Valar Guild

November 21, 2004 Meeting

AIM: Valar Guild Meetingplace
5pm EST
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Transcript team for Nov 21: Ar-Pharazon, Menelvagor, Varda 
Before-meeting
Meeting Begins
Membership:
    Fladrif
    Turgon-V passed his Maia test with Elatan, Eonwe, and Varda to become Menelvagor-Valar!
Attending (17):
    Aerandir/mordacil, Arathorn-Valar, Ar-Pharazon-V, Arwen-V, Celebrimbor-V, Elatan-Valar, Eonwe-Valar, Finarfin-V, Gil-galad/Xseanzee disco, Gilraen-V, Grimbold-V/HearNoEvil80, Gwaihir-Valar, FarmerMaggot-V/Musics4Me2, Orodreth-V, Thror-V/Chugin Chub, Turgon-V/Menelvagor-Valar, Varda-Valar (presiding)
Web:
    Names
    Games
Gaming:
    D2X
    WoW coming out, plans
    Half-Life 2
    Dungeon Siege
    TFT
    Nintendo DS
Tolkien:
    Elatan's topic: The young White Tree's appearance just when Aragorn needed it.
    Tangents (Never quite turned into an after-meeting except for a spot of ring words.):
        How details add interest and characterization.
        Why would Frodo be worried that Aragorn could be an agent of the Enemy? 
        Numenorean weddings

Before-meeting
You have just entered room "Valar Guild Meetingplace."
Musics4Me2 has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Aiya
Musics4Me2: aiya
ArPharazonV: Manenna?
Musics4Me2: eh?
ArPharazonV: How are you?
Musics4Me2: decent
ArPharazonV: riiight....
ArPharazonV: ok.... so what've you been up to this week?
Musics4Me2: messing things up :-P
ArPharazonV: heh... have you ever taken up the task of pasting an entire webcomic in word? :-)
Musics4Me2: nope
Musics4Me2: I don't even have word installed :-P
ArPharazonV: heh
ArPharazonV: would you happen to have the lotr-soundtrack on your pc?
Musics4Me2: I have the first one
ArPharazonV: the fellowship? good...
ArPharazonV: now I have a question
Musics4Me2: sure......
ArPharazonV: I'm listening to it now, and I've discovered a certain piece of music, from about 1:28 to 1:38 in the flight to the ford
ArPharazonV: it sounds very familiar, but I can't really place it in another song...
ArPharazonV: do you recognize it from somewhere out of lotr?
ArPharazonV: you still there?
VardaValar1 has entered the room.

You have just entered room "Valar Guild Meetingplace."
VardaValar1: Aiya
VardaValar1: Just three of us?
ArPharazonV: Aiya
ArPharazonV: so far, yes
ArPharazonV: I've been here for 45 minutes now... nobody else entered
ArPharazonV: besides you 2
Eonwe Valar has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Aiya
GilraenV has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Aiya
GilraenV: Aiya
Celebrimbor V has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Aiya
VardaValar1: Aiya
GwaihirValar has entered the room.
Celebrimbor V: aiya
ArPharazonV
: Aiya
Eonwe Valar: Heya
Eonwe Valar: Sent invitations to just about everyone
VardaValar1: I'm doing that too : )
ArPharazonV: I'm not... I think I learned my lesson ;-)
GwaihirValar: hehe
VardaValar1: I have a folder for just Valar
Eonwe Valar: Just section off your Valar Guild accounts :}
Eonwe Valar: I set mine up after that week.
ArPharazonV: I have a folder for just Valar... but I have a habit of putting anybody in there who is accepted in this meeting-chatroom...
VardaValar1: Time to tidy it
ArPharazonV: and now I have so many, I don't know if they are real members, one-time guests, or alternative accounts for either real members or guests...
VardaValar1: Can put them in a visitors folder
VardaValar1: Look in the Quick AIM page
VardaValar1: That tells you the names and alternates
Eonwe Valar: QuickAim may help you sort them Phar
ArPharazonV: yes, I know... I'll sweep out the entire folder one of these days, using Quick AIM
VardaValar1: You could start now during slow spots : )
ArPharazonV: I could do that, yes... but if I don't do it all in one go, I'll surely get confused
ArPharazonV: so I have to start all over again :-(
Eonwe Valar: afk for a sec
VardaValar1: Try making a brand new folder and putting in Quick AIM info
VardaValar1: Keep it alphabetical while entering, and that should help
ArPharazonV: can I do that? can I put people in my list without selecting them in AIM itself?
VardaValar1: You should be able to
ArPharazonV: oh well... I'll try, I suppose
VardaValar1: On the Buddy list, go to My AIM,
VardaValar1: Setup Buddy List
ArPharazonV: yes, I just found it... should work
VardaValar1: You can also click and drag
VardaValar1: Someone else may have the same problem, so now they have directions too : )
TurgonjustTurgon has entered the room.
TurgonjustTurgon: Aiya
VardaValar1: Aiya
Eonwe Valar: back
Eonwe Valar: heya Turgon
TurgonjustTurgon: been watching Trump's heir :-)
ArPharazonV: Aiya
VardaValar1: Let's start
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Meeting Begins:
VardaValar1: Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo
VardaValar1: Membership News:
VardaValar1: On our Members Page, we have 127 listed
VardaValar1: 8 are currently present and may pat themselves on the back : )
ArPharazonV: *pat*
VardaValar1: Fangorn and Eowyn say hi over the shoulder
ArPharazonV: hi
VardaValar1: Fangorn and I came home last night after being gone a week
VardaValar1: so I have little helpful news
VardaValar1: Do any of you have Member news?
HearNoEvil80 has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Fladrif wants you to know he's still alive
ArPharazonV: Aiya
VardaValar1: We could also use help in the recruiting department
HearNoEvil80: Aiya
VardaValar1: Aiya!
