonV: ooh, always fun.. link?
VardaValar1: Is it something you can share, Gwaihir?
ArPharazonV: it not, just share it in IM :-)
GwaihirValar: Of course... its a video fo a hunter in wow soloing azuregos ;-)
ArPharazonV: *if
ArPharazonV: oh, that one!
VardaValar1: That's why we got to talk about him for a bit. ; )
VardaValar1: url please, for the transcript and us to afk with. : )
ArPharazonV: for a shorter link :-)
ArPharazonV: ok, ships as used for transport, what have we got...
ArPharazonV: Teleri built them to get to Valinor, pulled by swans if I recall?
ArPharazonV: the Swanships were stolen by the Noldor to get to Middle-Earth, where they were burned
ArPharazonV: Cirdan at the southern end of Beleriand built some ships, some of which were used to try and find Valinor, never returned
ArPharazonV: Eonwe's army used ships to get to Beleriand to fight Morgoth
ArPharazonV: at the end many of the Elves returned to Valinor, and the Edain were brought to Numenor...
ArPharazonV: all in ships, I would assume
ArPharazonV: what do we know about that?
VardaValar1: Ok on the swanships:
GwaihirValar: There had to be some trade occuring by ship, with so many of the nations that owed allegiance to Gondor having cities that bordered the sea and the large rivers in that area...
VardaValar1: the Teleri made them on the lonely isle to get to Valinor, but were pulled by swans?
VardaValar1: Then they made swanships that sailed properly while in Valinor.
VardaValar1: One assumes they visited back and forth to Tol Eressea.
ArPharazonV: were the first ships, pulled by swans, already looking like swans, or did they only start making those in Valinor to remember the swans that pulled them?
ArPharazonV: don't readily recall
VardaValar1: One assumes some of the ships visiting Numenor were swanships.
VardaValar1: After the big burn, they still had ships to carry the armies of the Valar.
VardaValar1: Checking
VardaValar1: found it
VardaValar1: Sil, "of Eldamar" not a lot of help.
VardaValar1: The Teleri were stuck on Tol Eressea, wanted to continue to Aman.
VardaValar1: Ulmo submitted to the will of the other Valar and sent Osse to teach them shipbuilding
VardaValar1: They built white ships, Osse's gift of strong swans drew them to Valinor.
VardaValar1: "white ships"
Eonwe Valar: Pardon, but I must be on my way. Easter dinner will be served soon, and afterwards to a movie will I go.
VardaValar1: "They sailed in their swift ships on the waters of the Bay of Elvenhome..
VardaValar1: Sounds fun!
ArPharazonV: Namarie, Eonwe
ArPharazonV: what movie?
VardaValar1: Namarie, Eonwe!
Eonwe Valar: Take care all, good night, sleep well, have fun, and Happy Easter :}
Eonwe Valar: TMNT. Curious how they did as compared with the old ones :}
VardaValar1: It then says they had ships made like swans
VardaValar1: but not if any were from the original or the original design.
VardaValar1: Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles :-)
Eonwe Valar: Take care all. Hope you found an Easter Basket bourgeoning with goodies this morning :}
Eonwe Valar: Aye, Varda :}
VardaValar1: hehe
VardaValar1: I'm going to go make Easter dinner. Got it half-started.
VardaValar1: May your ships meet with good weather!
Eonwe Valar: *bow*
VardaValar1: Phar, I'll need your help on the transcript.
Eonwe Valar: *vanish*
Eonwe Valar has left the room.
VardaValar1: *fades*
VardaValar1 has left the room.
ArPharazonV: well
ArPharazonV: *looks around*
ArPharazonV: still anyone here to discuss things further with? ;-)
ArPharazonV: guess not.. I'll be saving and sending
ArPharazonV: saved