VardaValar1: Thanks, Phar
top
 

VardaValar1: Web News:
VardaValar1: The Names page has been updated and now needs to have links to the new location
TurgonjustTurgon: I may have found a prospect through DaoC
VardaValar1: Irmo says he no longer has time for it and so I'm now doing the Names page
VardaValar1: My email has new prospects fairly often that never show
VardaValar1: Did your friend read LotR?
TurgonjustTurgon: aye
TurgonjustTurgon: I asked whether she read or seen LotR, and she was quite adament about reading it
TurgonjustTurgon: and that was before I even talked about the Guild
VardaValar1: Good luck, Turgon : )
TurgonjustTurgon: thanks
VardaValar1: I trust everyone here has sent his gaming info to Eonwe?
TurgonjustTurgon: unfortunately, she is not online at the moment, so I can't bring her in for some introduction :-)
VardaValar1: And everyone here is surely working on something to fill in the holes in the Encyc? : )
VardaValar1: Any other Web News?
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VardaValar1: Gaming News:
VardaValar1: Those in D2X Ladder need to send in their info or we will think only Arathorn is playing : )
VardaValar1: Eonwe, you had WoW news?
VardaValar1: He mentioned going AFK
VardaValar1: Phar, did you have news?
ArPharazonV: hm? what?
ArPharazonV: how do you mean?
VardaValar1: Guess not : )
ArPharazonV: was I sending of signals or something? :-X
ArPharazonV: *off
Eonwe Valar: The second best kind of WoW news :}
VardaValar1: Any other news, comments, suggestions for what you would like from your guild?
ArPharazonV: hmm... not really, except for 'Keep it up!'
Eonwe Valar: WoW is coming out in 2 days :}
HearNoEvil80: Woo Hoo!
VardaValar1: How many here are going to try to be in it?
ElatanValar has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Aiya
VardaValar1: Aiya!
TurgonjustTurgon: Aiya :-)
HearNoEvil80: *raises both hands waving a huge banner saying "ME ME ME ME"*
ElatanValar: Greetings fair people
Eonwe Valar: I think we have 3 who will have the retail on or around Tuesday
VardaValar1: hehe
VardaValar1: Aiya
HearNoEvil80: Maglor I believe will also be in it
ArathornValar has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Aiya
VardaValar1: Aiya
ArathornValar: whoa.. time flies.. forgot about the meeting :-P
HearNoEvil80: and Arathorn will probalby have it in a month or so depending on finances
Eonwe Valar: Aye, was counting him, so guess we have 4 :}
HearNoEvil80: which speak of the devil
VardaValar1: WoW talk
HearNoEvil80: Aiya Arathorn
ArathornValar: Aiya.. Grey Cup is on.. even though my team lost last weak (and I do mean "WEAK" :-P)
ArPharazonV: I might pre-order WoW starting the 26th, but not sure about that....
Xseanzee disco has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Aiya
Xseanzee disco: heyyyyy
ArPharazonV: Aiya
HearNoEvil80: had a ? about wow and how the guild will be set up
VardaValar1: Eonwe is project head for WoW
VardaValar1: and we have a lot of discussion on it in the Forum
HearNoEvil80: ok didn't know if I should ask here or in pm thanks
VardaValar1: What question?
HearNoEvil80: well was going to check forum but I'll go ahead and ask
HearNoEvil80: Will there be a guild created for both the horde and alliance side?
Eonwe Valar: No, not at first at least
ArPharazonV: just Alliance at first, I think?
Eonwe Valar: we will be focusing on the Alliance in order to build a strong group there
HearNoEvil80: Alliance first ok good...
HearNoEvil80: I was planning on a Dwarf Hunter
ArathornValar: should we be in the same area?
ArPharazonV: lol, so was I... but not as one of my mains :-)
HearNoEvil80: hehe...its that or human rogue
ArathornValar: We should probably have different types so they offset each other well
HearNoEvil80: too many decisions
HearNoEvil80: Agreed
ArPharazonV: I'm either focusing on the Elven Rogue or the Gnomish Warrior for my US main...
ArPharazonV: probably both, as much as possible
HearNoEvil80: how will we know which server and zone etc to join on? will you post as soon as you know Eonwe?
ArathornValar: I'll be an Alien Janitor.. no wait.. wrong game <flips thru online manual...>
Eonwe Valar: as soon as I know, aye :}
VardaValar1: We will post it, you bet!
HearNoEvil80: in news or forum?
VardaValar1: Both
Eonwe Valar: both :}
HearNoEvil80: okies good
ElatanValar: One of the few things I found out during my short time in Beta was I want a Gnome sage, loved that little fella :-)
VardaValar1: Eonwe and I cooperate : )
HearNoEvil80: hehe...
ArathornValar: I'd like an Elven Druid or Gnomish Rogue
ArPharazonV: sage?
HearNoEvil80: mage I think is what he meant
ArPharazonV: ah... ok
HearNoEvil80: yea don't wanna mess w/ the lil ppl...they can kick some booty
ElatanValar: yea, same thing more or less in game terms
ArPharazonV: did not see that at first, although I guess it makes sense...
GwaihirValar: I'm prolly gonna be Elven Hunter/Priest
HearNoEvil80: Loved my gnome rogue
GwaihirValar: Seluhir, my Elven Hunter, was amazing at 26 :-)
HearNoEvil80: Ack! can't wait
ArathornValar: Yeah e too.. gnome rogue was fun
ArPharazonV: My gnome warrior... heh... he will be a master-cook
ArPharazonV: and in battle, he'll be like a little ball of armour
ArathornValar: ack.. I HAVE too :-P
HearNoEvil80: Goodie, some scrumptious food to fill my belly on
VardaValar1: You can post in the Forum under WoW to tell what you are playing, and we can update the WoW member page
HearNoEvil80: np
VardaValar1: We need to do our best to get together
VardaValar1: I can also post on the Activity page
ArPharazonV: could be fun for gatherings in the Guildhouse... I'll do the catering :-D
VardaValar1: Activity page is intended to show your account names for all games that I know of
ArathornValar has left the room.
VardaValar1: but the specialty pages are more helpful for gaming
ArathornValar has entered the room.
ArathornValar: *sigh* crashed
ArathornValar: someone else better save the trans <g> not my day
GwaihirValar: the problem being I may not get to play for a few days...
GwaihirValar: my main comp just died on me...
VardaValar1: We will try to crazy quilt the transcript
VardaValar1: I still have to finish doing that for last week. Was gone all this week, no comp
HearNoEvil80: and I probably won't be on til after the holidays....family coming to visit and I'm hosting
VardaValar1: I'm saving every few minutes
VardaValar1: I'm hosting too, bunch coming here
HearNoEvil80: which btw Happy Holidays to all in case I don't have a chance to wish it to you all later
VardaValar1: so you may see Laytonrim bouncing around gaming : )
ArPharazonV: Happy Holidays!
ArPharazonV: btw, does anybody know when the extended edition of Rotk comes out?
Arwen V1 has entered the room.
VardaValar1: Aiya
Xseanzee disco: dec sumthing
HearNoEvil80: Dec 14th so I heard
VardaValar1: Dec about 14
Arwen V1: Aiya
VardaValar1: It's on the News if you want to look for it : )
ElatanValar: 10 here in DK
VardaValar1: Now moving to Denmark...
ElatanValar: 10th
Eonwe Valar: How did you manage to get it earlier Elatan?
Eonwe Valar: or rather, your country? :}
ElatanValar: I did not :-) but a friend is buying it and I will go and see it at his house
VardaValar1: Now that's a friend
ElatanValar: dont ask, I do not know but I know it is the 10th here
ElatanValar: it will be a long 11Th, we are going to see all three in a row
ArPharazonV: hmm... it seems it's the 10th here as well... search engines are a great help sometimes ;-)
ElatanValar: last year it was only two
VardaValar1: Popcorn sales will be higher this year
ArPharazonV: if my dad decides to buy the dvd-player before that time, we can watch all 3 on the tv :-)
ElatanValar: and beers
ArPharazonV: 10th... 10th... what day of the week is that...
ElatanValar: friday
ArPharazonV: good, good... I've got fridays off :-)
ArPharazonV: I'll just get up early, pick one up in the city, head home, and place myself in front of the pc...
VardaValar1: A giant Valar Guild dvd party : )
ElatanValar: heh yea, we know where people will be :-)
VardaValar1: Please pm me Tolkien topics
Chugin Chub has entered the room.
ArathornValar: Were web et all news done already?
VardaValar1: Aiya Thror
Chugin Chub: hello
VardaValar1
: Yes. But did you have some? This is a good time
VardaValar1: Just about to end business section
VardaValar1: Arathorn, did you have news?
ArathornValar: Well, Half-Life 2 is finally out
VardaValar1: Yay!
ArathornValar: COurse I can't afford IT either :-\
Chugin Chub: whats every one playing these days?
ArathornValar
: They had it on a big screen at future shop here ..heh
VardaValar1: D2X Ladder for me
VardaValar1: Yet, Arathorn : )
ArathornValar: the Collector's editions are $114 after tax.. ech. Guess I'll be getting the reg editions at 60 for both (HL and WoW)
ArPharazonV: these days? I'm playing Dungeon Siege for the 4th time... my Nature Mage's going through Glitterdelve now :-)
VardaValar1: Is that single player Phar?
ArPharazonV: and TFT at night, before I go to bed
ArathornValar: ..eventually..
ArPharazonV: well, single player, at the moment
ArPharazonV: but I'm ready for multiplayer any time, I have a few chars ready
ArathornValar: I've been playing my D2X hardcore chars... Working on my Assassin now... othrs are all 30 and up .. and NO deaths! :-D
VardaValar1: Impressive : )
ArathornValar: came VERY close a few times tho :-P
Arwen V1: These days, I've been playing college student.. its fun! There's exam hurdles, and research paper highjumps, and study till you cant see anymore shootemups =P
ArathornValar: HAHAHA! <Arwen>
VardaValar1: hehe
Arwen V1: actually its not that fun D=
ArPharazonV: bleh... college... I suppose I'll have to spend some time on that too
Eonwe Valar: could everyone turn off the highlight please :}
Arwen V1: lol
Arwen V1: off the what?
VardaValar1: We do need to have smart people for the guild, so it's good to hear you're doing the high jumps
VardaValar1: Your yellow background, Arwen
Arwen V1: ouchies, brb then
Arwen V1 has left the room.
Eonwe Valar: Thror's text has a black bar under it, and yours have a yellow bar
ArPharazonV: and somehow they influence Arathorn's texts as well, if he speaks directly after them
Arwen V1 has entered the room.
Arwen V1: how's this?
ArPharazonV: better
ArathornValar: it's whoever talks after then Eonwe.. unfort
VardaValar1: That cleared the yellow background off. Thanks, Arwen!
Chugin Chub: ok
Arwen V1
: sweet.
VardaValar1: It's as if those things are contagious for the next person, heh
ArathornValar: <AH-CHOO!> .. great.. :-P
Chugin Chub: nintendo ds came out to day :-)
Eonwe Valar: Thanks THror and Arwen
Chugin Chub: today*
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VardaValar1
: Tolkien:
VardaValar1: Elatan had an interesting observation on the White Tree
VardaValar1: Go ahead, Elatan!
VardaValar1: A little copy/paste problem, hang on
VardaValar1: These are Elatan's words:
ElatanValar: Ahh thx Varda
VardaValar1: While I wrote something about it I came to wonder if the White tree, the last, the one Aragorn and Gandalf found - maybe all of them - were
VardaValar1: bound by some divine interception to the Line of the kings
VardaValar1: ElatanValar: it was said it was not older than 7 years but the White Tree in the court of the fountain had been dead since 3 age 2850
VardaValar1: ElatanValar: so it seems the tree "just" happened to begin to grow as a new king was rising
VardaValar1: ElatanValar: how could that be ? chance or what ?
ElatanValar: or very close to 2850 a couple years
VardaValar1: ElatanValar: why did it not begin to grow right after the other died out ? why did none of the stewards look for it ?
VardaValar1: Done.
ElatanValar: ill continue
ArPharazonV: or there could have been a white tree in between... which died a few years before the War of the Ring
ElatanValar: was this because white Trees would only grow and blossom and set new fruits while a king was sitting ?
ElatanValar: there was not
ArPharazonV: in that case why was the other tree already there for 7 years?
STEvilaim has left the room.
ElatanValar: why did it not begin to grow when the fruit was placed out there upon mount mendolluin ?
ElatanValar: why was it waiting to a new king was close to come forth ?
Eonwe Valar: It's a seed that takes a long time to germinate
ArPharazonV: whatever happened 7 years before the War of the Ring, that made the tree grow?
ArPharazonV: was the tree so divine that it could see into the future?
VardaValar1: Or perhaps a divine intervention started the tree to growing?
ElatanValar: Gandalf says it could - could- be lying for very long time, not that it had to
ArPharazonV: so, you suppose... Eru himself made the thing grow?
VardaValar1: Many lesser seeds can wait a long time to germinate, so it could as well
GwaihirValar: did Yavanna or Ulmo ever truly permanently leave Middle Earth?
VardaValar1: Eru is more likely to have the Valar handle smaller things like that
GwaihirValar: I couldn't see those two especially doing that...
ArPharazonV: well, yes... but did the other Valar see the RotK coming?
VardaValar1: Gwaihir, no. Ulmo was especially fond of keeping his presence available in the waters
ArPharazonV: *cross out other
Eonwe Valar: The other Valar were putting it into place I'd say *cough* Gandalf *cough* :}
Eonwe Valar: er, scratch out other
VardaValar1: Gandalf was the Valar agent on hand
VardaValar1: We also know there were Maiar in Middle-earth who didn't announce themselves who could have done a few things
VardaValar1: e.g. Melian earlier shows a precedent
ArPharazonV: so Gandalf knew the RotK was near at hand, in a few years, and passed that through to the Valar?
ArPharazonV: and Yavanna or another made the tree grow?
ArPharazonV: and 7 years later Aragorn came to Minas Tirith? sounds plausible
Eonwe Valar: The Valar don't need Gandalf to tell them,.. Manwë has many other agents.
ArPharazonV: the Eagles, for example...
VardaValar1: Gandalf did what the Valar asked of him, not so much the other way around : )
GwaihirValar: so it could've been done either by water(through Ulmo) or by Yavanna herself, or by one of their Maiar
GwaihirValar: perhaps that was actually Radagast's doing
GwaihirValar: he was one of Yavanna's maiar beforehand, was he not
VardaValar1: Quite possible
ArPharazonV: but I'd say Gandalf was probably the one 'agent' most involved with the events that led to Aragorn's return
ElatanValar: I think it is interesting it waited just until the right time. was it the Powers or is it something in the Tree ? Yavanna is a good idear I think. She made the first of them :-)
Eonwe Valar: In my complete Guide to Middle-Earth, it gives a translation of Aragorn's name as "Royal Tree"
VardaValar1: Ara is high or royal
VardaValar1: gorn is tree
VardaValar1: sounds good
ArPharazonV: Gandalf would probably the best suited for messaging the Valar 'things are coming at an end, and either the King shall return or ME shall fall'
ArPharazonV: for, as I said, he was the most involved with the events
ArPharazonV: I'm not saying he gave the Valar orders
GilraenV: I have to go. namarie all
GilraenV has left the room.
ArPharazonV: I'm just saying his message may have led to the Valar's decision to have the tree grow
VardaValar1: They didn't require Gandalf for news
ArPharazonV: of course not
VardaValar1: That's all I meant
GwaihirValar: they're not perfect though... he may be noticing things that they could have missed and then letting them know
ArPharazonV: but seeing his position in all the story, he would have been the best messenger concerning the matters
ArPharazonV: no agent of the Valar was closer to the Heir to the Throne than Gandalf
VardaValar1: Pardon us for inattention. Eonwe, Elatan and I are working with Turgon for now. Please feel free to continue chat and we will scroll
Eonwe Valar: Aye, but how would Gandalf get messages back?
GwaihirValar: *points to self*
ArPharazonV: was Gandalf, being of the Ainur and all, in some spiritual contact with the Valar?
ArPharazonV: the same link that they used to bring him back after he died?
VardaValar1: "See staff"
ArPharazonV: uhm... what?
VardaValar1: Also, the fea itself is a link
ArPharazonV: well, in that case, he would not need an eagle to send to or receive messages from the Valar
Eonwe Valar: TOlkien implies in his letters it was not the Valar who sent Gandalf back
ArPharazonV: I haven't read the letters...
Orodreth V has entered the room.
Orodreth V: I was here the whole time, and I did /not/ forget about the meeting becasue I was playing Freespace 2. >.>
Orodreth V: Er.
VardaValar1: Rigght. ;-)
Orodreth V: Oh. Ok. Thought I got dced or something.
Orodreth V: Don't you believe me? :-(
Xseanzee disco has left the room.
VardaValar1: np
VardaValar1: We were talking about the White Tree
VardaValar1: Why did it show up so conveniently for Aragorn?
Orodreth V: I vote the Valar put it there.
VardaValar1: How?
ArPharazonV: and... why seven years early?
Orodreth V: A Maia of Yavanna I'd guess.
Eonwe Valar: If it was put there by the Valar, why would Aragorn need to make sure to put a new fruit there once the tree came to fruit? And, could that fruit be eaten? :}
ArPharazonV: white fruit... yummy...
Orodreth V: They can't be there all the time..
GwaihirValar: he didn't KNOW it was the valar...
GwaihirValar: he assumed 'well, I got lucky... doubt my successors will have the same luck... I'd better plant one'
Orodreth V: Aragorn had and used far too much luck to have any passed on, at least as I see it.
VardaValar1: hehe
VardaValar1: Aragorn was intended to be an instrument to help bring in the 4th age, so he may have had a tad of help
GwaihirValar: OR maybe he knew it was the Valar and he thought 'they've done this this time... becuase it was needed... if we don't take care of ourselves, they may not see us as being worthy of the same help in the future'
ArPharazonV: an instrument? really? I thought he did that all on his own... :-P
VardaValar1: Frodo and a few other guys were handy too : )
ArPharazonV: that makes sense...
Eonwe Valar: Who needs Hobbits? :}
Musics4Me2: hey! everyone needs Hobbits!
ArPharazonV: Hobbits are nice for sending on a suicide-mission to a volcano...
Orodreth V: Millions of screaming fangirls?
ArPharazonV: while the human gets to fight the glorious battles and to take over the throne
VardaValar1: Maybe Arwen and Eowyn have millions of screaming fanboys too : ) Maybe Rosie has some?
Eonwe Valar: Rosie has Sam if no one else :} Don't think Sam would want it any other way :}
GwaihirValar: Hobbits are only good for dealing with problems in the population of mushrooms ;-)
ArPharazonV: Arwen wasn't ugly... but me thinks they could probably have found a more beautiful one
Eonwe Valar: hehe Gwaihir :}
Musics4Me2: /me runs after Gwai with pitchfork...... why do YOU get to fly........
GwaihirValar: because I am a bird :-)
Musics4Me2: oh shhh :-P
ArPharazonV: btw, in my rereading of the past few weeks, I noticed a few days ago
Orodreth V: Don't go brining technicalities like that into this, Gwaihir.
ArPharazonV: that Bombadil at one point starts to sing in a strange, perhaps ancient language
Musics4Me2: Really? I thought it was just babbling :-P
ArPharazonV: one that is mostly based on words of delight and happiness or something like that...
GwaihirValar: you mean there's a METHOD to his madness?
VardaValar1: Indeed there was
ArPharazonV: btw, Varda, I'm now in the 'knife in the dark' chapter, and I passed the piece of text we discussed past week :-)
VardaValar1: o cool!
VardaValar1: Any comments?
ArPharazonV: well, it was pretty good stuff, the Riders stalking around the house
ArPharazonV: and Fatty fleeing out of the backdoor
ArPharazonV: and Frodo hearing the horn of Buckland all the way in Bree ;-)
VardaValar1: Fatty showed once again that hobbits have mettle : )
GwaihirValar: or maybe the layers of blubber impeded the fear from getting to his mind as quickly ;-)
Musics4Me2: heh
ArPharazonV: I'm sorry about the guards, though... it is stated that the Riders rode over them or something at the North Gate... I just forgot the exact wording
ArPharazonV: brb...
ArathornValar has left the room.
ArPharazonV: ah, found it: 'they rode down the guards
ArathornValar has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: oh well, I'm still sorry for them...
ArathornValar: SIGH
VardaValar1: Aiyata
VardaValar1: Getting ridden down is no fun
ArPharazonV: anyway, back to Bombadillo... that ancient language, could it be the language of the Valar?
GwaihirValar: did the valar really need a language?
GwaihirValar: they were able to speak telepathically weren't they?
ArPharazonV: 'Tom sang most of the time, but it was chiefly nonsense, or else perhaps a strange language unknown to the hobbits, an ancient language whose words were mainly those of wonder and delight.'
VardaValar1: They did have a language, sounding as if it had the "glitter of swords"
ArPharazonV: it's so much fun, rereading lotr... Sam throwing an apple in Bill Ferny's face ;-)
GwaihirValar: lol ya
ArPharazonV: I'm discovering a lot of details which I hadn't noticed on my first way through, but which have been mentioned here a lot...
ArPharazonV: and that's always good :-)
VardaValar1: So many details. Makes the re-read fun, aye : )
Arwen V1: Namarie, folks, great acts of studying await me o.O
ArPharazonV: I've heard some people say lotr has too much detail... they don't need to know what Aragorn's boots look like :-D
ArPharazonV: Namarie, Arwen
Arwen V1 has left the room.
ArPharazonV: ...and what did I read yesterday or the day before? a description of Strider's boots!
VardaValar1: The boots help characterize him. Remember any details?
ArPharazonV: hmm... what was it...
ArPharazonV: high boots, supple leather, caked with mud
VardaValar1: So what does that tell us about this stranger?
ArPharazonV: and he had a travel-stained cloak of heavy dark-green cloth
ArPharazonV: me thinks he wanted to go unseen in nature...
ArPharazonV: he traveled a lot, and in muddy places
ArathornValar: He likes to walk :-D ... or HAS to a lot
ArPharazonV: midgewater marshes come to mind...
VardaValar1: High boots, supple leather tells a bit more too
ArPharazonV: 'more midges than water' ;-)
Eonwe Valar: He can afford quality boots :}
ArathornValar: He travels through marshes and bogs
VardaValar1: So he's not just a hobo
ArathornValar: Supple leather means what Eonwe said <heh>
ArathornValar: He's a man on means. Albeit not showing it of... undercover perhaps?
ArathornValar: *of means
ArPharazonV: supple leather brings to my mind 'easy to walk with' and 'not breaking down easily'
ArathornValar: True.. Comfort .. long distances.
ArPharazonV: so, as I said, 'he traveled a lot'
VardaValar1: So those details have a reason. These are things Frodo could figure out with a close look and some thought
ArPharazonV: also I finally discovered the origin of the apples shown in the movie ;-)
ArathornValar: So from this we can conclude... he sells hairnets from door to door.. no wait.. wrong book again *sigh* ... <flip flip>
VardaValar1: hehe Arathorn
ArathornValar: Yet Frodo didn't surmise that this might be a friend of Gandalf.
ArathornValar: Of course Gandalf gave no such suggestions either.. that a friend might be at the inn OR even meet them along the way
ArathornValar: So Frodo had no reason to think so
ArPharazonV: yes he did... but Butterbur neglected to send it :-(
ArPharazonV: or, in Orodreth V's words... he forgot :-D
ArathornValar: Yes afterwards... but not when he gave Frodo his initial instructions
Eonwe Valar: It was better that way, or Frodo might've been looking, even depending, on meeting a friend of Gandalf's, which would've been perilous.
ArathornValar: How so?
ArPharazonV: well, at least he would have left the Shire two months early... and the roads would have been a lot safer
VardaValar1: Deceit is a special art of the Enemy
ArathornValar: But how could the enemy possibly know that Frodo might be seeking someone in that case. Sauron didn't even know for sure who had the ring?
ArPharazonV: he probably didn't even know where the Shire was...
Eonwe Valar: Frodo, in depsaration, may have let something slip
VardaValar1: Bagginsss... Shirrre....
ArPharazonV: if I recall, the Nazgul searched the Anduin-bank in the weeks before coming to the Shire
Chugin Chub has left the room.
ArPharazonV: they thought the Shire was at the east of the mountains
Eonwe Valar: or, as in the case of Frodo's identity, the other hobbits may have let something slip
Eonwe Valar: a gesture, a word, and action,.. all it takes for the wary onlooker
VardaValar1: And a certain hobbit enjoying his "pint" and the company who let the name slip
ArPharazonV: not to mention singing about a cow, falling from the table, and disappearing into thin air...
VardaValar1: aye
ArathornValar: well, Baggins doesn't mean they would know who Frodo is.. esp under an alias. And no way they could know he might be meeting someone
VardaValar1: Nazgul chased him in that direction
VardaValar1: Probably had agents for various things all around
ArathornValar: hmm.. still don't see that meeting someone would make it more perilous.
VardaValar1: Gain his trust, slit his throat in his sleep
ArPharazonV: yeah, well, Aragorn could have done that too...
ArathornValar: Again... how could they know they were meeting someone. They could gain his trust and slit his throat knowing that or not <shrug>
VardaValar1: Not even Frodo knew he was meeting someone
ArPharazonV: 'If I had killed the real Strider, I could kill you. And I should have killed you already without so much talk. If I was after the ring, I could have it - NOW!'
ArathornValar: "Aragorn could have done that too" ArPharazonV <-- What he said :-D
VardaValar1: But Bombadil made certain to give a hidden Aragorn info
VardaValar1: hehe - aye
ArathornValar: Yes I know that Varda, but Eonwe suggested that if he HAD known it would make it more perilous. I don't think it would make a difference
ArathornValar: Of course I don't think even Gandalf knew at that point that he would need Arathorn's help, so probabkly a moot point <heh>
ArPharazonV: it's not like Frodo would have stood in the middle of Bree shouting "Hey! Strider! Where are you? I need you to help bring the One Ring to Rivendell!"
ArathornValar: Bombadil did? Gandalf passed the message through Tom?
Orodreth V has left the room.
ArathornValar: LOL! (Ar-Phar)
ArathornValar: <still laughing... :-D
Orodreth V has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Aiyata :-)
Orodreth V: Aiyata.
ArPharazonV: it means 'welcome back' :-)
VardaValar1: If Frodo had been looking for an unknown helper, he might have picked the wrong person, one put in his path by the Enemy when the agents saw him searching
Orodreth V: Sorry, was distracted. Meant thanks.
ArathornValar: I think that's reaching.. "saw him looking" .. perhaps if he started asking around.. then I could see that.
ArathornValar: *OR* if he did that yelling thing that Ar suggested <snortle>
ArPharazonV: yelling would be very effective... at least Strider would have jumped up to him and put his hand in front of his mouth ;-)
ArathornValar: Well, time to hunt down some supper... think there's a cooked ham somewhere upstairs that I can coax out with a fork and some truffles :-D
ArPharazonV: 'Ssshhh! You want to get us all killed!??!
Orodreth V: I think there were more evil men there then good at the inn.
ArathornValar: heh.. not that it mattered since the Nazgul found them anyway :-\
VardaValar1: How about ordinary types?
ArathornValar: Ordinary?
VardaValar1: Just there for a drink and normal inn-use
ArathornValar: er.. what about them..?
FINARFIN010 has entered the room.
FINARFIN010: aiya
VardaValar1: Aiya Finarfin : )
ArathornValar: Aiya
Orodreth V: I included those with the good.
VardaValar1: Orodreth said more evil than good Men at the Inn
ArPharazonV: "Yeah, Strider's over there, don't bother us... we're drinking"
VardaValar1: hehe - aye, those guys
ArathornValar: yeah, I'd agree with Orod... lump them into the good'uns :-)
ArathornValar: no news is good news .. heh... amything NOT trying to kill them I'd say is good :-D
ArPharazonV: I wouldn't kill them... directly
ArathornValar: Bbiab... I think I just spotted that boiled porcine meat scurry by! <dashes off>
ArPharazonV: being the evil king of Numenor that I am, I would take the ring and offer Frodo to Sauron in his temple for sacrificing...
FINARFIN010: how was the meeting?
VardaValar1
: Still sort of in Tolkien
VardaValar1: Also doing a Maia test on the side
ArPharazonV: how is he doing?
ArPharazonV: or is that priviliged information?
VardaValar1: Still working on it
FINARFIN010: ok
ArPharazonV
: ....so...
Orodreth V: *pin drop(
Orodreth V: Insanity tastes fluffy.
ArPharazonV: it's Turgon, in the test?
Orodreth V: I gotta go for awhile.
VardaValar1: See you later
VardaValar1: yes
Orodreth V: I'll be back eventualy to do my homework at the last minute.
ArPharazonV: :-)
Orodreth V has left the room.
mordacil has entered the room.
ArPharazonV: Aiya
mordacil: aiya
VardaValar1: Aiya
VardaValar1: Welcome to After-meeting
mordacil: its hard getting to meetings during the school year
VardaValar1: Even on Sunday?
Eonwe Valar: Pharazon, if you got ahold of the One Ring and didn't stab Sauron in the back, keeping it for yourself, I'd worry about your level of evil, man :}
mordacil: projects and work that cant be done on school days
GwaihirValar: afk for a short while
ArPharazonV: hey, I said I'd give FRODO to Sauron
ArPharazonV: not the ring
Eonwe Valar: Yeah, but you know Sauron's going to ask :}
FINARFIN010: what would he want with frodo if he did not have the ring?
Eonwe Valar
: He'll be like "heya buddy, wasn't this guy carrying something?" :}
ArPharazonV: "Ring? What Ring? I just found this guy wandering the streets... thought he would make a good sacrifice"
Eonwe Valar: What are you going to say,.. "Well, you said it was the least of trinkets, and I always wanted a trinket." :}
FINARFIN010: yeah he had a note pined to his jacket "return to sender"
mordacil
: sauron would probably sense if frodo had the ring on him
FINARFIN010: he may sence the effect of the ring on him
ArPharazonV
: "Man, Sauron, you need to get out more... I'm telling you, this midget had nothing on him!"
Eonwe Valar: "Oh Yeah, what's that on your hand?!"
ArPharazonV: "I don't care what you sense from him, he did not carry a ring! If he did, he would still have it now... and he doesn't, doesn't it?"
ArPharazonV: *does he?"
ArPharazonV: what, you think I'd carry it on my hand while speaking to Sauron?
Eonwe Valar: If you hope to survive the encounter and not spill the beans on everything under his powerful gaze,.. yes :}
mordacil: what would gollum have done if he had accidently swallowed the finger with the ring on it?
FINARFIN010: hmmmmm...... something about living forever........
ArPharazonV
: "On my hand? Oh, that's my wedding-ring.. nothing important... no, no, that's not a ring of power... no, I don't care if I'm invisible, it's not a ring of power!"
FINARFIN010: heheh the numenorians wore wedding rings?
ArPharazonV
: why wouldn't they?
FINARFIN010: they did not get married in a churches.
mordacil
: did it ever describe weddings?
Eonwe Valar: Elves gave eachother rings
Eonwe Valar: why would Numenoreans not do so?
FINARFIN010: realy ... what kind of rings.
FINARFIN010
: :-)
mordacil: they had religion but not with a centralized "church government" or building
Eonwe Valar: Rings of Marriage :}
Eonwe Valar: Even more powerful than Rings of Power :}
mordacil: they had crowns to symbolize royalty why not rings to symbolize marriagew?
FINARFIN010: i am not convinced of that wedding rings were used in middle earth.
Eonwe Valar
: OK, read History of MIddle Earth volume 12
FINARFIN010: ok
mordacil
: I dont think theres evidence to prove or disprove
Eonwe Valar: there's a passage concerning Elves and Elve Marriage
FINARFIN010: ok
Eonwe Valar
: it's specifically says it there
FINARFIN010: ok
FINARFIN010
: but i think rings may have been a bit extravegent for the common pesant.
Eonwe Valar
: I don't see why
ArPharazonV: the common peasant?
mordacil: numenorean pesant?
FINARFIN010: either
ArPharazonV
: we're talking about Pharazon here
ArPharazonV: Pharazon was not a peasant...
mordacil: I would think the poorest would be richer than anyone in middle earth
Eonwe Valar: All you need for a ring is a blacksmith and a chunk of metal
FINARFIN010: but still a marrage ring is a symble of a reglious event... they realy had no relegion
mordacil
: their economy was so good it was about the only one
FINARFIN010: opps. need to be afk.
ArPharazonV
: we worshipped Melkor, though...
mordacil: they worshipped eru and acknowleged valar
Eonwe Valar: They worshipped Eru, they had feast days to Eru,.. sounds like a religion to me
mordacil: the king was the religious leader
mordacil: or the closest thing to one
ArPharazonV: hmm... I suppose I married before I invaded Mordor
Eonwe Valar: you married to get on the throne :}
ArPharazonV: so I would have gotten the ring before Sauron told me to worship Melkor
ArPharazonV: so when I, at least partially, still fell under the religion of Eru
Eonwe Valar: hmm that would be an interesting thought,.. if Sauron gave Pharazon a Ring of Power
VardaValar1: 10 Riders? :-)
ArPharazonV: with 'the ring' I mean the wedding-ring, you know
FINARFIN010: back
Eonwe Valar
: ah, the wedding ring :}
VardaValar1: Welcome back
Eonwe Valar: wb :}
mordacil: i sauron, pronounce thee numenorean and wife
FINARFIN010: :-)
ArPharazonV: Aiyata
FINARFIN010: cooking dinner.
VardaValar1
: hmm, does that means she is not a Numenorean?
Eonwe Valar: When you speak to a group who are fans of Lord of the Rings, you better specify when you talk about a ring that is not a Ring of Power :}
ArPharazonV: not a Numenorean... a Numenorea :-)
VardaValar1: : )
ArPharazonV: if I said the Ring, that would be a different matter ;-)
ArPharazonV: and were we not talking about weddingrings?
FINARFIN010: yup
mordacil
: ihow bout Wring for short? or something to clear confusion?
ArPharazonV: wring
ArPharazonV: meh... could work
Eonwe Valar: wring, liuke what Sam wants to do to Gollum's neck? :}
ArPharazonV: w-ring perhaps?
mordacil: sure
ArPharazonV: like the e-ring, the n-ring and the s-ring?
mordacil: o-ring?
FINARFIN010: ring a dong dell-o
ArPharazonV
: bo-ring?
ArPharazonV: st-ring?
FINARFIN010: heheh
VardaValar1
: What was in the stuff you guys were drinking?
FINARFIN010: hic
ArPharazonV
: grog, why?
mordacil: the orc medicine
FINARFIN010: warm grog
Eonwe Valar
: I had an o-ring last week,.. in fact, I had several,.. they taste great with zesty italian dip,.. oh you're not talking about onion rings? :}
FINARFIN010: hehe
mordacil
: they are good though
ArPharazonV: oh, oh, and the sno-ring
ArPharazonV: and the fi-ring
mordacil: conspi-ring?
Eonwe Valar: hi-ring :}
ArPharazonV: and many many more... hmmm, has a -ring to it, I guess
ArPharazonV: glamd-ring!
Eonwe Valar: Ring-il :}
Eonwe Valar: Nauglaf-rin :}
Eonwe Valar: *-ring
FINARFIN010: sp-ring
ArPharazonV
: sp-ring is in the air
mordacil: (bored guilds say the darndest things)
VardaValar1: hehe
VardaValar1: We are in wait mode
VardaValar1: Doing a test on the side
FINARFIN010: how is the test going?
ArPharazonV
: fiiiissshhh... her-ring
VardaValar1: Still going, always a good sign : )
FINARFIN010: ;-)
mordacil: spa-ring
ArPharazonV: sco-ring
ArPharazonV: du-ring
mordacil: ai-ring
ArPharazonV: hea-ring
mordacil: we have a good -ring vocabulary
ArPharazonV: all you need is a verb with -r...
FINARFIN010: spy-ring
ArPharazonV
: da-ring
ArPharazonV: ca-ring
mordacil: admi-ring
ArPharazonV: fa-ring
ArPharazonV: sta-ring
ArPharazonV: lu-ring
ArPharazonV: allu-ring
mordacil: fla-ring
ArPharazonV: ba-ring
VardaValar1: This all started from asking why the White Tree popped up so neatly timed for Aragorn
ArPharazonV: yup, and again I tossed over the entire subject by mentioning I'm rereading...
mordacil: whinch of these many great choices should signify numenorean wedding rings?
ArPharazonV: nume-ring?
ArPharazonV: anyway, I gotta go
ArPharazonV: will be saving transcript now
VardaValar1: Namarie, Phar
VardaValar1: Thanks
VardaValar1: I missed the entire before-meeting
ArPharazonV: yes, I asked FM a question in the before-meeting, which I haven't brought up in the main meeting...
ArPharazonV: ArPharazonV: would you happen to have the lotr-soundtrack on your pc?Musics4Me2: I have the first oneArPharazonV: the fellowship? good...ArPharazonV: ArPharazonV: now I have a questionMusics4Me2: sure......
FINARFIN010: namarie
VardaValar1
: Namarie
ArPharazonV: ArPharazonV: I'm listening to it now, and I've discovered a certain piece of music, from about 1:28 to 1:38 in the flight to the ford
ArPharazonV: ArPharazonV: it sounds very familiar, but I can't really place it in another song...ArPharazonV: do you recognize it from somewhere out of lotr?
mordacil: dosent the ROTK spec ed come out on dec14?
VardaValar1: Yes, in USA
FINARFIN010: afk for a bit
ArPharazonV
: so I'll leave you guys to ponder that question...
mordacil: there are gonna be 14 hr trilogy viewings at many homes
ArPharazonV: perhaps I can read an answer in the rest of the transcript ;-)
ArPharazonV: Namarie... saving.. now
VardaValar1: We suggest buying stock in popcorn
mordacil: by stocks in popcorn too
mordacil: get rich
ArPharazonV: saved
VardaValar1: Thanks Phar
mordacil: ive been waiting to see christopher Lees scene. he was md when they cut it
Eonwe Valar: pardon FInarfin, the book is HoME vol 10, not vol 12
ArPharazonV: Varda, it is sent
mordacil: funny how tolkiens book abbreviations are words
VardaValar1: Don't see it in Gmail
mordacil: BoLT
VardaValar1: sbcglobal?
mordacil: HoME
ArPharazonV: yup
VardaValar1: switching to that
VardaValar1: Got it
VardaValar1: Thanks again, Golden King
ArPharazonV: Namarie
VardaValar1: Namarie
ArPharazonV: "-this is the END. I am going. I am leaving NOW. GOOD-BYE!"
ArPharazonV: -Bilbo, Fellowship of the Ring
ArPharazonV has left the room.
VardaValar1: : )
mordacil: I know less than half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve.
FINARFIN010 has left the room.
Musics4Me2: heh, back again........
VardaValar1: wb
mordacil: ill be leaving now
mordacil: namarie
mordacil has left the room.
VardaValar1: Namarie
GwaihirValar has left the room.
ElatanValar has left the room.
HearNoEvil80 has left the room.
VardaValar1: Turgon is now the Maia Menelvagor!

VardaValar1 has left the room.
TurgonjustTurgon: w00000000t!
Musics4Me2: cool You have just entered room "Valar Guild Meetingplace."

You have just entered room "Valar Guild Meetingplace."
Eonwe Valar: welcome :}
Eonwe Valar: got you in my buddy list :}
Menelvagor Valar: added everyone present here to my list :-)
Eonwe Valar: :}
Eonwe Valar: Take care :}
Eonwe Valar: good night :}
Eonwe Valar has left the room.
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